Author Topic: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder  (Read 253443 times)

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Offline sadnesstan

  • General Member
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9125 on: Wednesday 16 September 2020, 04:19:48 PM »
Found this:

https://api.parliament.uk/historic-hansard/commons/1971/may/20/rates-of-purchase-tax

HC Deb 20 May 1971 vol 817 cc1607-531607
§Purchase tax shall in future be charged at 10 per cent., 15 per cent., 30 per cent. and 50 per cent., respectively, on all goods to which the present rate of l3i per cent., 22 per cent., 36 per cent. and 55 per cent. apply.—[Mr. Roy Jenkins.]

Offline madras

  • Philosoraptor
  • General Member
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9126 on: Wednesday 16 September 2020, 06:11:50 PM »
The Miliband take down of Johnson encapsulates the Brexit debacle. Its been happening for years....

EUphobe "The EU forces us to do loads of things we don't want to and as a sovereign nation we shouldn't have to ?"

EUphile " like what ? "

Answers come there none.

VAT.

Didn't Osbourne take that up to the current 20%?

I'm not suggesting Boris is going to revoke it, it's just a valid answer to the question.



The only restriction the EU has put on us in terms of VAT is that there is a limit of VAT rates that can be applied. And once again we actually have an exemption to this and have more VAT rates then any other EU country.

Yes there is the issue that you don't charge VAT on sales to other EU countries as we don't tariffs but I'm pretty sure we were quite happy to sign up to that

Switching to VAT was a condition of joining the EEC. If we didn't accept it, we don't join. The public voted to join.

So the question, in response to Madas's assumptions, is, "Did the public know all the details of VAT at the time of voting? Did they know it could go up to 20% at any time should the wealthy f*** up? Were they aware that the Rees Moggs of the time were in a position to exploit this in order to expand their wealth, and therefore power, and possibly even set up the likes of Rees Mogg, in the first place?"

My experience suggests otherwise but I will certainly bow down to somebody with relevant experience.
I never mentioned the public, I mentioned "we" as in the country. Our officials who negotiated our Terns etc for entry would have been well aware as were my parents who looked forward to the drop from purchase tax.

Wouldn't it have been easier for you to search for one of those rare occasions that thebUK was outvoted, couldn't get an exemption and had to go through with stuff seemingly against its will ? There were some, the only one I cam remember off the top of my head was to list as an ingredient on food labelling an additive linked with cancer....we didn't want to, red tape and all that.
Bullshitters misrepresent themselves to their audience not as liars do, that is, by deliberately making false claims about what is true. In fact, bullshit need not be untrue at all.

Rather, bullshitters seek to convey a certain impression of themselves without being concerned about whether anything at all is true. They quietly change the rules governing their end of the conversation so that claims about truth and falsity are irrelevant.

Offline sadnesstan

  • General Member
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9127 on: Wednesday 16 September 2020, 06:13:59 PM »
The Miliband take down of Johnson encapsulates the Brexit debacle. Its been happening for years....

EUphobe "The EU forces us to do loads of things we don't want to and as a sovereign nation we shouldn't have to ?"

EUphile " like what ? "

Answers come there none.

VAT.

Didn't Osbourne take that up to the current 20%?

I'm not suggesting Boris is going to revoke it, it's just a valid answer to the question.



The only restriction the EU has put on us in terms of VAT is that there is a limit of VAT rates that can be applied. And once again we actually have an exemption to this and have more VAT rates then any other EU country.

Yes there is the issue that you don't charge VAT on sales to other EU countries as we don't tariffs but I'm pretty sure we were quite happy to sign up to that

Switching to VAT was a condition of joining the EEC. If we didn't accept it, we don't join. The public voted to join.

So the question, in response to Madas's assumptions, is, "Did the public know all the details of VAT at the time of voting? Did they know it could go up to 20% at any time should the wealthy f*** up? Were they aware that the Rees Moggs of the time were in a position to exploit this in order to expand their wealth, and therefore power, and possibly even set up the likes of Rees Mogg, in the first place?"

My experience suggests otherwise but I will certainly bow down to somebody with relevant experience.
I never mentioned the public, I mentioned "we" as in the country. Our officials who negotiated our Terns etc for entry would have been well aware as were my parents who looked forward to the drop from purchase tax.

Wouldn't it have been easier for you to search for one of those rare occasions that thebUK was outvoted, couldn't get an exemption and had to go through with stuff seemingly against its will ? There were some, the only one I cam remember off the top of my head was to list as an ingredient on food labelling an additive linked with cancer....we didn't want to, red tape and all that.

What could be easier than saying VAT?

It would be easier for you if I used an example that you can dismiss.

Offline madras

  • Philosoraptor
  • General Member
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9128 on: Wednesday 16 September 2020, 06:23:41 PM »
The Miliband take down of Johnson encapsulates the Brexit debacle. Its been happening for years....

EUphobe "The EU forces us to do loads of things we don't want to and as a sovereign nation we shouldn't have to ?"

EUphile " like what ? "

Answers come there none.

VAT.

Didn't Osbourne take that up to the current 20%?

I'm not suggesting Boris is going to revoke it, it's just a valid answer to the question.



The only restriction the EU has put on us in terms of VAT is that there is a limit of VAT rates that can be applied. And once again we actually have an exemption to this and have more VAT rates then any other EU country.

Yes there is the issue that you don't charge VAT on sales to other EU countries as we don't tariffs but I'm pretty sure we were quite happy to sign up to that

Switching to VAT was a condition of joining the EEC. If we didn't accept it, we don't join. The public voted to join.

So the question, in response to Madas's assumptions, is, "Did the public know all the details of VAT at the time of voting? Did they know it could go up to 20% at any time should the wealthy f*** up? Were they aware that the Rees Moggs of the time were in a position to exploit this in order to expand their wealth, and therefore power, and possibly even set up the likes of Rees Mogg, in the first place?"

My experience suggests otherwise but I will certainly bow down to somebody with relevant experience.
I never mentioned the public, I mentioned "we" as in the country. Our officials who negotiated our Terns etc for entry would have been well aware as were my parents who looked forward to the drop from purchase tax.

Wouldn't it have been easier for you to search for one of those rare occasions that thebUK was outvoted, couldn't get an exemption and had to go through with stuff seemingly against its will ? There were some, the only one I cam remember off the top of my head was to list as an ingredient on food labelling an additive linked with cancer....we didn't want to, red tape and all that.

What could be easier than saying VAT?

It would be easier for you if I used an example that you can dismiss.
Because we never voted against accepting VAT nor opposed it when negotiating our entry.
Bullshitters misrepresent themselves to their audience not as liars do, that is, by deliberately making false claims about what is true. In fact, bullshit need not be untrue at all.

Rather, bullshitters seek to convey a certain impression of themselves without being concerned about whether anything at all is true. They quietly change the rules governing their end of the conversation so that claims about truth and falsity are irrelevant.

Offline sadnesstan

  • General Member
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9129 on: Wednesday 16 September 2020, 06:24:18 PM »
The Miliband take down of Johnson encapsulates the Brexit debacle. Its been happening for years....

EUphobe "The EU forces us to do loads of things we don't want to and as a sovereign nation we shouldn't have to ?"

EUphile " like what ? "

Answers come there none.

VAT.

Didn't Osbourne take that up to the current 20%?

I'm not suggesting Boris is going to revoke it, it's just a valid answer to the question.



The only restriction the EU has put on us in terms of VAT is that there is a limit of VAT rates that can be applied. And once again we actually have an exemption to this and have more VAT rates then any other EU country.

Yes there is the issue that you don't charge VAT on sales to other EU countries as we don't tariffs but I'm pretty sure we were quite happy to sign up to that

Switching to VAT was a condition of joining the EEC. If we didn't accept it, we don't join. The public voted to join.

So the question, in response to Madas's assumptions, is, "Did the public know all the details of VAT at the time of voting? Did they know it could go up to 20% at any time should the wealthy f*** up? Were they aware that the Rees Moggs of the time were in a position to exploit this in order to expand their wealth, and therefore power, and possibly even set up the likes of Rees Mogg, in the first place?"

My experience suggests otherwise but I will certainly bow down to somebody with relevant experience.
I never mentioned the public, I mentioned "we" as in the country. Our officials who negotiated our Terns etc for entry would have been well aware as were my parents who looked forward to the drop from purchase tax.

Wouldn't it have been easier for you to search for one of those rare occasions that thebUK was outvoted, couldn't get an exemption and had to go through with stuff seemingly against its will ? There were some, the only one I cam remember off the top of my head was to list as an ingredient on food labelling an additive linked with cancer....we didn't want to, red tape and all that.

What could be easier than saying VAT?

It would be easier for you if I used an example that you can dismiss.
Because we never voted against accepting VAT nor opposed it when negotiating our entry.

Did we vote for it?

Offline madras

  • Philosoraptor
  • General Member
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9130 on: Wednesday 16 September 2020, 06:25:33 PM »
The Miliband take down of Johnson encapsulates the Brexit debacle. Its been happening for years....

EUphobe "The EU forces us to do loads of things we don't want to and as a sovereign nation we shouldn't have to ?"

EUphile " like what ? "

Answers come there none.

VAT.

Didn't Osbourne take that up to the current 20%?

I'm not suggesting Boris is going to revoke it, it's just a valid answer to the question.



The only restriction the EU has put on us in terms of VAT is that there is a limit of VAT rates that can be applied. And once again we actually have an exemption to this and have more VAT rates then any other EU country.

Yes there is the issue that you don't charge VAT on sales to other EU countries as we don't tariffs but I'm pretty sure we were quite happy to sign up to that

Switching to VAT was a condition of joining the EEC. If we didn't accept it, we don't join. The public voted to join.

So the question, in response to Madas's assumptions, is, "Did the public know all the details of VAT at the time of voting? Did they know it could go up to 20% at any time should the wealthy f*** up? Were they aware that the Rees Moggs of the time were in a position to exploit this in order to expand their wealth, and therefore power, and possibly even set up the likes of Rees Mogg, in the first place?"

My experience suggests otherwise but I will certainly bow down to somebody with relevant experience.
I never mentioned the public, I mentioned "we" as in the country. Our officials who negotiated our Terns etc for entry would have been well aware as were my parents who looked forward to the drop from purchase tax.

Wouldn't it have been easier for you to search for one of those rare occasions that thebUK was outvoted, couldn't get an exemption and had to go through with stuff seemingly against its will ? There were some, the only one I cam remember off the top of my head was to list as an ingredient on food labelling an additive linked with cancer....we didn't want to, red tape and all that.

What could be easier than saying VAT?

It would be easier for you if I used an example that you can dismiss.
Because we never voted against accepting VAT nor opposed it when negotiating our entry.

Did we vote for it?
Did we vote for any specific legislation ?

Do we ever ?

Unless you mean as a National political entity, in which cas, yes we have. Many times every time it was altered, amended etc
Bullshitters misrepresent themselves to their audience not as liars do, that is, by deliberately making false claims about what is true. In fact, bullshit need not be untrue at all.

Rather, bullshitters seek to convey a certain impression of themselves without being concerned about whether anything at all is true. They quietly change the rules governing their end of the conversation so that claims about truth and falsity are irrelevant.

Online Super Duper Branko Strupar

  • General Member
  • Leeds Leeds Leeds
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9131 on: Wednesday 16 September 2020, 10:55:15 PM »
And in the end, the love you take, is equal to the love you make.

Offline Rafalove

  • General Member
  • Was summerof69
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9132 on: Wednesday 16 September 2020, 11:33:19 PM »
 :lol: but we’re big enough to make our own way in the world

Offline AyeDubbleYoo

  • General Member
  • Ian W
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9133 on: Wednesday 16 September 2020, 11:58:18 PM »
It was always logically impossible to have proper Brexit without a land border in Ireland or an administrative equivalent of some sort. This was clear since day one and something that honest Brexiteers should have admitted throughout.

Offline Wullie

  • Administrator
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9134 on: Yesterday at 06:55:45 PM »
Enjoying Theresa May sticking the boot in.
Jeff's Garage - Cheaper than some other garages.

Offline Dokko

  • TT
  • General Member
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9135 on: Yesterday at 08:29:00 PM »
Enjoying Theresa May sticking the boot in.

A strong & stable boot, I hope.

Offline AyeDubbleYoo

  • General Member
  • Ian W
Re: Brexit 2: Brexit Harder
« Reply #9136 on: Yesterday at 08:36:30 PM »
See emigrants to the EU are going to have their UK bank accounts closed.