Author Topic: Newcastle United 5-0 Manchester United - 20/10/96 (post match comments from p8)  (Read 2941 times)

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Offline HTT

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Re: Newcastle United 5-0 Manchester United - 20/10/96 (post match comments from p8)
« Reply #250 on: Monday 16 March 2020, 07:33:44 PM »
He is quoted as saying the only real time he enjoyed being a footballer and thought he was actually a good footballer because he was told he was, was under KK a NUFC.

He’d be one of the best in his position today. Had we had him from the start of the season with Flowers and Hendry like KK wanted, we’d have walked 95/96.

Flowers and Hendry would have made all the difference, Batty, despite the love in for him on here, not so much.
Clarky  in our system, was more than capable in that position, whereas Pav and Peacock weren't in the same class as their Blackburn counterparts.

Batty actually got forward more and showed how good he was, one game KK went mad with him at half time for just sitting and passing the ball sideways. He said if he wanted a defensive midfielder he’d play Peacock there or something. I think Batty scored after the break that game. He was a good player, far better than Clark.
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Offline Kanji

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Re: Newcastle United 5-0 Manchester United - 20/10/96 (post match comments from p8)
« Reply #251 on: Monday 16 March 2020, 07:40:18 PM »
He is quoted as saying the only real time he enjoyed being a footballer and thought he was actually a good footballer because he was told he was, was under KK a NUFC.

He’d be one of the best in his position today. Had we had him from the start of the season with Flowers and Hendry like KK wanted, we’d have walked 95/96.

Flowers and Hendry would have made all the difference, Batty, despite the love in for him on here, not so much.
Clarky  in our system, was more than capable in that position, whereas Pav and Peacock weren't in the same class as their Blackburn counterparts.

Batty actually got forward more and showed how good he was, one game KK went mad with him at half time for just sitting and passing the ball sideways. He said if he wanted a defensive midfielder he’d play Peacock there or something. I think Batty scored after the break that game. He was a good player, far better than Clark.

@HTT  - how do you think the team would have fared with Dalglish as manager if 1) Shearer stayed fit ie: where would we have placed? and 2) were there any rumors as to signings he was trying to make that didn't come off? and 3) super hypothetical - why did he dismantle the team that just finished 2nd? Seems like the dumbest thing you could do. He sold the star winger, the 2nd striker and tried to replace with a young JDT only?

Maybe put it this way - what in your mind was he trying to do when he did that and how could it have gone differently?
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Offline Judge Holden

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Re: Newcastle United 5-0 Manchester United - 20/10/96 (post match comments from p8)
« Reply #252 on: Monday 16 March 2020, 07:55:51 PM »
Don't think Dalglish played Ginola much anyway when he took over.

Offline bigfella

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Re: Newcastle United 5-0 Manchester United - 20/10/96 (post match comments from p8)
« Reply #253 on: Monday 16 March 2020, 07:58:33 PM »
He is quoted as saying the only real time he enjoyed being a footballer and thought he was actually a good footballer because he was told he was, was under KK a NUFC.

He’d be one of the best in his position today. Had we had him from the start of the season with Flowers and Hendry like KK wanted, we’d have walked 95/96.

Flowers and Hendry would have made all the difference, Batty, despite the love in for him on here, not so much.
Clarky  in our system, was more than capable in that position, whereas Pav and Peacock weren't in the same class as their Blackburn counterparts.

Batty actually got forward more and showed how good he was, one game KK went mad with him at half time for just sitting and passing the ball sideways. He said if he wanted a defensive midfielder he’d play Peacock there or something. I think Batty scored after the break that game. He was a good player, far better than Clark.

Far better? Naa, not having that. An upgrade ? Probably.

Whereas the other two were clearly better than loveable but limited Pav and decent, but not class Peacock.

Offline Colo's Short and Curlies

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Re: Newcastle United 5-0 Manchester United - 20/10/96 (post match comments from p8)
« Reply #254 on: Monday 16 March 2020, 08:21:18 PM »
Just had a look at the results from when Pav took over from Shaka and can only really see the City game and the Liverpool game where you'd say that Flowers would probably have resulted in more points.

So yes probably enough to grab the title but by no means a given.
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Offline HTT

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Re: Newcastle United 5-0 Manchester United - 20/10/96 (post match comments from p8)
« Reply #255 on: Monday 16 March 2020, 08:47:01 PM »
He is quoted as saying the only real time he enjoyed being a footballer and thought he was actually a good footballer because he was told he was, was under KK a NUFC.

He’d be one of the best in his position today. Had we had him from the start of the season with Flowers and Hendry like KK wanted, we’d have walked 95/96.

Flowers and Hendry would have made all the difference, Batty, despite the love in for him on here, not so much.
Clarky  in our system, was more than capable in that position, whereas Pav and Peacock weren't in the same class as their Blackburn counterparts.

Batty actually got forward more and showed how good he was, one game KK went mad with him at half time for just sitting and passing the ball sideways. He said if he wanted a defensive midfielder he’d play Peacock there or something. I think Batty scored after the break that game. He was a good player, far better than Clark.

@HTT  - how do you think the team would have fared with Dalglish as manager if 1) Shearer stayed fit ie: where would we have placed? and 2) were there any rumors as to signings he was trying to make that didn't come off? and 3) super hypothetical - why did he dismantle the team that just finished 2nd? Seems like the dumbest thing you could do. He sold the star winger, the 2nd striker and tried to replace with a young JDT only?

Maybe put it this way - what in your mind was he trying to do when he did that and how could it have gone differently?

I think Dalglish, for all the criticism, when he was allowed to buy the kind of players he wanted to and not the kind he had his hand forced by other factors to also bring in which resulted in Rush et al, bought well. Nicos, Given, Hamann, Nobby, Speed etc. Others that flopped, they were saw as promising players for the future etc.

But the game was changing fast and he needed less Ginola types and more Shearer types and not for their ability the most but their dressing room personality in order to not nosedive. Success would never have been achieved though without these new wave of foreign players and newer methods and ideas.

KK had he stayed and we had continued on the same type of recruitment path under him, we’d have won the league and a European trophy once or twice and probably would have kept pace with all the other competing clubs for a decade or so under him.

Losing KK wasn’t the death bed though, not was hiring Dalglish, it was the club appointed managers to stem the flow of a tide created by the previous one, or cause waves the previous one had crashed. It was all reactions and there was no real plan other than if the club spent money under a big name manager or someone seemingly not quite s***, success would come.

They eventually landed on their feet with Bobby and backed him, but never saw past him and come the end, decided they would spend on players based on name, based on some obsession with placating fans or jostling for some bull s*** position with clubs who under KK couldn’t compete, Spurs, Everton, Chelsea et al. The prize had changed, the riches for FS and the Halls had already been had in the money they were making from their shares.

We should have kept Dalglish on before he was sacked, we started the season well enough, Shearer was returning and we’d have had a reasonable season I feel. Then maybe move him upstairs and let him work and help on structure, recruitment etc. because again for all his criticism, if not the manager, he could have been of real use to the club in the way Bobby could have been.

Gullit was a disaster, Souness one of the worst.

KK proved, he was the club, when he went, it all went to pot. Didn’t had to have been. To be fair to the club they wanted Fergie to replace KK and he used our interest to leverage better conditions at Man Utd and after him Bobby, either would have turned KK’s team into title winners and beyond. Dalglish was on the slide down, not up.

Wee Hughie - the greatest centre-forward Newcastle United ever had

Offline HTT

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Re: Newcastle United 5-0 Manchester United - 20/10/96 (post match comments from p8)
« Reply #256 on: Monday 16 March 2020, 08:52:06 PM »
He is quoted as saying the only real time he enjoyed being a footballer and thought he was actually a good footballer because he was told he was, was under KK a NUFC.

He’d be one of the best in his position today. Had we had him from the start of the season with Flowers and Hendry like KK wanted, we’d have walked 95/96.

Flowers and Hendry would have made all the difference, Batty, despite the love in for him on here, not so much.
Clarky  in our system, was more than capable in that position, whereas Pav and Peacock weren't in the same class as their Blackburn counterparts.

Batty actually got forward more and showed how good he was, one game KK went mad with him at half time for just sitting and passing the ball sideways. He said if he wanted a defensive midfielder he’d play Peacock there or something. I think Batty scored after the break that game. He was a good player, far better than Clark.

Far better? Naa, not having that. An upgrade ? Probably.

Whereas the other two were clearly better than loveable but limited Pav and decent, but not class Peacock.

Nah, he was a superior all-round player and would have scored 5 + goals in a season under KK. I doubt Clark would have, not without compensating for other things. Batty was a better passer, a better tackler, more switched on tactically, more of a leader, less injury prone (at that point prior especially) and more experienced. He complicated our set up and team so well and was our best player after he signed for the remainder of that season. A regular 7/10 sometimes 8s and 9s in there. KK said he wished had of signed him when we went up as he’d have turned him into Roy Keane who could play football. Maybe that’s a bit of a dig at Keane he was an underrrated footballer too, but maybe he was saying he could get him to play like that and football too together not one or the other.

Wee Hughie - the greatest centre-forward Newcastle United ever had

Offline Carlito

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Re: Newcastle United 5-0 Manchester United - 20/10/96 (post match comments from p8)
« Reply #257 on: Monday 16 March 2020, 09:50:41 PM »
Saw this late on so gave it a watch last night. Great seeing the full coverage, even if the half-time analysis was rotten.

Can't get over Bruce and Dalglish saying Poborsky's dive was a stone-wall penalty, the state of it man :lol: :lol: :lol: