Author Topic: Sam Allardyce  (Read 105443 times)

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Offline Keefaz

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #100 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:18:14 PM »
I'm honestly not sure what Ronaldo is arguing here.

Offline Doctor Zaius

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #101 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:19:07 PM »
As much as I hate him and his fat heed he's got a point. When he took them over about a year and a bit ago they were 2nd bottom. They're now 12th and have reached the semi finals of a cup competition. What are they're complaining about? They're making progress ffs!

However that dosent go to say his time here wasnt a disaster, I dont mind Long ball football IF it works but using Alan Smith as a target man was never ever going to work. He came here and tried to use his tactics from Bolton, that would have been fine if we had the palyers to implement it, but we blatently didnt, I mean he didnt even attempt to buy players to suit his tactics, Rozenhal, Geremi and Barton arnt players you would expect to see him buying if he wants to play the phsyical long ball game. I doubt he would have taken us down but but we were getting sucked into a relegation battle and you could see the players had lost all confidence and morale, hence in my opinion why we got stuffed off Man utd and it took Keegan 10 games or whatever to win a game.


Offline Frazzle

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #102 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:19:44 PM »
That's not the discussion here though, we all know Keegan wouldn't have taken us down.

So sacking Allardyce wasn't a mistake then (your original argument) it was getting rid of Keegan.  Otherwise you could just as well say that sacking Roeder was a mistake because we got relegated 2 seasons later, the logic doesn't work.

We genuinely improved under Allardyce though.

Again, I'm not sure how this is relevant to your argument.  We were improving under Keegan as well and more quickly than under Allardyce.

None is that is really relevant to the argument that sacking Allardyce was a mistake, as I said, we didn't get relegated because we sacked Allardyce, it's because we didn't stick with a replacement for more than a couple of months.  Otherwise, using your logic, as I said, you may just as well say sacking Roeder was a mistake because we got relegated fairly soon afterwards.

Offline Atticus

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #103 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:20:22 PM »
I'm honestly not sure what Ronaldo is arguing here.

Same s***, different day.

Your signature is fantastic btw, got a chuckle out of me.

Offline Ronaldo

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #104 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:21:10 PM »
What's your point?

We got most of our points under Allardyce that season, to suggest Keegan saved us wrong.

firetotheworks

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #105 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:21:18 PM »
I'm honestly not sure what Ronaldo is arguing here.

 :lol:

Welcome to Ronaldo.

Offline Keefaz

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #106 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:22:18 PM »
I'm honestly not sure what Ronaldo is arguing here.

 :lol:

Welcome to Ronaldo.

Sometimes he argues what he feels is right and I respect him for that, but other times he just seems to be like one of those girls who starts arguments for the sake of it.

Offline Ronaldo

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #107 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:22:42 PM »
That's not the discussion here though, we all know Keegan wouldn't have taken us down.

So sacking Allardyce wasn't a mistake then (your original argument) it was getting rid of Keegan.  Otherwise you could just as well say that sacking Roeder was a mistake because we got relegated 2 seasons later, the logic doesn't work.

We genuinely improved under Allardyce though.

that is the worst arguement i've ever heard, improved we looked better with roeder

 :lol:

Offline Frazzle

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #108 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:24:58 PM »
What's your point?

We got most of our points under Allardyce that season, to suggest Keegan saved us wrong.

I'm not saying that.  ???  I'm saying you can't say: "In the grand scheme of things, it was a mistake getting rid of Allardyce because we got relegated 16 months later" as it is logically inaccurate.  All I'm saying is that the Allardyce sacking wasn't the problem it's the fact that we didn't stick with his replacement.

Offline Paully

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #109 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:25:00 PM »
What's your point?

We got most of our points under Allardyce that season, to suggest Keegan saved us wrong.

Allardyce had a p*ss easy start to the season.
Allardyce went to Derby and played for a draw.
Allardyce has no plan B bar throwing a big lad up top.
Allardyce is a fat-headed managerial fraud.

Offline eddco

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #110 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:25:32 PM »
Sacking Allardyce is the only thing I can give Mike Ashley a  :clap: for!!!

firetotheworks

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #111 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:27:15 PM »
Sacking Allardyce is the only thing I can give Mike Ashley a  :clap: for!!!

YOWZAH!  :cheesy:

Offline Doctor Zaius

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #112 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:28:14 PM »
Come on, to say Keegan didnt turn things around is silly. It's bleeding obvious that we started playing better football under Keegan and thus eventually started winning games. Allardyce had a tough run of games to come before he was sacked and we wern't too far off the drop as it was. I'm all for showing faith and getting behind our managers but Allardyce simply had to go, it's weather Keegan despite turning it around was the right man to replace him is the real question.

firetotheworks

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #113 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:29:49 PM »
Come on, to say Keegan didnt turn things around is silly. It's bleeding obvious that we started playing better football under Keegan and thus eventually started winning games. Allardyce had a tough run of games to come before he was sacked and we wern't too far off the drop as it was. I'm all for showing faith and getting behind our managers but Allardyce simply had to go, it's weather Keegan despite turning it around was the right man to replace him is the real question.


Not when we're talking about whether Allardyce would have got us relegated.

Offline Ronaldo

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #114 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:29:51 PM »
Sacking Allardyce let us to what some of us felt at the time was a very risky managerial appoinment for all the reasons that were vindicated 9 months later.

I hate Allardyce as a manager and love Keegan. But the sacking of Allardyce cannot be called anything but a mistake imo because of the timing and the fact we didn't improve at all in terms of picking up points.

Offline Teasy

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #115 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:32:28 PM »
I have to admit I never thought Allardyce was taking us down, even as s**** as we were under him and however much I hate him now. We'd have ground out enough points to survive IMO. Don't forget that when he went we were in 11th position on 26 points; 9 above the relegation zone: http://www.statto.com/football/stats/england/premier-league/2007-2008/table/2008-01-02

In true Ronaldo style I can confirm I posted the same when we sacked him too. :razz:

Still though we were in 11th due to a good start that had papered over a lot of cracks.  A comparatively easy early run and the fact that he hadn't had enough time to entirely destroy every bit of our players Footballing souls meant we got 17 points from our first 9 games.  We only got 9 points for our next 12 though and if anything we were getting worse and worse rather then better.  IMO we'd either have scraped through by a point or two, or went down had he stayed.
Rage and love, story of my life.  The Jesus of Suburbia is a lie.

Offline Mowen

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #116 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:35:27 PM »
Sacking Allardyce let us to what some of us felt at the time was a very risky managerial appoinment for all the reasons that were vindicated 9 months later.

I hate Allardyce as a manager and love Keegan. But the sacking of Allardyce cannot be called anything but a mistake imo because of the timing and the fact we didn't improve at all in terms of picking up points.

Overall points no, but we were a much, much better team at the end of the season with much better prospects for the next year. Pretty much everyone who was in that team had their best ever spell for us in that final 10 or so games including the likes of Owen, Viduka, Geremi, Butt, Faye, Harper and possibly Martins too. It was a significantly more capable side than that which Keegan inherited. Shame the owner was such a fuckwit after that.
Under-21 coach David Platt added: "If Shola recognises what he's got, all hell could break loose."

Offline Ronaldo

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #117 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:37:32 PM »
Does anybody on here actually think that Allardyce would have taken us down in 08-09 with the squad we actually had that season?

Offline Mick

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #118 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:38:16 PM »
I think we would have gone down it we'd kept Allardyce, we had a nightmare set of games coming up and our players had zero confidence and he was never going to give them a lift.  I can't remember a single player who was performing for him at the end and we had a few away playing in Africa so we were down on numbers.
"Hello, Bobby," he once greeted his England captain, Bryan Robson.

"I'm Bryan," the skipper replied. "You're Bobby."

Offline Mick

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #119 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:41:21 PM »
Does anybody on here actually think that Allardyce would have taken us down in 08-09 with the squad we actually had that season?

No, he would have done it a year earlier.
"Hello, Bobby," he once greeted his England captain, Bryan Robson.

"I'm Bryan," the skipper replied. "You're Bobby."

Offline Thespence

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #120 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:41:31 PM »
Does anybody on here actually think that Allardyce would have taken us down in 08-09 with the squad we actually had that season?

Most people are thinking he would of took us down in 07-08. Just had a look at the table & we were not that far away points wise in 07-08.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007%E2%80%9308_Premier_League
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Offline LoveItIfWeBeatU

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #121 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:41:39 PM »
Games under Allardyce made everyone hate watching Newcastle. "We're s*** and we're sick of it!" was the chant. Would we have been relegated? Who knows? Nobody knows if we would have been or not for sure. We never got to find out. At least under Keegan people got to enjoy watching football again.
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Win, Lose or Draw. NOT "Loose"!

Offline Mowen

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #122 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:44:20 PM »
Does anybody on here actually think that Allardyce would have taken us down in 08-09 with the squad we actually had that season?

Probably not but it's hard to tell. We were in freefall and had had a very easy start to the season, iirc after 19 games we'd played Wigan and Derby twice and were yet to play ManU. It was unlikely but far from impossible, and we'd have been in a scrap - to assert that we'd have no chance of having gone down would be ridiculous. Pretty much how I felt in January last year then. The players weren't playing for him, the fans were sick of what was going on and the whole club had gone a bit sour.

Having said all that I didn't want him sacked at the time.
Under-21 coach David Platt added: "If Shola recognises what he's got, all hell could break loose."

toonlass

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #123 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:45:29 PM »
Allardyce sounded like a whiny, bitter little man with his comments tonight. Shut up you big jessie. Blackburn are s****, and don't deserve a Wembley final.

Offline Ronaldo

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Re: Sam Allardyce confirmed as England manager
« Reply #124 on: Wednesday 20 January 2010, 10:50:03 PM »
Does anybody on here actually think that Allardyce would have taken us down in 08-09 with the squad we actually had that season?

Most people are thinking he would of took us down in 07-08. Just had a look at the table & we were not that far away points wise in 07-08.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007%E2%80%9308_Premier_League

We got about 26 of those points under Allardyce though.