Topic: Takeover Thread - NUFC confirm legal proceedings

[The Prophet]

I'd say the 'news' today doesn't give any reason to be positive or negative. It's just the same sources making the same noises they have been for weeks.

[godzilla]

Is this one for the Mauriss takeover?

In his simple mind he thinks so, let's say the takeover is knocked back; there will be an appeal and then a court case to follow before any bid can be even agreed. Not very bright is Mr Edwards, unless he actually thinks the Saudi bid will win (somehow I don't think he does)

What evidence is there to suggest that there'd be a court case ?
Would there even be grounds for taking it to court?
It's the PL's O&D test, it's not British law to the best of my knowledge. If the buyers fail it,and then are unsuccessful with their appeal, then it's basically tough s*** isn't it ?

Do you know how many civil cases are taken to court by businesses each year? If the consortium feel (rightly) that they have evidence to show that they have been disqualified due to something outside the remit of the O&D test then they most certainly can and will.

[Bishops Finger]

This s*** needs to end soon like. Totally drained with it all now. Im expecting the worst tbh. Nothing good ever happens to this club apart from the few good years we had with King Kev and Sir Bobby. I think that's going to be the only good memories I'll have of the club. I can't even call it my club anymore. Ashley has sucked the life out of it.
This is the only chance we have of seeing this club challenging the top teams. Anyone else that comes in will be doing it for profit only, and as Ashley has already stripped the club of all assets then how will they do it.
I'm finished with football completely when this takeover fails. I just can't watch another season of Bruceball (clueless t***)
Just put us out of our misery PL ffs. Let us move on and at least get back to some kind of reality instead of dreaming of what we could be. This is going to be one hell of a comedown

[Wandy]

People need to give it a rest with the "there will be a legal battle if it fails" bollocks. There will be no legal repercussions. All parties will say nothing and try to pretend that the whole farce never happened, allowing it to fizzle out with barely a murmur of complant. Meanwhile we will be left to pick up the pieces once again.

I get why people keep peddling the legal action line. Its because they feel that someone, somewhere needs to pay a price for making us fans suffer like this. But its not going to happen. Unfortunately we are the ones who will be in bits about this and all of the other parties will just walk away with a shrug.

Absolutely no way it fizzles out with the current state of play between Qatar and Saudi. Whoever gets the outcome they favour will immediately spin it as a victory.

I was referring to the fact that it will fizzle out for us as fans who hoped for a takeover. Political tensions will rumble on between SA and Qatar but that will no longer have any relevance for us.

[duo]

Feels like we have been pawns in a game and the joke is on us.

[Sir Toon]

Another day another twist. Tomorrow the cans will be oot again no doubt

[Jackie Broon]

Is this one for the Mauriss takeover?

In his simple mind he thinks so, let's say the takeover is knocked back; there will be an appeal and then a court case to follow before any bid can be even agreed. Not very bright is Mr Edwards, unless he actually thinks the Saudi bid will win (somehow I don't think he does)

What evidence is there to suggest that there'd be a court case ?
Would there even be grounds for taking it to court?
It's the PL's O&D test, it's not British law to the best of my knowledge. If the buyers fail it,and then are unsuccessful with their appeal, then it's basically tough s*** isn't it ?

I think they could possibly take it to the Court for Arbitration for Sport.

Pure speculation but I suspect what may be happening is that the decision has been put before the PL board with a recommendation to approve at least once but the board hasn't agreed, due to their concerns over the piracy issue for which there is most likely no legally sound basis for refusal based on. That could explain the times when it was confidently reported that a positive decision was about to be made.

If the board were to actually refuse the O&D test they could appeal. The appeal would be heard by an appeal panel which would be appointed by a legally qualified chairman, rather than the PL board who make the initial decision and, whilst I'm not sure of the make-up of the board, may not be in any way qualified to be making decisions on points of law.

[Wilson]

One of the reasons I've lost hope in this happening, is godzillas unflinching confidence.

[manorpark]

Still seen very little to suggest it won't go through. I can't wait until we're filthy rich.

Your continued optimism is what keeps me going tbh

No idea where you get it from.

Same place as me!

Truth is, great news will be coming soon, meanwhile . . .

C A L M.

[Wandy]

Can't wait to hear Penn's thoughts on this latest development. 

[Consortium of one]

I wonder what Barry Moat is doing these days...

[Armchair Pundit]

Another day another twist. Tomorrow the cans will be oot again no doubt

Wednesday's letter day isn't it? Some new evidence surfacing or objection from Hatice.

[KaKa]

Who was the original bunch Staveley tried to buy the club with?

Get those jokers back in man. This is ridiculous. Really don't think PIF succeed with this now.

[Scoot]

I've been positive all along but all these noises got me convinced its not getting approved.

[madras]

Page 2 already  ffs

[Raconteur]

Is this one for the Mauriss takeover?

In his simple mind he thinks so, let's say the takeover is knocked back; there will be an appeal and then a court case to follow before any bid can be even agreed. Not very bright is Mr Edwards, unless he actually thinks the Saudi bid will win (somehow I don't think he does)

What evidence is there to suggest that there'd be a court case ?
Would there even be grounds for taking it to court?
It's the PL's O&D test, it's not British law to the best of my knowledge. If the buyers fail it,and then are unsuccessful with their appeal, then it's basically tough s*** isn't it ?

Do you know how many civil cases are taken to court by businesses each year? If the consortium feel (rightly) that they have evidence to show that they have been disqualified due to something outside the remit of the O&D test then they most certainly can and will.

Have you read the O&D test recently?

It seems pretty obvious that the PIF/PCP/RB bid can (and possibly should) fail the O&D test as written.

It seems equally obvious that the PL don't want to do that - because if they did, they would have done it four months ago.

The consortium is being given the opportunity to rectify the issues related to piracy. Whether the take that opportunity or not remains to be seen.

[Mag_in_NZ]

One of the reasons I've lost hope in this happening, is godzillas unflinching confidence.

One of the reasons I've still got hope in this happening, is godzillas and HTT’s unflinching confidence.

[Raconteur]

By the way, I think I have found a definitive answer to the answer about "What happens if the bid is rejected?" Well, the first phase...

The Premier League Handbook lists all the "rules" of the league. It's fascinating reading - and can be found here https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5e4c2e3b55f49e2eb34df4d9/t/5ed50a94aba8826769043841/1591020239522/PL+Handbook+-+27+May+2020.pdf

Page 67 of that pdf (pages 125-126 of the handbook) lists the appeal process for someone who is disqualified from being a director (and elsewhere it confirms that "disqualification" means "failed on initial application", not just existing directors)

Spoiler

[close]

[Kanji]

I’m on team manor park.

[godzilla]

Is this one for the Mauriss takeover?

In his simple mind he thinks so, let's say the takeover is knocked back; there will be an appeal and then a court case to follow before any bid can be even agreed. Not very bright is Mr Edwards, unless he actually thinks the Saudi bid will win (somehow I don't think he does)

What evidence is there to suggest that there'd be a court case ?
Would there even be grounds for taking it to court?
It's the PL's O&D test, it's not British law to the best of my knowledge. If the buyers fail it,and then are unsuccessful with their appeal, then it's basically tough s*** isn't it ?

Do you know how many civil cases are taken to court by businesses each year? If the consortium feel (rightly) that they have evidence to show that they have been disqualified due to something outside the remit of the O&D test then they most certainly can and will.

Have you read the O&D test recently?

It seems pretty obvious that the PIF/PCP/RB bid can (and possibly should) fail the O&D test as written.

It seems equally obvious that the PL don't want to do that - because if they did, they would have done it four months ago.

The consortium is being given the opportunity to rectify the issues related to piracy. Whether the take that opportunity or not remains to be seen.

Yes I have thank you. Read my answer again explaining that the premier League can be taken to court by the consortium (once the appeal process has been undertaken) if they feel that they have been disqualified due to events outside of the D&O test, which is what I was stating that they can. They could do this even with events within the D&O test if they feel they have the evidence to support this and that the decision was made incorrectly. That's what the courts are there for (civil as not criminal offence), and as mentioned above was administered recently by the Court of Sport Arbitration between Man City and UEFA.

Let's entertain you though about the piracy, please show me one bit of evidence (including the WTO Report) where it states that either the state of KSA or PIF are directly responsible for the transmission of the piracy streams. They were concluded by the same report as being responsible for not doing enough to stop the streams, but that is a totally different to being directly responsible. The WTO Report also concluded that it was the states right to do this under TRIPS. KSA Minister of Sport has now taken steps to address this by the statements made a couple of weeks ago. Obvious has nothing to do with anything you need evidence to back that up.

The issue now which is being reported as the problem is due to KSA banning beIN from providing network coverage within Saudi Arabia. This is NOT part of the D&O test and as such is an event outside of the remit.

[Charlies]

Its still on 100%

[Sean]

People need to give it a rest with the "there will be a legal battle if it fails" bollocks. There will be no legal repercussions. All parties will say nothing and try to pretend that the whole farce never happened, allowing it to fizzle out with barely a murmur of complant. Meanwhile we will be left to pick up the pieces once again.

I get why people keep peddling the legal action line. Its because they feel that someone, somewhere needs to pay a price for making us fans suffer like this. But its not going to happen. Unfortunately we are the ones who will be in bits about this and all of the other parties will just walk away with a shrug.

This. And as Ben Jacobs put in one of his tweets "Sometimes I think NUFC fans just want to hear 'it's happening' regardless of truth/context" - we even had people claiming the Saudis banning Bein was positive news ffs.

When you realise that Staveley's track record isn't very good, and that she has been the only one confident of this happening, then sadly this falling though has looked the most likely outcome for a while now.

[chopey]

The Saudis refused Bein sports the rights to the Joshua fight, so protracted negotiations took place and a company called Fightsportmax jumped in and showed the fight for $5 in loads of middle east and Scandinavian countries.

Masters is concerned that both Sky and BT will not pay big for the TV rights next time around and it took ages for Amazon to pick up the last package (apparently at a reduced rate) the premier league need maximum cash from the next TV deal the Saudis can and will provide that through a new or existing channel just like the boxing and like the boxing, Bahrain, Jordon, Lebanon, UAE, Egypt and others will follow suit.

[Raconteur]

Yes I have thank you. Read my answer again explaining that the premier League can be taken to court by the consortium (once the appeal process has been undertaken) if they feel that they have been disqualified due to events outside of the D&O test, which is what I was stating that they can. They could do this even with events within the D&O test if they feel they have the evidence to support this and that the decision was made incorrectly. That's what the courts are there for (civil as not criminal offence), and as mentioned above was administered recently by the Court of Sport Arbitration between Man City and UEFA.

Let's entertain you though about the piracy, please show me one bit of evidence (including the WTO Report) where it states that either the state of KSA or PIF are directly responsible for the transmission of the piracy streams. They were concluded by the same report as being responsible for not doing enough to stop the streams, but that is a totally different to being directly responsible. The WTO Report also concluded that it was the states right to do this under TRIPS. KSA Minister of Sport has now taken steps to address this by the statements made a couple of weeks ago. Obvious has nothing to do with anything you need evidence to back that up.

The issue now which is being reported as the problem is due to KSA banning beIN from providing network coverage within Saudi Arabia. This is NOT part of the D&O test and as such is an event outside of the remit.

I don't believe you when you say you have read the test.

If you had, you would know the bolded part is immaterial.

Firstly, this fixation that PIF need to be directly tied to piracy is fallacious. The O&D Director test applies to not just PIF/PCP/RB directorial nominees, it applies to anyone whom the PL believes can exert influence (direct or indirect) over the club. Like so:

“Control” means  the  power  of  a  Person  to  exercise,  or  to  be  able  to  exercise  or acquire, direct or indirect control over the policies, affairs and/or management of a Club, whether that power is constituted by rights or contracts (either separately or in combination) and having regard to the considerations of fact or law involved, and, without  prejudice  to  the  generality  of  the  foregoing,  Control  shall  be  deemed  to include:

(a)the power (whether directly or indirectly and whether by the ownership of share capital, by the possession of voting power, by contract or otherwise including without limitation by way of membership of any Concert Party) to appoint and/or remove all or such of the members of the board of directors of the Club as are able to cast a majority of the votes capable of being cast by the members of that board; and/or

(b)the holding and/or possession of the beneficial interest in, and/or the ability to  exercise  the  voting  rights  applicable  to,  Shares  in  the  Club  (whether directly, indirectly (by means of holding such interests in one or more other persons) or by contract including without limitation by way of membership of any Concert Party) which confer in aggregate on the holder(s) thereof 30 per cent or more of the total voting rights exercisable at general meetings of the Club.For the purposes of the above, any rights or powers of a Nominee for any Person or of  an  Associate  of  any  Person  or  of  a  Connected  Person  to  any  Person  shall  be attributed to that Person;

(from the PL handbook linked above)

I can appreciate that is very dense legalese, but there's no way the separation between PIF and the Saudi government can survive that definition. And it doesn't even need to be proven - just "reasonable opinion". Sure, they need to provide written explanations, and certainly they can try their luck in civil courts and international tribunals. But, reading back, it seems that's what you're hanging your hat on. I can only shake my head in disbelief that you have any faith in those institutions.


There's also the incredibly broad and nebulous disqualification clause that similarly requires only reasonable belief.

F.1.6 in the reasonable opinion of the Board, he has engaged in conduct outside the United Kingdom that would constitute an offence of the sort described in  Rules  F.1.5.2  or  F.1.5.3,  if  such  conduct  had  taken  place  in  the  United Kingdom, whether or not such conduct resulted in a Conviction;

F. 1 . 5 . 2 .in   respect   of   any   offence   involving   any   act   which   could reasonably   be   considered   to   be   dishonest   (and,   for   the avoidance   of   doubt,   irrespective   of   the   actual   sentence imposed); or

F. 1 . 5 . 3 .in  respect  of  an  offence  set  out  in  Appendix  1  (Schedule  of Offences)   or   a   directly   analogous   offence   in   a   foreign jurisdiction (and, for the avoidance of doubt, irrespective of the actual sentence imposed);

So I come back to my belief that while the PL could (and probably should) reject it according to its own rules. That they haven't indicates to me that they want to approve it, but there's a lot of massaging their aggravated half-billion pound commercial partner before that can happen.

[gdm]

People need to give it a rest with the "there will be a legal battle if it fails" bollocks. There will be no legal repercussions. All parties will say nothing and try to pretend that the whole farce never happened, allowing it to fizzle out with barely a murmur of complant. Meanwhile we will be left to pick up the pieces once again.

I get why people keep peddling the legal action line. Its because they feel that someone, somewhere needs to pay a price for making us fans suffer like this. But its not going to happen. Unfortunately we are the ones who will be in bits about this and all of the other parties will just walk away with a shrug.

Aye no bother The Saudis are just gonna let £17m go on the decision making of the PL without a fight. The Saudis also won’t want to lose face to Qatar without a fight.