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Voting closed: Wednesday 8 April 2015, 02:52:42 PM

Author Topic: UK Politics - The Coalition Years  (Read 673301 times)

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Offline GeordieMessiah

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UK Politics - The Coalition Years
« on: Monday 5 July 2010, 10:51:37 PM »
Thought this was an interesting possible development

Quote
The coalition may end in merger
Published on 05 July 2010 | Spectator

The Con-Lib coalition is far tighter than expected and may even end up merging, writes Fraser Nelson. David Cameron has been generous to the Lib Dems, in both cabinet places and policies. Since then, he has just grown even more generous. For instance, May 2011 has been earmarked as a date for the referendum on the AV voting system. There is an emerging line of thought in Tory circles that coalition is the new future. Cameron's unforced generosity towards the Lib Dems will serve to cement the deal between the two parties. History suggests that the Lib Dems will be split by this coalition, and not the Tories. It is likely that those to the left of the Lib Dems will split off. Cameron could seek to gobble up Clegg and David Laws -- the part of the Lib Dems that can create a common cause with the strong, liberal roots of the Conservatives.

« Last Edit: Thursday 23 July 2015, 04:28:59 PM by BlufPurdi »
Whether it's God or the bomb
It's just the same
It's only fear under another name
And the corporate snakes coming in to feed
On that pathetic fact known as human greed
Skin and bone being raked over those hot coals
This dump never seems to give time for human soul

Offline QBG

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #1 on: Monday 5 July 2010, 10:53:01 PM »
Ed Balls just came across as an idiot on Newsnight but that's hardly anything new.

Offline madras

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #2 on: Monday 5 July 2010, 10:55:33 PM »
this sort of thing was mentioned as soon as the coalition was made official. it would seem more like the tories swallowing some of the liberals, labour some and one or two radicals joining the liberal party.
Bullshitters misrepresent themselves to their audience not as liars do, that is, by deliberately making false claims about what is true. In fact, bullshit need not be untrue at all.

Rather, bullshitters seek to convey a certain impression of themselves without being concerned about whether anything at all is true. They quietly change the rules governing their end of the conversation so that claims about truth and falsity are irrelevant.

Offline GeordieMessiah

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #3 on: Monday 5 July 2010, 11:04:47 PM »
Ed Balls just came across as an idiot on Newsnight but that's hardly anything new.

God help the Labour Party if they elect him.

Come to think of it, they're all godawful candidates. They're f***ed.
Whether it's God or the bomb
It's just the same
It's only fear under another name
And the corporate snakes coming in to feed
On that pathetic fact known as human greed
Skin and bone being raked over those hot coals
This dump never seems to give time for human soul

Offline LucaAltieri

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #4 on: Monday 5 July 2010, 11:07:36 PM »
Power corrupts; absolute power turns you tory.

Offline QBG

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #5 on: Monday 5 July 2010, 11:08:11 PM »
Ed Balls just came across as an idiot on Newsnight but that's hardly anything new.

God help the Labour Party if they elect him.

Come to think of it, they're all godawful candidates. They're f***ed.

Aye Dave Milliband might be able to do a half decent job, best of a bad bunch. Balls is just clueless.

Offline Incognito

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 14 July 2010, 07:22:38 PM »
Harman pwned Cameron today at PMQ.Next week should be even better as Clegg deputises for Cambelt.
RIP gejon/cajun/ Jon Lockwood.

Proud to have made your acquaintance Sir.

Offline James

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 14 July 2010, 07:42:10 PM »
Harman pwned Cameron today at PMQ.Next week should be even better as Clegg deputises for Cambelt.

I thought Hague deputises, and Clegg gets his own monthly DPMQ
I looked into the eye of the Island and what I saw was beautiful.

Offline Incognito

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 14 July 2010, 08:14:02 PM »
Nope Clegg is deputy dawg and deputises at PMQ.
RIP gejon/cajun/ Jon Lockwood.

Proud to have made your acquaintance Sir.

Offline Tooj

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 14 July 2010, 09:47:17 PM »


Clegg once again proving he's completely sold his soul.
"Elsewhere, at worst, modern commercial football could be seen as the mall rather than the circus; insidiously bland, decaffeinated and pre-packed, its relentless formulaic repetition an instrument for disabling consciousness rather than manipulating it."

David Goldblatt

Offline GeordieMessiah

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 14 July 2010, 09:55:41 PM »


Clegg once again proving he's completely sold his soul.

Those words will soon be home to roost.... :hmm:

I curse myself for voting for them, even if it was tactical voting. Yuck.
Whether it's God or the bomb
It's just the same
It's only fear under another name
And the corporate snakes coming in to feed
On that pathetic fact known as human greed
Skin and bone being raked over those hot coals
This dump never seems to give time for human soul

Offline Jackie Broon

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 14 July 2010, 09:56:35 PM »
Ed Balls just came across as an idiot on Newsnight but that's hardly anything new.

God help the Labour Party if they elect him.

Come to think of it, they're all godawful candidates. They're f***ed.

Aye Dave Milliband might be able to do a half decent job, best of a bad bunch. Balls is just clueless.

This government is going to make a god-awful mess, Labour could re-elect Brown and still walk the next election once the reality of how nuts this government are comes to light.

I work in town planning. The coalition are proposing to rush through a new planning bill this parliamentary session with the largest changes to the planning system since its inception in the 1940s. They're proposing massive sweeping changes which will include:

A significant increase the role of councillors in all decisions (possibly even having parish council boards determining applications and forming planning policy).

Removal of the rights of independent appeal (most appeal decision being made by the same councillors that refused the application in the first place).

Removal the right of apply for retrospective planning permission. (Apart from the fact that it is morally wrong given that the right to develop land was nationalised in the 1940s with the ethos that it would not be unreasonably withheld. This will leave people who have made honest mistakes or been miss-advised in limbo and could prove very costly for councils if they have to enforce against a lot of otherwise perfectly acceptable developments)

The proposals are being met by pretty much universal bewilderment and condemnation from both planners and developers. The planning system will pretty much grind to a halt and very little will get built. It'll be a NIMBY's paradise, a giant mess that will restrict growth, it's quite frankly insane. It clearly hasn't been thought through at all and I suspect the same is true of many of the other sweeping changes planned in other areas of government.

They are going to crash and burn!

Offline Liam Liam Liam O

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 14 July 2010, 10:00:42 PM »


Clegg once again proving he's completely sold his soul.

Those words will soon be home to roost.... :hmm:

I curse myself for voting for them, even if it was tactical voting. Yuck.

Do you wish you'd voted differently, or not at all?

Offline GeordieMessiah

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 14 July 2010, 10:10:07 PM »


Clegg once again proving he's completely sold his soul.

Those words will soon be home to roost.... :hmm:

I curse myself for voting for them, even if it was tactical voting. Yuck.

Do you wish you'd voted differently, or not at all?

If I'd known then, what I know now, i.e. I'd known what would happen regarding the Coalition...I really wouldn't have placed my cross there, I have to say. Mind you, it made no real difference in the end as Labour kept this seat with a reduced majority.
Whether it's God or the bomb
It's just the same
It's only fear under another name
And the corporate snakes coming in to feed
On that pathetic fact known as human greed
Skin and bone being raked over those hot coals
This dump never seems to give time for human soul

Offline Allmo

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 12:58:58 AM »


Clegg once again proving he's completely sold his soul.

Those words will soon be home to roost.... :hmm:

I curse myself for voting for them, even if it was tactical voting. Yuck.

Do you wish you'd voted differently, or not at all?

If I'd known then, what I know now, i.e. I'd known what would happen regarding the Coalition...I really wouldn't have placed my cross there, I have to say. Mind you, it made no real difference in the end as Labour kept this seat with a reduced majority.

I'm with you on that. I voted Lib Dems because they ticked most of the boxes policy wise and thought they would seriously push for PR. Instead they sold out.

I do believe the Lib-Con coalition is going a hell of a lot better than I thought it would, but I still feel betrayed by the Libs and will definitely not be voting for them in the next General Election, if they're still about that is.

Offline Incognito

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 01:06:44 AM »
This coalition is destroying the social fabric of this country,all in the name of the deficit,and you think they're doing well?
RIP gejon/cajun/ Jon Lockwood.

Proud to have made your acquaintance Sir.

Offline bulivye

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 01:21:07 AM »
i keep getting these sorts of mass emails--what you lot make of the following:
THE END OF BRITAIN AS WE KNOW IT

By DICK MORRIS & EILEEN MCGANN

Published on DickMorris.com on July 12, 2010

The United Kingdom, the mother of all democracies, is about to change its political system in fundamental ways - changes which will spell disaster for the nation and for its politics.  For those who love Britain, the news of these impending alterations can only cause angst and distress.
   
As a result of the inability of either the Conservatives or Labor to win a majority in Parliament in the recent elections, both parties had to bid for support from the Liberal/Social Democratic Party.  The price the Conservatives ultimately paid was to agree to some of these changes and to refer others to the electorate for a referendum.
   
The changes that the parties have agreed to will transform the British government from a decisive decision-making machine into a morass of compromise, half-measures, and deadlock.  Gridlock will be exported across the ocean to the UK.
   
Right now, the Prime Minister can dissolve Parliament anytime he wants forcing new elections.  He is also obliged to order new elections if he loses a vote of confidence.  This power holds the members of his parliamentary majority in check and restrains them from turning on their leaders since, should they succeed in a vote of no confidence, it would plunge them into the uncertainty of a new election which would imperil their own seats. 

The new rules would bar the Prime Minister from dissolving Parliament during its five year term and vest that right in a 2/3 majority of parliament.  In other words, Parliament would have to vote itself out of office - something likely never to happen.
       
So, under the new rules, if a government loses a vote over a major legislative item -- or fails to survive a no-confidence motion - it must resign, but there need not be new elections.  Instead, Parliament can refuse to order new elections and just re-form a new government out of the old Parliament.
       
The effect of this rule change is likely to be that governments will rise and fall all the time since they may do so without forcing members to face new elections.  Like in Italy, the new governments will just be formed by reshuffling the current Parliamentary deck into new combinations and coalitions. 
   
Whereas now, if a government falls there is an election to decide the issue; under the new procedure, the deadlock could just go on and on without resolution.
   
More dangerous is the proposed new voting system that must be approved by a popular referendum.  Rather than vote for one candidate for Parliament in each district, voters will be obliged to rank the candidates in their order of preference.  If nobody gets a majority of first place rankings, the candidate with the least votes drops off and his second place votes are distributed among the other remaining candidates.  The Liberal/Social Democrats are pushing this change in the hopes that there may never again be a Parliamentary majority for the Conservatives or Labor and that they will always hold the balance of power in a hung parliament.

And they are likely to achieve their objective if the new voting system passes.  Most districts in the UK, as in the US, tend either to the left or to the right. 

In a leftist district, for example, the Labor Party usually finishes first, the Liberal/Social Democrats second, and the Conservatives third.  If the Labor candidate did not win a majority of first place votes on Election Day - and they frequently don't - the Conservative candidate will drop off and his second place votes will determine the winner.  But what Conservative voter is going to name Labor as his second choice in the polarized politics of the U.K.?  Most will name the Liberal/Social Dems as their second choice and that candidate will win the seat.   In right wing districts, the same process will happen in reverse again to the benefit of the Liberal/Social Dems.

That means more hung parliaments, less decisive election results, and more mush compromise.   Together, these changes will tend to paralyze the British government, substituting muddled, mushy compromise for decisive and bold action.  We will miss the old United Kingdom.
altogether elsewhere vast
herds of reindeer move across
miles and miles of golden moss
silently and very fast

Offline Allmo

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #17 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 01:36:18 AM »
This coalition is destroying the social fabric of this country,all in the name of the deficit,and you think they're doing well?

I didn't say it was doing well. I said it was doing better than I thought it would. There have been a lot more concessions for the Libs than I thought there would have been. They're not selling out ALL their policies which I'm putting down to the likes of Vince Cable.

Also do you not think 'destroying the social fabric of the country' a tad over the top? They are making cuts in areas I oppose, but society isn't falling to pieces over it. 

Offline Incognito

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #18 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 02:23:22 AM »
How can not rebuilding schools,not be destroying the social fabric.Construction companies will go to the wall and this has a knock on effect,unemployment wise.
As far as I can see the LibDems have achieved nowt but a referendum on the weakest kind of PR which your masters will vehemently oppose and campaign against.
The only good thing thats come out of this is the immminent disappearance of the Libdems.f***ing fraudsters.
RIP gejon/cajun/ Jon Lockwood.

Proud to have made your acquaintance Sir.

Offline mrmojorisin75

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #19 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 06:07:03 AM »
studied politics for 3 years and concluded at the end it's all a load of f***ing s***, you can quote me on that

1. a large number of people are very stupid/uninformed and aren't in a position to understand the implications of their actions/vote
2. politicians are essentially out for themselves on some level and will exploit #1 to benefit themselves and/or their party
3. the Tories will do nothing to directly benefit people who have the least in this country, if something happens as a side effect then great but otherwise people are an afterthought for them vs. big business

pretty much all you need to know about UK politics, applies elsewhere of course too
So raise your fists and march around
Dont dare take what you need
I'll jail and bury those committed
And smother the rest in greed
Crawl with me into tomorrow
Or i'll drag you to your grave
I'm deep inside your children
They'll betray you in my name

Sleep now in the fire

Offline Allmo

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #20 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 03:21:30 PM »
How can not rebuilding schools,not be destroying the social fabric.Construction companies will go to the wall and this has a knock on effect,unemployment wise.
As far as I can see the LibDems have achieved nowt but a referendum on the weakest kind of PR which your masters will vehemently oppose and campaign against.
The only good thing thats come out of this is the immminent disappearance of the Libdems.f***ing fraudsters.

Like I've said they're making cuts in area I highly oppose, but your making out like there will be anarchy in the streets when they go ahead with some of their deficit reducing policies. Indeed people will be made unemployed as was always the case with making cuts and kids will be taught in shitter class rooms, but 'destroying the social fabric'? Give over man.

Offline Incognito

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #21 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 04:30:22 PM »
They're creating a bigger divide between rich and poor man,re-establishing their beloved class system.
Of course they're destroying the social fabric.
And I'll wager they'll be riots on the streets when it kicks in,and not just bandwagon charvas.
RIP gejon/cajun/ Jon Lockwood.

Proud to have made your acquaintance Sir.

Offline Thomson Mouse

  • General Member
Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #22 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 05:56:53 PM »
They're creating a bigger divide between rich and poor man,re-establishing their beloved class system.
Of course they're destroying the social fabric.
And I'll wager they'll be riots on the streets when it kicks in,and not just bandwagon charvas.

Not unlike Tony Thatcher. 

Love how the original article is written by Fraser Nelson - the NOTW columnist  :iamatwat:

The Tories will f*** over a lot of things, but make sure you're not sick over the next 5 years because the NHS is going to get royally f***ed over to the point where our health as a nation will return to the Thatcher years.
The white paper they have written is scary beyond belief, but I love how they justify it with spin like quangoes etc.
It'll be ok for Cameron though, he'll be too scared to send his children to an NHS hospital.
People should not be afraid of their governments, governments should be afraid of their people.

Offline Incognito

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #23 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 07:33:06 PM »
I actually believe that Tony Blair did a lot of good for this country.
RIP gejon/cajun/ Jon Lockwood.

Proud to have made your acquaintance Sir.

Offline GeordieMessiah

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Re: UK Politics: Conservatives win majority, everyone else resigns
« Reply #24 on: Thursday 15 July 2010, 07:49:41 PM »
I actually believe that Tony Blair did a lot of good for this country.

Whether it's God or the bomb
It's just the same
It's only fear under another name
And the corporate snakes coming in to feed
On that pathetic fact known as human greed
Skin and bone being raked over those hot coals
This dump never seems to give time for human soul