Author Topic: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!  (Read 164103 times)

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Offline SEMTEX

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Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5725 on: Saturday 29 June 2019, 06:51:12 pm »
How do AEW build up their ppvs at the moment? Was looking at the card and have no idea why the matches are booked as they are. What happend to Golddust teaming up with Cody? Why do randoms team up with tag teams in 3v3 matches and random single wrestlers teaming up in tag team matches?

Mostly YouTube stuff. Cody and Dustin isn’t until their next show. The fight for the fallen iirc.

Offline Carlito

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5726 on: Saturday 29 June 2019, 07:41:55 pm »
:rolleyes:

Maybe let them have a single show before writing them off?

What are you honestly expecting them to do right off the bat? ECW during a major boom period drew 2 million viewers (1/3 of what RAW was doing in 2000) during its peak. TNA drew 2 million viewers during its peak when the business was in decline (half of what RAW was doing in 2011). What exactly are AEW putting in place, creatively speaking, that will make them "change the world" and stand out to a casual audience? I don't think that's an unreasonable question.

WWE's viewership is at an all-time low right now, and they tend to lose half a million plus viewers as RAW is airing live. AEW would be smart to go head-to-head and grab those people who are tuning out of RAW from hour 1 to hour 3, rather than letting them tune into NFL or MLB. If they don't compete, they'll only grab a certain audience - hardcore indie wrestling fans. For all this talk of them rebooting the wars era, it'll just reek of a lack of confidence in their own ability to back it up if they go on Tuesday nights. As a long-time wrestling fan I genuinely hope AEW succeed and out-do RAW because it might give WWE the kick up the arse they have needed for 20 years. However when a nearly 50-year old Jericho is the biggest draw they have, and they're trying to treat it like a real sport instead of a compelling episodic TV show, I just can't see it drawing that many people on a weekly basis.

They're already making a lot of the same mistakes that WCW and TNA made, such as giving active wrestlers creative control, and paying people based on their win/loss records (which is ridiculous because politics will be rife). What's worse, Tony Khan is aiming to appease Dave Meltzer who has always had a ridiculously obvious bias towards Japanese wrestling (which simply doesn't draw that big in the US). The best thing they have done by a mile was hire JR.

That being said, a year is a fair window to see what they can do. If they book things right, and consistently, they could actually gain a million viewers. My point was I can't see their starting point being that high based on what we know.

Offline Conjo

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5727 on: Saturday 29 June 2019, 10:40:57 pm »
:rolleyes:

Maybe let them have a single show before writing them off?

Was thinking about buying the ppv. I don't really like a card full of mixed matches without any meaning behind them so wanted to know if there was any build up to the card. Sounds like maybe All Out at the end of august is a better one to start off with.
Toon Army Norway - www.newutd.no

Offline SEMTEX

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Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5728 on: Saturday 29 June 2019, 11:11:15 pm »
Aye. This and fight for the fallen are definitely the B level PPVs. This one is free in the US also. Aren’t you owwa here?

All Out is the big one.

Offline O'Neill

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5729 on: Sunday 30 June 2019, 01:56:49 am »
:rolleyes:

Maybe let them have a single show before writing them off?

Was thinking about buying the ppv. I don't really like a card full of mixed matches without any meaning behind them so wanted to know if there was any build up to the card. Sounds like maybe All Out at the end of august is a better one to start off with.

Thus far they've shown nothing that is alternative to the WWE product. If anything it's worse but because it's new to most people it's not yet as noticeable.

All you need to do is look at the first match of the last PPV for all the evidence that you need. You had a battle royal for a shot at the most prestigious belt in the company which featured:
A guy painted yellow.
A guy with no legs who lay in the corner most of the match.
A guy with the gimmick of pouring baby oil over himself.
A guy who would be lucky if he weighed 8 stone.
An exotico whose contribution was to do some weird top rope move ramming his arse into Tommy Dreamer's face.
A guy with a staple gun who stapled a cigarette to some other clown's head.
A guy in a dinosaur mask.
A guy wearing jeans who stood with his hands in his pockets casually tapping Tommy Dreamer until he was thrown out.

It was full of indie comedy rubbish that you'd expect to see at a show in a high school gym. What made it all the worse was that they didn't even bring JR out for their first match, who could have possibly explained who some of these people were and why they were in the match. At this point I was already gone. I tuned in because I was being sold on the idea that they were going to put on something like NXT. To my eyes it just looked like TNA/Impact Wrestling.

Looking at tonight's card I wasn't thrilled to see so many gimmick matches. A hardcore match, an unsanctioned match (that'll be a hardcore match then), triangle tag, triple threat women, four-way. It's got that Russo feeling to the booking that there needs to be something totally unique about every match instead of just letting two individuals or teams go out there and do their thing to get over.

I missed the tag match on the pre-show so can't comment but it featured SCU so I imagine it may have been alright. The women's match nobody seemed to care about and the hardcore match with Nakazawa was one of those brutally bad comedy disasters that resulted in me closing the window so I didn't have to watch any more. It made the R-Truth 24/7 title sketches look good.

I get that they are probably going the route of 'something for everyone' and there were things I liked such as Cody vs Dustin, Jericho vs Omega, Adam Page, MJF (was excellent) etc but if I want to watch good wrestling then I'm going to continue watching NXT and not AEW based upon what I've seen thus far. I'm sure others will feel differently and if they enjoy the show with all the silly nonsense elements included then great for them. Maybe the weekly TV will explain more of what's going on and change my mind but for now I'll pass.

Offline Rocker

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5730 on: Sunday 30 June 2019, 06:00:50 am »
Someone listens to Cornette's podcast.  :lol:

Offline Optimistic Nut

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5731 on: Sunday 30 June 2019, 08:50:40 am »
Just seen the chair shot Cody took...ouch.
?s=21

Offline Conjo

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5732 on: Sunday 30 June 2019, 02:22:59 pm »
:rolleyes:

Maybe let them have a single show before writing them off?

Was thinking about buying the ppv. I don't really like a card full of mixed matches without any meaning behind them so wanted to know if there was any build up to the card. Sounds like maybe All Out at the end of august is a better one to start off with.

Thus far they've shown nothing that is alternative to the WWE product. If anything it's worse but because it's new to most people it's not yet as noticeable.

All you need to do is look at the first match of the last PPV for all the evidence that you need. You had a battle royal for a shot at the most prestigious belt in the company which featured:
A guy painted yellow.
A guy with no legs who lay in the corner most of the match.
A guy with the gimmick of pouring baby oil over himself.
A guy who would be lucky if he weighed 8 stone.
An exotico whose contribution was to do some weird top rope move ramming his arse into Tommy Dreamer's face.
A guy with a staple gun who stapled a cigarette to some other clown's head.
A guy in a dinosaur mask.
A guy wearing jeans who stood with his hands in his pockets casually tapping Tommy Dreamer until he was thrown out.

It was full of indie comedy rubbish that you'd expect to see at a show in a high school gym. What made it all the worse was that they didn't even bring JR out for their first match, who could have possibly explained who some of these people were and why they were in the match. At this point I was already gone. I tuned in because I was being sold on the idea that they were going to put on something like NXT. To my eyes it just looked like TNA/Impact Wrestling.

Looking at tonight's card I wasn't thrilled to see so many gimmick matches. A hardcore match, an unsanctioned match (that'll be a hardcore match then), triangle tag, triple threat women, four-way. It's got that Russo feeling to the booking that there needs to be something totally unique about every match instead of just letting two individuals or teams go out there and do their thing to get over.

I missed the tag match on the pre-show so can't comment but it featured SCU so I imagine it may have been alright. The women's match nobody seemed to care about and the hardcore match with Nakazawa was one of those brutally bad comedy disasters that resulted in me closing the window so I didn't have to watch any more. It made the R-Truth 24/7 title sketches look good.

I get that they are probably going the route of 'something for everyone' and there were things I liked such as Cody vs Dustin, Jericho vs Omega, Adam Page, MJF (was excellent) etc but if I want to watch good wrestling then I'm going to continue watching NXT and not AEW based upon what I've seen thus far. I'm sure others will feel differently and if they enjoy the show with all the silly nonsense elements included then great for them. Maybe the weekly TV will explain more of what's going on and change my mind but for now I'll pass.

It looks bad when you present it like that. Not going to argue on that one :lol:

I don't really get the "alternative to the WWE product" arguement though. You would want it to be like WWE, just with better wrestling, better storylines, more freedom for wrestlers to develop their own character. You want to see gimmicks and over the top stuff. If you want to see two normal blokes fight in a classic 1v1 go watch an MMA promotion instead. This is professional wrestling!

Without a platform to create storylines and develop characters I don't really find myself interested in buying any ppv at the moment. Pure in ring wrestling is not enough, so looking forward to their tv show to start.
Toon Army Norway - www.newutd.no

Offline Shearergol

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  • The Dirty Pitchers
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5733 on: Sunday 30 June 2019, 02:52:31 pm »
Just seen the chair shot Cody took...ouch.

No need for that sort of thing these days. Hope they’re not gonna let it creep in.

Offline samptime29

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5734 on: Sunday 30 June 2019, 03:22:25 pm »
Good show overall, but not great. I liked the angle at the end with Omega and Moxley - feels like a big match.

Offline Carlito

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5735 on: Sunday 30 June 2019, 04:26:39 pm »
:rolleyes:

Maybe let them have a single show before writing them off?

Was thinking about buying the ppv. I don't really like a card full of mixed matches without any meaning behind them so wanted to know if there was any build up to the card. Sounds like maybe All Out at the end of august is a better one to start off with.

Thus far they've shown nothing that is alternative to the WWE product. If anything it's worse but because it's new to most people it's not yet as noticeable.

All you need to do is look at the first match of the last PPV for all the evidence that you need. You had a battle royal for a shot at the most prestigious belt in the company which featured:
A guy painted yellow.
A guy with no legs who lay in the corner most of the match.
A guy with the gimmick of pouring baby oil over himself.
A guy who would be lucky if he weighed 8 stone.
An exotico whose contribution was to do some weird top rope move ramming his arse into Tommy Dreamer's face.
A guy with a staple gun who stapled a cigarette to some other clown's head.
A guy in a dinosaur mask.
A guy wearing jeans who stood with his hands in his pockets casually tapping Tommy Dreamer until he was thrown out.

It was full of indie comedy rubbish that you'd expect to see at a show in a high school gym. What made it all the worse was that they didn't even bring JR out for their first match, who could have possibly explained who some of these people were and why they were in the match. At this point I was already gone. I tuned in because I was being sold on the idea that they were going to put on something like NXT. To my eyes it just looked like TNA/Impact Wrestling.

Looking at tonight's card I wasn't thrilled to see so many gimmick matches. A hardcore match, an unsanctioned match (that'll be a hardcore match then), triangle tag, triple threat women, four-way. It's got that Russo feeling to the booking that there needs to be something totally unique about every match instead of just letting two individuals or teams go out there and do their thing to get over.

I missed the tag match on the pre-show so can't comment but it featured SCU so I imagine it may have been alright. The women's match nobody seemed to care about and the hardcore match with Nakazawa was one of those brutally bad comedy disasters that resulted in me closing the window so I didn't have to watch any more. It made the R-Truth 24/7 title sketches look good.

I get that they are probably going the route of 'something for everyone' and there were things I liked such as Cody vs Dustin, Jericho vs Omega, Adam Page, MJF (was excellent) etc but if I want to watch good wrestling then I'm going to continue watching NXT and not AEW based upon what I've seen thus far. I'm sure others will feel differently and if they enjoy the show with all the silly nonsense elements included then great for them. Maybe the weekly TV will explain more of what's going on and change my mind but for now I'll pass.

It looks bad when you present it like that. Not going to argue on that one :lol:

I don't really get the "alternative to the WWE product" arguement though. You would want it to be like WWE, just with better wrestling, better storylines, more freedom for wrestlers to develop their own character. You want to see gimmicks and over the top stuff. If you want to see two normal blokes fight in a classic 1v1 go watch an MMA promotion instead. This is professional wrestling!

Without a platform to create storylines and develop characters I don't really find myself interested in buying any ppv at the moment. Pure in ring wrestling is not enough, so looking forward to their tv show to start.

Bischoff in 1996 had the right idea when he saw how Saturday morning cartoon-based WWF was and how bad business had been since 1993. He decided to go the complete opposite and make it grittier with more true-to-life characters once Hall and Nash came in. Before then, not so much (we still had the Dungeon of Doom, The Shark and Road Block etc :lol:) but at least he still took the initiative and forced WWF's hand.

AEW in my opinion should look into shooting more of the backstage segments like a movie or a TV show and really play into the characters and their surroundings. Get creative with locations which WWE are not doing in the slightest right now. It would be something different to what WWE is doing that could help attract new viewers. They need to take the viewer outside of the arena.

Offline Rocker

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5736 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 07:51:09 am »
Noticeable shift in direction on Raw.  :)




Offline OCK

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5737 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 08:16:47 am »
Are you suggesting Raw was good? Or just not as bad?

Offline Rocker

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5738 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 08:21:34 am »
Are you suggesting Raw was good? Or just not as bad?

Not as bad, which is really good.  :lol:

Offline OCK

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5739 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 09:38:36 am »
 :lol:

I caught up through twitter.

I'M PREGNANT
HOLY s***
LIGHTNING
HEEL

Seems decent enough.

Offline Lenny

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5740 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 10:56:10 am »
Solid episode overall to be fair. Very good intro, decent amount of wrestling, some steady story-line progression and a refreshing payoff to close out the show.

Nothing spectacular, but it's a start.

Offline Mole_Toonfan

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5741 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 12:27:59 pm »
Honestly skimming through Youtube, twitter etc etc :lol: It doesn't seem much different, heel turn was clearly being set up anyway so meh.

Offline TBG

  • King of GIF. WHAT?
  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5742 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 12:34:50 pm »
Aye, after all the positive feedback it would be class if it turned out it was Vince that was in charge last night.

Offline Shearergol

  • General Member
  • The Dirty Pitchers
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5743 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 01:39:08 pm »
Aye, after all the positive feedback it would be class if it turned out it was Vince that was in charge last night.

It was wasn't it? The others don't start until October do they?

Offline Lenny

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5744 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 02:02:01 pm »
Honestly skimming through Youtube, twitter etc etc :lol: It doesn't seem much different, heel turn was clearly being set up anyway so meh.

It's not going to seem totally different immediately, but you're giving them more credit than they deserve of late by assuming that they would follow through on something they've setup on previous weeks (i.e. the Styles angle). A bit of continuity is a good start.

Offline Shearergol

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  • The Dirty Pitchers
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5745 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 03:36:39 pm »
Aye, after all the positive feedback it would be class if it turned out it was Vince that was in charge last night.

It was wasn't it? The others don't start until October do they?

My mistake, it's the new TV stuff that starts in October isn't it.

Offline Rocker

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5746 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 05:05:53 pm »
Aye, after all the positive feedback it would be class if it turned out it was Vince that was in charge last night.

Regardless, it was better than it has been for ages.  :thup:

Offline Carlito

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5747 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 06:10:12 pm »
No way will Vince McMahon be giving up control to anyone, especially those 2 :lol:

Honestly I think Heyman and Bischoff were given those roles to please the networks. McMahon is a control freak.

Offline Shearergol

  • General Member
  • The Dirty Pitchers
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5748 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 07:45:26 pm »
No way will Vince McMahon be giving up control to anyone, especially those 2 :lol:

Honestly I think Heyman and Bischoff were given those roles to please the networks. McMahon is a control freak.

Or to stop AEW hiring them?

Offline Conjo

  • General Member
Re: The Wrestling Thread - TWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
« Reply #5749 on: Tuesday 2 July 2019, 09:22:56 pm »
They said "s***" when the big dudes went through the LED stuff, and before the mixed tag team match they said "bitch"

Attitude era is back  :frantic:
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