Newcastle-Online

NUFC => Football => Topic started by: Alby on Tuesday 6 October 2009, 06:57:39 AM

Title: Newcastle United Supporters Trust (NUST)
Post by: Alby on Tuesday 6 October 2009, 06:57:39 AM
http://www.nust.org.uk

After months of discussions with interested parties, Newcastle United Supporters Trust (NUST) is launching the 'Yes We Can' Campaign which aims to raise funds to lead a fans buy out at St James' Park. The Trust will be revealing partners over the coming days but has in place a buy out structure led by local firms and renowned names in the financial world.

The Trust is mailing out to over 40,000 supporters to ask them if and how they want to buy into the campaign to lead a city-wide bid to buy back the club.

There are a number of ways supporters can buy into the model which has been dubbed by the financial community as the 'Barcelona on the Tyne' which would see a 'democratisation' of the club to ensure that the current state of the club would not be repeated.

The idea is based on fans investing in the club through a number of financial opportunities which will be held by a local solicitors in an Escrow account to demonstrate to Ashley that the fans have 'proof of funds'. Supporters will be asked to pledge 10% of their investment into this account which would be returned if the bid was unsuccessful.

It is believed that this is the first stage of a 6 week campaign including advertisements, the opening of an advice shop in central Newcastle and the unveiling of high profile backers.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 6 October 2009, 08:41:27 AM
http://www.newcastle-online.org/nufcforum/index.php/topic,64842.0.html

There are a few more recent opinions in there. :thup:
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Kaizero on Tuesday 6 October 2009, 09:16:43 AM
Kill them, kill them with fire!
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Stu on Tuesday 6 October 2009, 11:36:13 AM
Pretty ambivalent towards them, just can't seem to get way from the bouycoutt brigade!
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Brummiemag on Tuesday 6 October 2009, 12:53:06 PM
Sorry if this has been discussed elsewhere......

Is anyone here a member? Do you think they are doing a good job in representing us?

I am a bit tempted to join after looking at their website, though as a fan based outside Newcastle I don't see I can join their activities and events.

I'm a member and I live in Birmingham - If it acts a pressure group on behalf of the fans and aims to have fan representation on the board then it has to be a good thing in my opinion
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: binnsy on Tuesday 6 October 2009, 03:15:11 PM
Sorry if this has been discussed elsewhere......

Is anyone here a member? Do you think they are doing a good job in representing us?

I am a bit tempted to join after looking at their website, though as a fan based outside Newcastle I don't see I can join their activities and events.

Alby,  i wouldn't want to tell you to join or not,  all i'd say is that if you've been on their website and like what they have to say then go ahead and join, if you think they're talking bollocks then don't.
Fwiw i'm with Brummiemag and think a Newcastle Supporters Trust is a good thing.  Living outside the area still doesn't stop you having your say as a member.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: toonlass on Tuesday 6 October 2009, 04:01:08 PM
nobody.

























(see what I did there, Newcastle United Supporters trust nobody)
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Thorpinho on Wednesday 7 October 2009, 12:08:13 PM
I would be fine with it if their was a right to vote for members who can all pay a small fee or something. Under no circumstances would I support any kind of 'leader' from the group who wants to run the club or make decisions for it. On the basis that they will just eventually want more and more power for the group, I think it would just be a largely pointless distraction.

I dont particularly want presidential elections every 4 years for the club that we vote on, as this does not promote stability in any way. Can i not just have one decent chairman who isnt a prick who supports one manager in building a club over a long period of time?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: JJ7 on Wednesday 7 October 2009, 10:37:09 PM
I went to one of their meetings. Unfortunatly I won't be joining. Ive been a member of the Berwick Rangers Supporters Trust, who seem far more organised and know what they're doing than the Newcastle one.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Keefaz on Wednesday 7 October 2009, 11:30:09 PM
I went to one of their meetings. Unfortunatly I won't be joining. Ive been a member of the Berwick Rangers Supporters Trust, who seem far more organised and know what they're doing than the Newcastle one.

Hold on. Did I see your van the other day?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: binnsy on Monday 9 November 2009, 10:56:33 PM
I've just seen that the NUST are having another roadshow this week, Thursday 12th, at the Strawberry starting at 7.30pm.  With everything thats happened in the last week or so plus the Trust launching their plan to buy the club it could be a decent night and been in the town should attract a decent crowd although in saying that they haven't bothered advertising it yet!  i only found out by stumbling across it on their forum on their website.

  I know that the NUST has plenty critics on here so maybe this is a chance to go and see what they're all about.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: toonlass on Monday 9 November 2009, 11:06:14 PM
According to Culkin's tweet NUST are launching their "ambitious bid to buy NUFC at 10am tomorrow"
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: binnsy on Monday 9 November 2009, 11:08:52 PM
According to Culkin's tweet NUST are launching their "ambitious bid to buy NUFC at 10am tomorrow"

i knew it was some time this week, didn't know it was 2moro though.

Also just found out that the roadshow planned for this week has been postponed to a later date this month!
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: JJ7 on Monday 9 November 2009, 11:17:40 PM
Has anyone an idea on what they're proposing without waiting for the full details tomorrow. Ive said in the past that I wasn't impressed when I went to a meeting, but it will be interesting to see who's all involved.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: binnsy on Monday 9 November 2009, 11:18:12 PM
Just seen this on True Faith as well........

Fans Launch Buy Out

After months of discussions with interested parties, Newcastle United Supporters Trust (NUST) is launching the 'Yes We Can' Campaign which aims to raise funs to lead a fans buy out at St James' Park. The Trust will be revealing partners over the coming days but has in place a buy out structure lead by local firms and reknowned names in the financial world. The Trust is mailing out to over 40,000 supporters to ask them if and how they want to buy into the campaign to lead a city-wide bid to buy back the club.
There are a number of ways supporters can buy into the model which has been dubbed by the financial community as the 'Barcelona on the Tyne' which would see a 'democratisation' of the club to ensure that the current state of the club would not be repeated. The idea is based on fans investing in the club through a number of financial opportunities which will be held by a local solicitors in an ESCOW account to demostrate to Ashley that the fans have 'proof of funds'. Supporters will be asked to pledge 10% of their investment into this account which would be returned if the bid was unsuccessful.


It is believed that this is the first stage of a 6 week campaign including advertisements, the opening of an advice shop in central Newcastle and the unveiling of high profile backers.


Mark Jensen, Spokesperson for the Trust on the campaign said:

'Its clear that we have no knight in shining armour to end the charade at St James' Park so we must look at how we can do this ourselves. The club is a fantastic investment if run properly and we aim to attract the type of investors who will seek to bring back the values of integrity and honesty to the club. We've been in discussions with serious people in the city and beyond and they have thrown down the gauntlet to supporters to lead the charge. We've been obsessed by protest but this is the ulimate protest. If people want more info they can visit www.nust.org.uk and find out more. There are a range of ways to invest but fans can be sure that it will be on a 1 investor 1 vote basis with fans electing 6 fans representatives through the Trust and a President who will bring in a professional team accountable to the fans ulimately. There are serious investors who want to back this idea because they can see the potential in the club. This is an investment which is not only ruled by the heart but by the head also'.


The Trust will be launching an exciting Business Plan in the near future which will set out further how the financial model will benefit fans and investors. Over the next 6 weeks the Trust has a total to reach but they are refusing to reveal how much because 'this is clearly a commercial issue' and 'we want to negotiate with Mr Ashley on our basis not his'.


Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: toonlass on Monday 9 November 2009, 11:18:59 PM
No idea, but am not keen on a fans owning the the club idea. I don't think we would ever have enough cash to compete on a high enough level to get back to where we were.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: toonlass on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:07:19 AM
Fans Launch Buy Out
After months of discussions with interested parties, Newcastle United Supporters Trust (NUST) is launching the 'Yes We Can' Campaign which aims to raise funs to lead a fans buy out at St James' Park. The Trust will be revealing partners over the coming days but has in place a buy out structure lead by local firms and reknowned names in the financial world. The Trust is mailing out to over 40,000 supporters to ask them if and how they want to buy into the campaign to lead a city-wide bid to buy back the club.
There are a number of ways supporters can buy into the model which has been dubbed by the financial community as the 'Barcelona on the Tyne' which would see a 'democratisation' of the club to ensure that the current state of the club would not be repeated. The idea is based on fans investing in the club through a number of financial opportunities which will be held by a local solicitors in an ESCOW account to demostrate to Ashley that the fans have 'proof of funds'. Supporters will be asked to pledge 10% of their investment into this account which would be returned if the bid was unsuccessful.


It is believed that this is the first stage of a 6 week campaign including advertisements, the opening of an advice shop in central Newcastle and the unveiling of high profile backers.


Mark Jensen, Spokesperson for the Trust on the campaign said:

'Its clear that we have no knight in shining armour to end the charade at St James' Park so we must look at how we can do this ourselves. The club is a fantastic investment if run properly and we aim to attract the type of investors who will seek to bring back the values of integrity and honesty to the club. We've been in discussions with serious people in the city and beyond and they have thrown down the gauntlet to supporters to lead the charge. We've been obsessed by protest but this is the ulimate protest. If people want more info they can visit www.nust.org.uk and find out more. There are a range of ways to invest but fans can be sure that it will be on a 1 investor 1 vote basis with fans electing 6 fans representatives through the Trust and a President who will bring in a professional team accountable to the fans ulimately. There are serious investors who want to back this idea because they can see the potential in the club. This is an investment which is not only ruled by the heart but by the head also'.


The Trust will be launching an exciting Business Plan in the near future which will set out further how the financial model will benefit fans and investors. Over the next 6 weeks the Trust has a total to reach but they are refusing to reveal how much because 'this is clearly a commercial issue' and 'we want to negotiate with Mr Ashley on our basis not his'.



More info visit www.nust.org.uk or associated Newcastle based websites.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Village Idiot on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:13:26 AM
"Barcelona on the Tyne", love it.

Can't fault the NUST for trying. Has there ever been any fan buyout of a team in the Football League?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:17:02 AM
Can't think of one.

Edit: Notts County?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:22:37 AM
is this a charity begging bowl or a show of financial muscle?

Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:39:00 AM
is this a charity begging bowl or a show of financial muscle?


Depends on the investors. Could Moat be a part of this?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Pav on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:56:23 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:07:54 AM
So, who are the backers?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Pav on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:19:30 AM
Don't know, and if I did this would be the last place I'd post it before it was made official.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Thomson Mouse on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:02:35 AM
Don't know, and if I did this would be the last place I'd post it before it was made official.

I've recently moved to Australia and joined,  so don't let distance stop you as Brummiemag's comments are spot on.

I wasn't keen on the idea at first, but they've shown me they are willing to listen and evolve which was the most important thing for me.

For too long the apathy among NUFC fans has been shameful, if NUST can pull this off this would be amazing for normal fans all over the UK.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Pav on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:20:35 AM
Just think, our relegation affected alot of local businesses. Lots of people will be willing to invest in a way to buy the club...
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: bealios on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 08:22:44 AM
I received an e-mail this morning asking me to invest, as I imagine a lot of people did. Have to admit I'm very sceptical, but thought I'd take a further look. Since they're asking for investment now, is there any sort of detailed business plan available anywhere for investors to look at, detailing the source of funding for the club post acquisition, how they plan to convince Barclays or another bank to put up a new working capital facility, and what security will be offered to obtain funding?

There is plenty on the website about the make up of the executive committee, but there doesn't seem to be any detailed financial planning. The Barcelona model works mainly because of the huge income generated, so the club is to an extent not completely reliant on bank funding. NUFC are losing £20m a year at the moment, how will that loss be covered in the first year?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: shellshock on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 08:36:52 AM
I received an e-mail this morning asking me to invest, as I imagine a lot of people did. Have to admit I'm very sceptical, but thought I'd take a further look. Since they're asking for investment now, is there any sort of detailed business plan available anywhere for investors to look at, detailing the source of funding for the club post acquisition, how they plan to convince Barclays or another bank to put up a new working capital facility, and what security will be offered to obtain funding?

There is plenty on the website about the make up of the executive committee, but there doesn't seem to be any detailed financial planning. The Barcelona model works mainly because of the huge income generated, so the club is to an extent not completely reliant on bank funding. NUFC are losing £20m a year at the moment, how will that loss be covered in the first year?

There is a full Q and A section on the website in realtion to the proposed buy out.  At the moment we will be asking peple to deposit 10% of their pledged investment into an escrow account which is set up and handled by a respected city centre local legal firm.  If the buy out does not work then the 10% is refundable.  By all means be secptical, ask the questions, read what NUST has to say, and watch the campaign grow over the coming days, the chron, journal etc will feature full page ads, the website will be updated and reflect whats happening, this is the ultimate protest and the best, most organised, professional, clear and transparent way to remove the current regime.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 08:38:07 AM
Your best bet would be to head over to Toontastic and contact Peasepud if he's not on here. He's offering to answer peoples questions relating to the scheme.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: plenum on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 08:45:13 AM
So, who are the backers?

I'm prepared to put in a few quid to help this movement against the regime!

Love the idea, hope it will work out. Or, if all else fails, then I wish for a mega rich Saudi or something. Just want Ashley OUT!
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Cronky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:04:20 AM
So, who are the backers?

It sounds pretty clear from the blurb that nobody's actually pledged any funds yet. They're waiting to see what response there is from the fans first.

The whole thing couldn't be more vague if it tried.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: bealios on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:13:58 AM
I received an e-mail this morning asking me to invest, as I imagine a lot of people did. Have to admit I'm very sceptical, but thought I'd take a further look. Since they're asking for investment now, is there any sort of detailed business plan available anywhere for investors to look at, detailing the source of funding for the club post acquisition, how they plan to convince Barclays or another bank to put up a new working capital facility, and what security will be offered to obtain funding?

There is plenty on the website about the make up of the executive committee, but there doesn't seem to be any detailed financial planning. The Barcelona model works mainly because of the huge income generated, so the club is to an extent not completely reliant on bank funding. NUFC are losing £20m a year at the moment, how will that loss be covered in the first year?

There is a full Q and A section on the website in realtion to the proposed buy out.  At the moment we will be asking peple to deposit 10% of their pledged investment into an escrow account which is set up and handled by a respected city centre local legal firm.  If the buy out does not work then the 10% is refundable.  By all means be secptical, ask the questions, read what NUST has to say, and watch the campaign grow over the coming days, the chron, journal etc will feature full page ads, the website will be updated and reflect whats happening, this is the ultimate protest and the best, most organised, professional, clear and transparent way to remove the current regime.

Thanks, I've seen that, although it doesn't seem to give a lot of detail. From what I can see, the aim seems to be to raise £200m, and pay a return of 2%. Begs the question, why pay a return at all? Anyone investing in this could invest elsewhere and get better than 2%, so they're obviously doing it for non-financial reasons, i.e. to help the club, which is great. So surely the sort of people who would put their cash/pension funds towards this would happily agree to foresake what is a fairly minimal return and have it invested back into the club? Is it one of the qualifying conditions for the qualification for SIPP investment?

THe website also doesn't make it clear what the trust policy is to gearing, borrowing at a sustainable level to invest in the club.

I've got a bit of spare cash at the moment and would give it some serious consideration, but not before seeing some detailed funding plans. It mentions on the website that there will be a detailed business model released shortly, surely this should be made available before seeking investment? There also doesnt seem to be any indication of what level of funds will be required for the acquisition to get the go ahead from NUST. I'd be very nervous if the NUST was planning to buy the club when it has only raised £80 - £100m worth of funds, however if it raised £200m then I'd be more confident you could get the club back into the Premier League and cover the inevitable losses as you put in place your business model over a 5 year term. Is there a number where you will/won't go ahead, and wouldn't it be sensible to communicate this to potential investors?

I don't want to come across as picking holes or anything, would love this to work, but there are some key facts missing from the website - this sort of investment should really have a proper information memorandum with more detailed financial information.

Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:24:03 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:26:15 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:27:56 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.

Has it been mentioned whether he's backing the NUST bid?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:28:06 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

I think I read somewhere he has been approached but didn't respond/wasn't interested.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:33:23 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.

Has it been mentioned whether he's backing the NUST bid?

Not as far as I know.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:38:45 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.

Has it been mentioned whether he's backing the NUST bid?
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

I think I read somewhere he has been approached but didn't respond/wasn't interested.

Well, I wish the NUST good luck but if fans with the clout of Moat or Sehpherd can't be persuaded to back the cause the whole premise of wanting a club owned by fans looks like wishful thinking which is unlikely to stand up in the face of cold hard financial reality.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: toonlass on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:39:17 AM
Have been looking at the NUST site. On one page it says that the minimum investment is £2500

How does the plan work?

In addition, we will reveal a model that will ensure a long term stable business plan to be implemented by the elected Board, headed by the President.  Initially our investment product is aimed at investors with cash (minimum £2,500) and can include other investment products such as Self Invested Pension Plans at a mimimum transfer of £25,000.


and on another it says minimum investment is £1500.

If you want to invest cash, you would be expected to put 10% down of your proposed investment called Proof of Funds so a minimum investment of £1500 would mean £150 lodged with a local Solicitor.

Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:41:06 AM
Have been looking at the NUST site. On one page it says that the minimum investment is £2500

How does the plan work?

In addition, we will reveal a model that will ensure a long term stable business plan to be implemented by the elected Board, headed by the President.  Initially our investment product is aimed at investors with cash (minimum £2,500) and can include other investment products such as Self Invested Pension Plans at a mimimum transfer of £25,000.


and on another it says minimum investment is £1500.

If you want to invest cash, you would be expected to put 10% down of your proposed investment called Proof of Funds so a minimum investment of £1500 would mean £150 lodged with a local Solicitor.



It was originally £2,500 but after asking the fans they've reduced it to £1,500. Seems like the page went live without being amended.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: bealios on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:41:47 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.

Has it been mentioned whether he's backing the NUST bid?
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

I think I read somewhere he has been approached but didn't respond/wasn't interested.

Well, I wish the NUST good luck but if fans with the clout of Moat or Sehpherd can't be persuaded to back the cause the whole premise of wanting a club owned by fans looks like wishful thinking which is unlikely to stand up in the face of cold hard financial reality.

Having read the details on the website, there's a very good reason why Moat/Shepherd won't be involved - its one member one vote - so if you put in £20m you have the same influence over the club as someone who puts in £1,500. This might end up being stumbling block to those with serious money to put in, or on the other hand it might end up being an example of perfect democracy, who knows. :undecided:
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:42:42 AM
Heres the link on toontastic http://www.toontastic.net/board/index.php?showtopic=26197
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:44:55 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.

Has it been mentioned whether he's backing the NUST bid?
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

I think I read somewhere he has been approached but didn't respond/wasn't interested.

Well, I wish the NUST good luck but if fans with the clout of Moat or Sehpherd can't be persuaded to back the cause the whole premise of wanting a club owned by fans looks like wishful thinking which is unlikely to stand up in the face of cold hard financial reality.

I was always under the impression Moat's funding was from backers? They're probably want to own it lock, stock and barrell or not at all. As for Shepherd, I can't imagine him buying into the 'one fan, one vote' ethos. He likes to run a dictatorship.

I admit though, it would've been nice to hear about one or two famous local faces putting a bit of their money in. A Moat or a Wylie.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:46:43 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.

Has it been mentioned whether he's backing the NUST bid?
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

I think I read somewhere he has been approached but didn't respond/wasn't interested.

Well, I wish the NUST good luck but if fans with the clout of Moat or Sehpherd can't be persuaded to back the cause the whole premise of wanting a club owned by fans looks like wishful thinking which is unlikely to stand up in the face of cold hard financial reality.

Having read the details on the website, there's a very good reason why Moat/Shepherd won't be involved - its one member one vote - so if you put in £20m you have the same influence over the club as someone who puts in £1,500. This might end up being stumbling block to those with serious money to put in, or on the other hand it might end up being an example of perfect democracy, who knows. :undecided:

Time to re-read Animal Farm methinks.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:47:23 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.

Has it been mentioned whether he's backing the NUST bid?
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

I think I read somewhere he has been approached but didn't respond/wasn't interested.

Well, I wish the NUST good luck but if fans with the clout of Moat or Sehpherd can't be persuaded to back the cause the whole premise of wanting a club owned by fans looks like wishful thinking which is unlikely to stand up in the face of cold hard financial reality.

Having read the details on the website, there's a very good reason why Moat/Shepherd won't be involved - its one member one vote - so if you put in £20m you have the same influence over the club as someone who puts in £1,500. This might end up being stumbling block to those with serious money to put in, or on the other hand it might end up being an example of perfect democracy, who knows. :undecided:

Yeah I agree but by the sounds of things they already have a fair few big players involved. I like how anyone can be involved and their money gets put into a pool so that NUST can buy that group of people a vote. Also like how you can buy a vote as a group of people you already know. It looks canny. If it runs the same way as Barca where you vote in a new president of the group every 4 years and he has the final say I think this could really work. The club can already bring in cash of it's own and then with the extra backing from the group I think the club would have more than sufficient funds.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:49:25 AM
Not sure why people get so het up about NUST, i'm not a member of them and I have made no contribution to the cause at the moment.  But i coming round to the idea. 

There is not going to be a super rich person buying the club like Man city.

It might have to be the fans.

At least some peopel are dping summik instead of sitting on the side lines twisting on about it.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:50:44 AM
Not sure why people get so het up about NUST, i'm not a member of them and I have made no contribution to the cause at the moment.  But i coming round to the idea. 

There is not going to be a super rich person buying the club like Man city.

It might have to be the fans.

At least some peopel are dping summik instead of sitting on the side lines twisting on about it.

To be honest since the relaunch and the announcement of this they seem more professional and I think less people are twisting now ??
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: toonlass on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:50:53 AM
I am really having a good look at this and am trying to keep an open mind to this idea.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:53:49 AM
Not sure why people get so het up about NUST, i'm not a member of them and I have made no contribution to the cause at the moment.  But i coming round to the idea. 

There is not going to be a super rich person buying the club like Man city.

It might have to be the fans.

At least some peopel are dping summik instead of sitting on the side lines twisting on about it.

It's because it's a bunch of fans being proactive. Don't you know you're officially a t*** if give a damn nowadays? Much cooler to sit on the internet and poo-poo every idea that's floated.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: binnsy on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:55:17 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.

Has it been mentioned whether he's backing the NUST bid?
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

I think I read somewhere he has been approached but didn't respond/wasn't interested.

Well, I wish the NUST good luck but if fans with the clout of Moat or Sehpherd can't be persuaded to back the cause the whole premise of wanting a club owned by fans looks like wishful thinking which is unlikely to stand up in the face of cold hard financial reality.

Having read the details on the website, there's a very good reason why Moat/Shepherd won't be involved - its one member one vote - so if you put in £20m you have the same influence over the club as someone who puts in £1,500. This might end up being stumbling block to those with serious money to put in, or on the other hand it might end up being an example of perfect democracy, who knows. :undecided:

Yeah I agree but by the sounds of things they already have a fair few big players involved. I like how anyone can be involved and their money gets put into a pool so that NUST can buy that group of people a vote. Also like how you can buy a vote as a group of people you already know. It looks canny. If it runs the same way as Barca where you vote in a new president of the group every 4 years and he has the final say I think this could really work. The club can already bring in cash of it's own and then with the extra backing from the group I think the club would have more than sufficient funds.

I'm sure i saw something last week where a group of friends/work colleagues can group together and buy a share,  say 10 people put in £250 each or 5 put in £500 etc.  That was something that interested me,  i can't afford the full amount but think with a few mates and brother, dad we can get a couple of grand between us.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:55:29 AM
Thought you were calling me a t*** for a second  :lol:
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:56:35 AM
Not sure why people get so het up about NUST, i'm not a member of them and I have made no contribution to the cause at the moment.  But i coming round to the idea. 

There is not going to be a super rich person buying the club like Man city.

It might have to be the fans.

At least some peopel are dping summik instead of sitting on the side lines twisting on about it.

Don't see anyone twisting tbh. If you don't like anyone asking questions I would suggest you're the one getting het up for no reason.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: PCW1983 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:58:45 AM
I dont really have any cash to invest atm however id be tempted to use a bit of my pension, after all im only 26 so have plenty time to get it back, anyone know more about this ? How it works eg ?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: geordie_b on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:58:49 AM
how did they get my email address?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:00:38 AM
how did they get my email address?

Have you filled in anything on their website?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:01:30 AM
Not sure why people get so het up about NUST, i'm not a member of them and I have made no contribution to the cause at the moment.  But i coming round to the idea. 

There is not going to be a super rich person buying the club like Man city.

It might have to be the fans.

At least some peopel are dping summik instead of sitting on the side lines twisting on about it.

Don't see anyone twisting tbh. If you don't like anyone asking questions I would suggest you're the one getting het up for no reason.

I'm not het,

If you have questions there is no point doing it on a forum, why dont the ones asking questions go to the NUST meetings and ask the questions directly.

I've seen the NUST get some bashing on this forum before.

I admit that some of the things they hve done in the past have mde me face/palm a couple of times.

Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: geordie_b on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:03:58 AM
how did they get my email address?

Have you filled in anything on their website?

Nope and I doubt they had 40k email addresses entered on their site
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Roger Kint on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:06:14 AM
how did they get my email address?

Have you filled in anything on their website?

Nope and I doubt they had 40k email addresses entered on their site

Somehow have mine too :undecided:
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:07:57 AM
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

It's been mentioned before that Moat has been approached.

Has it been mentioned whether he's backing the NUST bid?
Moat is not part. I can safely say this could actually work.

Incidentally why isn't Moat part of it? Has he been approached? Has Shepherd? I would have thought fans with that sort of financial muscle would be ideal investors.

I think I read somewhere he has been approached but didn't respond/wasn't interested.

Well, I wish the NUST good luck but if fans with the clout of Moat or Sehpherd can't be persuaded to back the cause the whole premise of wanting a club owned by fans looks like wishful thinking which is unlikely to stand up in the face of cold hard financial reality.

Having read the details on the website, there's a very good reason why Moat/Shepherd won't be involved - its one member one vote - so if you put in £20m you have the same influence over the club as someone who puts in £1,500. This might end up being stumbling block to those with serious money to put in, or on the other hand it might end up being an example of perfect democracy, who knows. :undecided:

Yeah I agree but by the sounds of things they already have a fair few big players involved. I like how anyone can be involved and their money gets put into a pool so that NUST can buy that group of people a vote. Also like how you can buy a vote as a group of people you already know. It looks canny. If it runs the same way as Barca where you vote in a new president of the group every 4 years and he has the final say I think this could really work. The club can already bring in cash of it's own and then with the extra backing from the group I think the club would have more than sufficient funds.

I'm sure i saw something last week where a group of friends/work colleagues can group together and buy a share,  say 10 people put in £250 each or 5 put in £500 etc.  That was something that interested me,  i can't afford the full amount but think with a few mates and brother, dad we can get a couple of grand between us.

Yeah that's what I'm saying you can do that which is great I think.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:08:39 AM
how did they get my email address?

Have you filled in anything on their website?

Nope and I doubt they had 40k email addresses entered on their site

Somehow have mine too :undecided:

I think they'll have them from right at the very start where they asked if people were interested or wanted to hear more info. Theres a link to be removed isn't there ?
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Roger Kint on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:09:44 AM
how did they get my email address?

Have you filled in anything on their website?

Nope and I doubt they had 40k email addresses entered on their site

Somehow have mine too :undecided:

I think they'll have them from right at the very start where they asked if people were interested or wanted to hear more info. Theres a link to be removed isn't there ?

Only been on their site once and left without registering.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:09:48 AM
I dont really have any cash to invest atm however id be tempted to use a bit of my pension, after all im only 26 so have plenty time to get it back, anyone know more about this ? How it works eg ?

If your using your pension I'd wait for one of the Independent Financial Advisors that they mention and speak to one of them
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:10:29 AM
how did they get my email address?

Have you filled in anything on their website?

Nope and I doubt they had 40k email addresses entered on their site

Somehow have mine too :undecided:

I think they'll have them from right at the very start where they asked if people were interested or wanted to hear more info. Theres a link to be removed isn't there ?

Only been on their site once and left without registering.

No idea then. Don't think it's just the NUST think it's the other site as well. Forgotten it's name now.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:10:46 AM
Not sure why people get so het up about NUST, i'm not a member of them and I have made no contribution to the cause at the moment.  But i coming round to the idea. 

There is not going to be a super rich person buying the club like Man city.

It might have to be the fans.

At least some peopel are dping summik instead of sitting on the side lines twisting on about it.

Don't see anyone twisting tbh. If you don't like anyone asking questions I would suggest you're the one getting het up for no reason.

I'm not het,

If you have questions there is no point doing it on a forum, why dont the ones asking questions go to the NUST meetings and ask the questions directly.

I've seen the NUST get some bashing on this forum before.

I admit that some of the things they hve done in the past have mde me face/palm a couple of times.



By all means ask the mod to close the thread and no need to ask any questions or discuss anything to do with this subject.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:13:00 AM
Not sure why people get so het up about NUST, i'm not a member of them and I have made no contribution to the cause at the moment.  But i coming round to the idea. 

There is not going to be a super rich person buying the club like Man city.

It might have to be the fans.

At least some peopel are dping summik instead of sitting on the side lines twisting on about it.

Don't see anyone twisting tbh. If you don't like anyone asking questions I would suggest you're the one getting het up for no reason.

I'm not het,

If you have questions there is no point doing it on a forum, why dont the ones asking questions go to the NUST meetings and ask the questions directly.

I've seen the NUST get some bashing on this forum before.

I admit that some of the things they hve done in the past have mde me face/palm a couple of times.



By all means ask the mod to close the thread and no need to ask any questions or discuss anything to do with this subject.

Oh FFS Tron man, i was only passing comment, stop being a baby and get your toys back in the pram.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:22:28 AM
I do think NUST needs to put some sort of details on their site of the questions asked at the meetings and make them available (if they are there I've not seen them) just because many people can't get to the meetings or don't want to so other means must be made possible of they are wanting all Newcastle fans to put their money in.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Stu on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:34:15 AM
They've definitely been taking email addresses from somewhere, had three of them this morning and one of them to our football club email address :lol:
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: binnsy on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:39:31 AM
email thing is strange,  they have my email address cos i've had emails off them before but i haven't received one about the launch yet!
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: Big Geordie on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:58:42 AM
I think it's a good idea and I hope it attracts enough interest to make a go of it. Unfortunately, I don't have the spare cash to become involved (my little girl comes first) - but I wish the NUST well. At least they are trying to do something, rather than give in to the apathy which affects many of our fan base.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: JH on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:01:38 AM
Nobody emailed me :( They obviously don't want the 90m I won in the Euromillions last week. Oh well...
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Atticus on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:21:25 AM
I'm interested in all of this, personally. Looking forward to seeing what comes out over the coming weeks and I'm seriously considering investing.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:26:10 AM
I'm interested in all of this, personally. Looking forward to seeing what comes out over the coming weeks and I'm seriously considering investing.

Can they not take collections on match days , if they fail in their/our bid then the money collected on mtch days can go to a charity.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:27:19 AM
Not sure why people get so het up about NUST, i'm not a member of them and I have made no contribution to the cause at the moment.  But i coming round to the idea. 

There is not going to be a super rich person buying the club like Man city.

It might have to be the fans.

At least some peopel are dping summik instead of sitting on the side lines twisting on about it.

Don't see anyone twisting tbh. If you don't like anyone asking questions I would suggest you're the one getting het up for no reason.

I'm not het,

If you have questions there is no point doing it on a forum, why dont the ones asking questions go to the NUST meetings and ask the questions directly.

I've seen the NUST get some bashing on this forum before.

I admit that some of the things they hve done in the past have mde me face/palm a couple of times.



By all means ask the mod to close the thread and no need to ask any questions or discuss anything to do with this subject.

Oh FFS Tron man, i was only passing comment, stop being a baby and get your toys back in the pram.

Classic. You moan about people asking questions then tell me to shut up when I agree to what you say :lol:

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:38:06 AM
Not sure why people get so het up about NUST, i'm not a member of them and I have made no contribution to the cause at the moment.  But i coming round to the idea. 

There is not going to be a super rich person buying the club like Man city.

It might have to be the fans.

At least some peopel are dping summik instead of sitting on the side lines twisting on about it.

Don't see anyone twisting tbh. If you don't like anyone asking questions I would suggest you're the one getting het up for no reason.

I'm not het,

If you have questions there is no point doing it on a forum, why dont the ones asking questions go to the NUST meetings and ask the questions directly.

I've seen the NUST get some bashing on this forum before.

I admit that some of the things they hve done in the past have mde me face/palm a couple of times.



By all means ask the mod to close the thread and no need to ask any questions or discuss anything to do with this subject.

Oh FFS Tron man, i was only passing comment, stop being a baby and get your toys back in the pram.

Classic. You moan about people asking questions then tell me to shut up when I agree to what you say :lol:



Where in that line do I tell you to shut up tron?

I dont?  Classic, putting words into peoples mouths.  :lol:

Saying a thread should be locked in a childish huff.  :facepalm:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:38:56 AM
Makes a nice change to see some discussion going on about them and their proposals without the usual snidey pisstaking.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:42:03 AM
Makes a nice change to see some discussion going on about them and their proposals without the usual snidey pisstaking.

What's your thoughts ?

Time for a Newcastle Online group so this board has it's 1 vote :)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:42:26 AM
Do we know whether NUST have had any form of discussions with Ashley or the club, so that they know he's interested in listening to what they have to say?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Big Geordie on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:45:28 AM
Whether Ashley is prepared to listen or not will depend on how much the NUST have available to buy him out for. I can see him being vindictive over it and squeezing every last penny he can out of them before he agrees to sell. He's a c**t.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:45:43 AM
Do we know whether NUST have had any form of discussions with Ashley or the club, so that they know he's interested in listening to what they have to say?

I assume if a formal offer was made he'd listen.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Decky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:47:01 AM
Emailed me too. I wonder if any forums gave out a s*** load of emails? I cant seem to think of any other way they could have got our details ???
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:47:22 AM
Makes a nice change to see some discussion going on about them and their proposals without the usual snidey pisstaking.

What's your thoughts ?

Time for a Newcastle Online group so this board has it's 1 vote :)

Maybe so, maybe so.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:48:23 AM
how much are they looking for off each investor?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: madras on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:48:48 AM
well intentioned though it is i just can't see them getting 80million then enough goodwill off the banks to cater for an overdraft.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Decky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:48:55 AM
how much are they looking for off each investor?


Think its a minimum of 1.5k
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:49:03 AM
how much are they looking for off each investor?


80m
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:49:14 AM
Whether Ashley is prepared to listen or not will depend on how much the NUST have available to buy him out for. I can see him being vindictive over it and squeezing every last penny he can out of them before he agrees to sell. He's a c**t.

At the end of the day, if he sees cold hard cash in back account and he thinks its enough i think he'll take it.  I'm seriousy leaning towards investing in my club.  I'm sick of greedy bastarads running it who are unaccountable to the fans.

Enough is enough.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:50:13 AM
Do we know whether NUST have had any form of discussions with Ashley or the club, so that they know he's interested in listening to what they have to say?

I assume if a formal offer was made he'd listen.

It's a massive assumption though given the dislike both sides have for each other, that's why I've asked.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:52:20 AM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Decky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:53:33 AM
On the subject of the NUST, their rebrand is absolute quality compared to what they had before. The new website and logo are brilliant.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:54:21 AM
Do we know whether NUST have had any form of discussions with Ashley or the club, so that they know he's interested in listening to what they have to say?

I think they may have had tentative talks,  i was reading something on the NUST forum yesterday and it mentioned that the woman in charge of the financing of the SIPPS has/was in process of doing due dillegence.

Also shows why NUST took a back seat in the protests at the weekend, don't think it would look too good for them to be organising a big protest when they are wanting to open dialogue with Ashley to buy him out.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Big Geordie on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:55:01 AM
I can't imagine the likes of Shepherd or Moat wanting in this - they'll want more control for investing more cash. 1+1 isn't something they would be interested in.

The more and more I think about it, I 'could' invest some of my pension from my days when I worked at the Uni. I'd have to check it out with the wife first, however.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:55:25 AM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.
Title: Re: Newcastle United Supporters Trust
Post by: bealios on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:57:54 AM

I'm not het,

If you have questions there is no point doing it on a forum, why dont the ones asking questions go to the NUST meetings and ask the questions directly.

I've seen the NUST get some bashing on this forum before.

I admit that some of the things they hve done in the past have mde me face/palm a couple of times.



This is only going to succeed if it is open to all NUFC fans. If it is closed to people who can't easily attend the meetings then its a limited group you're aiming at. Hence the request for full detailed information, either in an investment memorandum, or published on a website.

If you ask the detailed financial questions at the meeting, the chances are that the answers will be aspirational i.e. what the guys starting this off would like to happen in an ideal world. Once you get the lawyers, accountants, tax advisors etc. involved you're likely to  get a different answer unfortunately. Which is why you need a proper investment memorandum and business plan approved by the trust lawyers/accountants so that they can sign off working capital provisions etc.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:59:03 AM
how much are they looking for off each investor?


Think its a minimum of 1.5k


£1500 is achievable at £10 a piece on the forum.


we should be looking to buy a few shares.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: SEMTEX on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:59:33 AM
If they send me another email, I'm gonna riot.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:01:48 PM
I can't imagine the likes of Shepherd or Moat wanting in this - they'll want more control for investing more cash. 1+1 isn't something they would be interested in.

The more and more I think about it, I 'could' invest some of my pension from my days when I worked at the Uni. I'd have to check it out with the wife first, however.

It depends on what people are investing for, to make money or actually invest in the football club which is part of our community.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Decky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:03:01 PM
how much are they looking for off each investor?


Think its a minimum of 1.5k


£1500 is achievable at £10 a piece on the forum.


we should be looking to buy a few shares.

I like that idea actually. Maybe we could start a thread similar to the donations thread?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:04:49 PM
What woud we rather be as a club, owned by some faceless coporate types who use the club as a vehicle for advertising and making money or a club thats intension is to play football and help the community around it.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:05:06 PM
how much are they looking for off each investor?


Think its a minimum of 1.5k


£1500 is achievable at £10 a piece on the forum.


we should be looking to buy a few shares.

I like that idea actually. Maybe we could start a thread similar to the donations thread?


we could start a pledge thread just to gauge interest,..

DAVE?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:05:35 PM
Do we know whether NUST have had any form of discussions with Ashley or the club, so that they know he's interested in listening to what they have to say?

I think they may have had tentative talks,  i was reading something on the NUST forum yesterday and it mentioned that the woman in charge of the financing of the SIPPS has/was in process of doing due dillegence.

Also shows why NUST took a back seat in the protests at the weekend, don't think it would look too good for them to be organising a big protest when they are wanting to open dialogue with Ashley to buy him out.

Kudos to the NUST for taking a more professional approach then. This is mostly what sceptics have been suggesting from the off and there's far more chance of being taken seriously if that's the case. I would still prefer Moat or any other local businessman to be involved and if that meant he had more say then so be it. That's more workable IMO, and far more likely to succeed.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:05:56 PM
I can't imagine the likes of Shepherd or Moat wanting in this - they'll want more control for investing more cash. 1+1 isn't something they would be interested in.

The more and more I think about it, I 'could' invest some of my pension from my days when I worked at the Uni. I'd have to check it out with the wife first, however.

If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Well, these are my thoughts exactly. Is it not more likely that the NUST will push for a split of, say, 60% NUST and the remainder to be covered by a large investor? To my mind, it's more realistic.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:06:52 PM
If every member 3000 people pleged £10 each the forum could buy 20 shares.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:07:57 PM
If every member 3000 people pleged £10 each the forum could buy 20 shares.

I can see cp40's mind glowing from here. 'THE POWER... THE POWER!'
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:08:08 PM
how much are they looking for off each investor?


Think its a minimum of 1.5k


£1500 is achievable at £10 a piece on the forum.


we should be looking to buy a few shares.

I like that idea actually. Maybe we could start a thread similar to the donations thread?

ooops forgot to donate to this board, dave!!! where do I go to donate.

Aye, i think N-O investing could be intersting.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:09:04 PM
If every member 3000 people pleged £10 each the forum could buy 20 shares.

I can see cp40's mind glowing from here. 'THE POWER... THE POWER!'

 I would be more a sleeping partner.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:09:26 PM
Anyway. Would they accept that? Surely, if that were the case the likes of Moat (or whoever) could stump up £50m and wangle it through 'individuals' and buy control of the club?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: madras on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:09:28 PM
If every member 3000 people pleged £10 each the forum could buy 20 shares.

I can see cp40's mind glowing from here. 'THE POWER... THE POWER!'

 I would be more a sleeping partner.
talk about a put off.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: jdckelly on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:10:43 PM
one problem with all this, why would ashley sell now when he can sell for more if we're promoted
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mowen on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:11:18 PM
If every member 3000 people pleged £10 each the forum could buy 20 shares.

I can see cp40's mind glowing from here. 'THE POWER... THE POWER!'

He thinks he's found a way to get Keegan back.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Big Geordie on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:13:23 PM
Isn't the German model that no-one person/organisation can own more than 49% of the the club (with the other 51% being fan controlled)? I think Hamburg are ran in such a way.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:13:53 PM
If every member 3000 people pleged £10 each the forum could buy 20 shares.

I can see cp40's mind glowing from here. 'THE POWER... THE POWER!'

He thinks he's found a way to get Keegan back.

Yeah, that c*** deserves to be taught a lesson.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:14:47 PM
If every member 3000 people pleged £10 each the forum could buy 20 shares.

I can see cp40's mind glowing from here. 'THE POWER... THE POWER!'

He thinks he's found a way to get Keegan back.

 :lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:15:10 PM
If every member 3000 people pleged £10 each the forum could buy 20 shares.

I can see cp40's mind glowing from here. 'THE POWER... THE POWER!'

He thinks he's found a way to get Keegan back.


my cunning plan is Foyled :angry:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Pav on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:18:08 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Is the right answer. Each person gets a vote and an equal voice.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:18:20 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No it's 1 vote per person no matter how much they invest
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Stu on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:18:55 PM
What woud we rather be as a club, owned by some faceless coporate types who use the club as a vehicle for advertising and making money or a club thats intension is to play football and help the community around it.



Can we run trials in July for local lads to earn a spot on the playing squad? :)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:20:17 PM
Anyway. About the N-O consortium (:lol:)--would there have to be equal donations? For example, cp40 puts in £5k and I chip in with a fiver, would we get equal say? :lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:20:43 PM
What woud we rather be as a club, owned by some faceless coporate types who use the club as a vehicle for advertising and making money or a club thats intension is to play football and help the community around it.



Can we run trials in July for local lads to earn a spot on the playing squad? :)

If they invest aye.  :lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:21:00 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No it's 1 vote per person no matter how much they invest


Is it? then it wouldnt be worth the forum clubbing together, wed be better off buying ourselves, or for example 2 or 3 people clubbing together to raise 1500.






Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:21:38 PM
Anyway. About the N-O consortium (:lol:)--would there have to be equal donations? For example, cp40 puts in £5k and I chip in with a fiver, would we get equal say? :lol:

 O0

stump up cp40, don't be a tight arse.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:22:12 PM
Anyway. About the N-O consortium (:lol:)--would there have to be equal donations? For example, cp40 puts in £5k and I chip in with a fiver, would we get equal say? :lol:

Yes. In fact, you'd get more of a say.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:23:04 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Is the right answer. Each person gets a vote and an equal voice.

Only to an extent though. It depends which decisions will be made by shareholders and which will be made by the elected board.

Once the board is in place it's probable that the majority of the decisions will be made by them, so if Moat takes a place on the board obviously his say increases over yours and mine.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:23:35 PM
how much are they looking for off each investor?


Think its a minimum of 1.5k


£1500 is achievable at £10 a piece on the forum.


we should be looking to buy a few shares.

I like that idea actually. Maybe we could start a thread similar to the donations thread?

ooops forgot to donate to this board, dave!!! where do I go to donate.


Here you go http://www.newcastle-online.org/nufcforum/index.php/topic,64978.new.html
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:23:45 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No it's 1 vote per person no matter how much they invest


Is it? then it wouldnt be worth the forum clubbing together, wed be better off buying ourselves, or for example 2 or 3 people clubbing together to raise 1500.


But then you would be individuals. The advantage of the forum is that we could have a collection of 20 votes that vote one way.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:23:59 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No it's 1 vote per person no matter how much they invest


Is it? then it wouldnt be worth the forum clubbing together, wed be better off buying ourselves, or for example 2 or 3 people clubbing together to raise 1500.








Er no,  We all chip in then vote on a rep.  That rep then votes on what gets agreed here.  That person attends the meetings etc.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:24:37 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Is the right answer. Each person gets a vote and an equal voice.

Only to an extent though. It depends which decisions will be made by shareholders and which will be made by the elected board.

Once the board is in place it's probable that the majority of the decisions will be made by them, so if Moat takes a place on the board obviously his say increases over yours and mine.


i see, the important decision made by the board appointed by the big investors. The little share holders vote on the prices in the cafes and bars.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:24:39 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Is the right answer. Each person gets a vote and an equal voice.

Only to an extent though. It depends which decisions will be made by shareholders and which will be made by the elected board.

Once the board is in place it's probable that the majority of the decisions will be made by them, so if Moat takes a place on the board obviously his say increases over yours and mine.

Which I think is the correct approach. Fans should just vote on who to appoint as chairman really.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:25:31 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No it's 1 vote per person no matter how much they invest


Is it? then it wouldnt be worth the forum clubbing together, wed be better off buying ourselves, or for example 2 or 3 people clubbing together to raise 1500.








Er no,  We all chip in then vote on a rep.  That rep then votes on what gets agreed here.  That person attends the meetings etc.


yeah with 1 vote. instead of dozens if we invest individually.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: geordie_b on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:27:05 PM
Emailed me too. I wonder if any forums gave out a s*** load of emails? I cant seem to think of any other way they could have got our details ???
Ive emailed them to find out
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:29:51 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Is the right answer. Each person gets a vote and an equal voice.

Only to an extent though. It depends which decisions will be made by shareholders and which will be made by the elected board.

Once the board is in place it's probable that the majority of the decisions will be made by them, so if Moat takes a place on the board obviously his say increases over yours and mine.

Which I think is the correct approach. Fans should just vote on who to appoint as chairman really.

Absolutely, it couldn't work any other way. It'll need to be made clear (as I'm sure it will be) exactly what say people are getting. There seems to be a gap at the minute between what people think will happen & what will actually be the case.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: bealios on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:31:36 PM
Not sure why everyone is so excited about them getting hold of the e-mail addresses - I get a ton of emails every day offering to enlarge my cock, and to keep it enlarged, and I definitely didn't ask for it. So what if a group trying to do something good for the club managed to get hold of some email addresses, it hasn't harmed my day.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:32:17 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No it's 1 vote per person no matter how much they invest


Is it? then it wouldnt be worth the forum clubbing together, wed be better off buying ourselves, or for example 2 or 3 people clubbing together to raise 1500.








Er no,  We all chip in then vote on a rep.  That rep then votes on what gets agreed here.  That person attends the meetings etc.


yeah with 1 vote. instead of dozens if we invest individually.

I thought the idea would be: we all chip in and get, say £15k, thus allowing us 10 individual shares, n'est pas? We can have 10 individuals to lodge these stakes, if needs be, to satisfy NUST's criteria. However, we vote collectively (and votes could be weighed against monies invested, so cp40 would get 1000 votes, and I'd get 1) and the majority decision is carried through: i.e. all 10 votes are cast accordingly.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Thorpinho on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:32:31 PM
I have been reading the NUST website and still don't really get how it works for someone who doesn't have any money. If I can not afford to pay the fees, am I then totally ignored even if I go every week?

I like the idea, its very very optimistic but its better than MA or like others said faceless corporations. I am just worried that if I don't have the money then I am not included and can't vote etc. I imagine there are a hell of a lot of similar fans who do not have the money.

So basically my question is how does the voting for these presidents, decisions etc apply to people without the large sums of money required to acquire a vote? Sorry if I have missed something obvious in the blurb.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:35:01 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Is the right answer. Each person gets a vote and an equal voice.

Only to an extent though. It depends which decisions will be made by shareholders and which will be made by the elected board.

Once the board is in place it's probable that the majority of the decisions will be made by them, so if Moat takes a place on the board obviously his say increases over yours and mine.

Which I think is the correct approach. Fans should just vote on who to appoint as chairman really.

Absolutely, it couldn't work any other way. It'll need to be made clear (as I'm sure it will be) exactly what say people are getting. There seems to be a gap at the minute between what people think will happen & what will actually be the case.



The investers appoint a board to run the club who make decisions, the board are answerable to the investers/fans.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:35:56 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No it's 1 vote per person no matter how much they invest


Is it? then it wouldnt be worth the forum clubbing together, wed be better off buying ourselves, or for example 2 or 3 people clubbing together to raise 1500.








Er no,  We all chip in then vote on a rep.  That rep then votes on what gets agreed here.  That person attends the meetings etc.


yeah with 1 vote. instead of dozens if we invest individually.

I thought the idea would be: we all chip in and get, say £15k, thus allowing us 10 individual shares, n'est pas? We can have 10 individuals to lodge these stakes, if needs be, to satisfy NUST's criteria. However, we vote collectively (and votes could be weighed against monies invested, so cp40 would get 1000 votes, and I'd get 1) and the majority decision is carried through: i.e. all 10 votes are cast accordingly.


hey man im skint. :sadnod:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:38:14 PM
Not that 10 shares would be any use at all, like. :lol: Be it'd be good fun!
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:39:21 PM
I have been reading the NUST website and still don't really get how it works for someone who doesn't have any money. If I can not afford to pay the fees, am I then totally ignored even if I go every week?

I like the idea, its very very optimistic but its better than MA or like others said faceless corporations. I am just worried that if I don't have the money then I am not included and can't vote etc. I imagine there are a hell of a lot of similar fans who do not have the money.

So basically my question is how does the voting for these presidents, decisions etc apply to people without the large sums of money required to acquire a vote? Sorry if I have missed something obvious in the blurb.

Even if you are not an investor and have little money but attend the meetings i'm sure they'd listen to your opinion.  WAY WAY better then Ashley and Shepherd put together.

I'm sure there are thousands of fans like you who are short at the minute but would love to invest in the future of nufc.

You'd have a voice am sure.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:40:04 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Is the right answer. Each person gets a vote and an equal voice.

Only to an extent though. It depends which decisions will be made by shareholders and which will be made by the elected board.

Once the board is in place it's probable that the majority of the decisions will be made by them, so if Moat takes a place on the board obviously his say increases over yours and mine.

Which I think is the correct approach. Fans should just vote on who to appoint as chairman really.

Absolutely, it couldn't work any other way. It'll need to be made clear (as I'm sure it will be) exactly what say people are getting. There seems to be a gap at the minute between what people think will happen & what will actually be the case.


Agree entirely. I think people are actually put off by the notion that 20 randomly selected tubby, replica shirt clad fans will be running the whole thing when that doesn't seem to be the case.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:41:38 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Is the right answer. Each person gets a vote and an equal voice.

Only to an extent though. It depends which decisions will be made by shareholders and which will be made by the elected board.

Once the board is in place it's probable that the majority of the decisions will be made by them, so if Moat takes a place on the board obviously his say increases over yours and mine.

Which I think is the correct approach. Fans should just vote on who to appoint as chairman really.

Absolutely, it couldn't work any other way. It'll need to be made clear (as I'm sure it will be) exactly what say people are getting. There seems to be a gap at the minute between what people think will happen & what will actually be the case.


Agree entirely. I think people are actually put off by the notion that 20 randomly selected tubby, replica shirt clad fans will be running the whole thing when that doesn't seem to be the case.

Yup it would have to be professional, this could be the chance for everyone who loves NUFC to save the club and put it back to be running as a football club.  The one that we know and love.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:46:41 PM
If, for example, Barry Moat puts in £60m: will he have the controlling vote? I know it's an extreme example.

No, not under the way it's structured (as I understand it)

You and I could put in £1500 each and have more say in theory.

Is the right answer. Each person gets a vote and an equal voice.

Only to an extent though. It depends which decisions will be made by shareholders and which will be made by the elected board.

Once the board is in place it's probable that the majority of the decisions will be made by them, so if Moat takes a place on the board obviously his say increases over yours and mine.

Which I think is the correct approach. Fans should just vote on who to appoint as chairman really.

Absolutely, it couldn't work any other way. It'll need to be made clear (as I'm sure it will be) exactly what say people are getting. There seems to be a gap at the minute between what people think will happen & what will actually be the case.


Agree entirely. I think people are actually put off by the notion that 20 randomly selected tubby, replica shirt clad fans will be running the whole thing when that doesn't seem to be the case.

Yup it would have to be professional, this could be the chance for everyone who loves NUFC to save the club and put it back to be running as a football club.  The one that we know and love.




cue beautiful music....
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:48:16 PM
I have been reading the NUST website and still don't really get how it works for someone who doesn't have any money. If I can not afford to pay the fees, am I then totally ignored even if I go every week?

I like the idea, its very very optimistic but its better than MA or like others said faceless corporations. I am just worried that if I don't have the money then I am not included and can't vote etc. I imagine there are a hell of a lot of similar fans who do not have the money.

So basically my question is how does the voting for these presidents, decisions etc apply to people without the large sums of money required to acquire a vote? Sorry if I have missed something obvious in the blurb.

In the questions and answers section is says you can donate to to NUST from as little as £10. Your money will be then added to other people likes yourselves and between you, you will get 1 vote. So everyone can have their say.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:50:55 PM
I have been reading the NUST website and still don't really get how it works for someone who doesn't have any money. If I can not afford to pay the fees, am I then totally ignored even if I go every week?

I like the idea, its very very optimistic but its better than MA or like others said faceless corporations. I am just worried that if I don't have the money then I am not included and can't vote etc. I imagine there are a hell of a lot of similar fans who do not have the money.

So basically my question is how does the voting for these presidents, decisions etc apply to people without the large sums of money required to acquire a vote? Sorry if I have missed something obvious in the blurb.

In the questions and answers section is says you can donate to to NUST from as little as £10. Your money will be then added to other people likes yourselves and between you, you will get 1 vote. So everyone can have their say.


right, but if you did it through here, you would have a forum to discuss with the people you share the investment with.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:54:04 PM
I have been reading the NUST website and still don't really get how it works for someone who doesn't have any money. If I can not afford to pay the fees, am I then totally ignored even if I go every week?

I like the idea, its very very optimistic but its better than MA or like others said faceless corporations. I am just worried that if I don't have the money then I am not included and can't vote etc. I imagine there are a hell of a lot of similar fans who do not have the money.

So basically my question is how does the voting for these presidents, decisions etc apply to people without the large sums of money required to acquire a vote? Sorry if I have missed something obvious in the blurb.

In the questions and answers section is says you can donate to to NUST from as little as £10. Your money will be then added to other people likes yourselves and between you, you will get 1 vote. So everyone can have their say.


right, but if you did it through here, you would have a forum to discuss with the people you share the investment with.

That's true if a forum thing did happen
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:56:17 PM
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: WarrenBartonCentrePartin on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 12:58:33 PM
I'd imagine that it would work around buying shares in the club, and having a vote on who you'd want to appoint as chairman, or "president" to use the continental method.  If there's a chance to attend meetings as a shareholder, I'd imagine it would only be to hear the pitch of potential chairmen.

Unfortunately I think voting on everyday issues are just pipe dreams at the minute.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:05:17 PM
I'd imagine that it would work around buying shares in the club, and having a vote on who you'd want to appoint as chairman, or "president" to use the continental method.  If there's a chance to attend meetings as a shareholder, I'd imagine it would only be to hear the pitch of potential chairmen.

Unfortunately I think voting on everyday issues are just pipe dreams at the minute.

As I've said before I think it's fortunately rather than unfortunately that we can't vote on everyday issues
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:07:01 PM
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

This is what happened at Notts County, isn't it? The trust took a vote and flogged the club to a Middle East lot.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:10:07 PM
It sounds like there would be two categories of investor – the £1500 ones who would get a vote, and the large investors from big city institutions who I would assume would be effectively lending the money at a rate of interest. As others have pointed out, the second type of investor wouldn’t be prepared to invest a large amount of money if they were going to be outvoted by two people who’d invested £1500 each. They would need to be getting something else for their money, in the form of interest payments.

In which case, we’d be at a Glazer-type model where the owners of the club (ie the fans) are borrowing money at interest in order to finance the purchase and / or investment in the playing staff. In which case who would be liable for any debt? And would any major lender take the risk on what looks like a very amateur set-up?

The model that they seem to be wanting to avoid is the PLC, presumably because smaller investors would not get much of a say in decision-making, and they’re trying to hook people in on a democratic model.

This is all aside from the equally important issue of whether any of the people at NUST have any kind of senior experience in big business or financial management. It feels to me like they’re way out of their depth.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: WarrenBartonCentrePartin on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:13:04 PM
I'd imagine that it would work around buying shares in the club, and having a vote on who you'd want to appoint as chairman, or "president" to use the continental method.  If there's a chance to attend meetings as a shareholder, I'd imagine it would only be to hear the pitch of potential chairmen.

Unfortunately I think voting on everyday issues are just pipe dreams at the minute.

As I've said before I think it's fortunately rather than unfortunately that we can't vote on everyday issues
I meant unfortunately in regards to some who might think there's more than just an annual vote involved with being an investor.  Theres always the sorry scenario that those wealthy enough to invest aren't too clued up on football and where the best interests of a club lie.

Sound familiar?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:14:18 PM
It sounds like there would be two categories of investor – the £1500 ones who would get a vote, and the large investors from big city institutions who I would assume would be effectively lending the money at a rate of interest. As others have pointed out, the second type of investor wouldn’t be prepared to invest a large amount of money if they were going to be outvoted by two people who’d invested £1500 each. They would need to be getting something else for their money, in the form of interest payments.

In which case, we’d be at a Glazer-type model where the owners of the club (ie the fans) are borrowing money at interest in order to finance the purchase and / or investment in the playing staff. In which case who would be liable for any debt? And would any major lender take the risk on what looks like a very amateur set-up?

The model that they seem to be wanting to avoid is the PLC, presumably because smaller investors would not get much of a say in decision-making, and they’re trying to hook people in on a democratic model.

This is all aside from the equally important issue of whether any of the people at NUST have any kind of senior experience in big business or financial management. It feels to me like they’re way out of their depth.


Loaning money in what way ? Because it's pensionable you mean ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:14:33 PM
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

This is what happened at Notts County, isn't it? The trust took a vote and flogged the club to a Middle East lot.

Was it sold at a profit, if so any idea what happened to the surplus/profit - did the trust/shareholders trouser it ?
That would make it a more attractive proposition for anyone thinking investing pension money etc.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: MW on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:14:39 PM
Anyway. Would they accept that? Surely, if that were the case the likes of Moat (or whoever) could stump up £50m and wangle it through 'individuals' and buy control of the club?

Is what I'm thinking, he could easily do this to get control and just pay the "individuals" a bit to make them vote his way
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:14:58 PM
I'd imagine that it would work around buying shares in the club, and having a vote on who you'd want to appoint as chairman, or "president" to use the continental method.  If there's a chance to attend meetings as a shareholder, I'd imagine it would only be to hear the pitch of potential chairmen.

Unfortunately I think voting on everyday issues are just pipe dreams at the minute.

As I've said before I think it's fortunately rather than unfortunately that we can't vote on everyday issues
I meant unfortunately in regards to some who might think there's more than just an annual vote involved with being an investor.  Theres always the sorry scenario that those wealthy enough to invest aren't too clued up on football and where the best interests of a club lie.

Sound familiar?

:D
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:22:40 PM
It sounds like there would be two categories of investor – the £1500 ones who would get a vote, and the large investors from big city institutions who I would assume would be effectively lending the money at a rate of interest. As others have pointed out, the second type of investor wouldn’t be prepared to invest a large amount of money if they were going to be outvoted by two people who’d invested £1500 each. They would need to be getting something else for their money, in the form of interest payments.

In which case, we’d be at a Glazer-type model where the owners of the club (ie the fans) are borrowing money at interest in order to finance the purchase and / or investment in the playing staff. In which case who would be liable for any debt? And would any major lender take the risk on what looks like a very amateur set-up?

The model that they seem to be wanting to avoid is the PLC, presumably because smaller investors would not get much of a say in decision-making, and they’re trying to hook people in on a democratic model.

This is all aside from the equally important issue of whether any of the people at NUST have any kind of senior experience in big business or financial management. It feels to me like they’re way out of their depth.


Loaning money in what way ? Because it's pensionable you mean ?

I don't think the smaller £1500 investors will be lending money. The model seems to be that they would be the owners, and either pay themselves some kind of dividend or not, depending on the democratic vote.

The lenders would be the larger financial institutions. I've classified them in a different way because I can't see that they would want to own an institution and therefore be liable for its debts if they could be easily outvoted by smaller investors. That's the whole reason why PLCs work the way they do - the more you invest, the more say you have.

The NUST blurb is very vague in this area. Obviously, the larger the amount that they can obtain from fans chipping in £1500, the less dependent they are on outside investment. But they really would have to raise a lot from fans to attract any serious outside investment, as far as I can see.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:23:34 PM
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

This is what happened at Notts County, isn't it? The trust took a vote and flogged the club to a Middle East lot.

Was it sold at a profit, if so any idea what happened to the surplus/profit - did the trust/shareholders trouser it ?
That would make it a more attractive proposition for anyone thinking investing pension money etc.

Not sure on the details, but I imagine this model is what NUST are looking at. However, the trust at Notts only owned 60% of the club, I believe, and I wonder if this is not the route that NUST would go down, with Moat (or whoever) stumping up the rest of the dough.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:26:33 PM
It sounds like there would be two categories of investor – the £1500 ones who would get a vote, and the large investors from big city institutions who I would assume would be effectively lending the money at a rate of interest. As others have pointed out, the second type of investor wouldn’t be prepared to invest a large amount of money if they were going to be outvoted by two people who’d invested £1500 each. They would need to be getting something else for their money, in the form of interest payments.

In which case, we’d be at a Glazer-type model where the owners of the club (ie the fans) are borrowing money at interest in order to finance the purchase and / or investment in the playing staff. In which case who would be liable for any debt? And would any major lender take the risk on what looks like a very amateur set-up?

The model that they seem to be wanting to avoid is the PLC, presumably because smaller investors would not get much of a say in decision-making, and they’re trying to hook people in on a democratic model.

This is all aside from the equally important issue of whether any of the people at NUST have any kind of senior experience in big business or financial management. It feels to me like they’re way out of their depth.


That kind of confuses me too. I must be missing something ??
They want investors of £1500 minimum, but any size of investment equals only one vote, so why would I invest more that £1500 unless I'm going to see a return on my investment as I would in a PLC.

This should not be confused with the model in Germany/Spain where you are a club member for a small (possibly €10 annual subscription) and much like a working men's club you get to vote for a committee and on certain issues.
This seems more akin to what happened a few years ago when a flotation took place and we all bought shares in the belief we'd live happily ever after, except this time it won't be floated.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:33:46 PM
It sounds like there would be two categories of investor – the £1500 ones who would get a vote, and the large investors from big city institutions who I would assume would be effectively lending the money at a rate of interest. As others have pointed out, the second type of investor wouldn’t be prepared to invest a large amount of money if they were going to be outvoted by two people who’d invested £1500 each. They would need to be getting something else for their money, in the form of interest payments.

In which case, we’d be at a Glazer-type model where the owners of the club (ie the fans) are borrowing money at interest in order to finance the purchase and / or investment in the playing staff. In which case who would be liable for any debt? And would any major lender take the risk on what looks like a very amateur set-up?

The model that they seem to be wanting to avoid is the PLC, presumably because smaller investors would not get much of a say in decision-making, and they’re trying to hook people in on a democratic model.

This is all aside from the equally important issue of whether any of the people at NUST have any kind of senior experience in big business or financial management. It feels to me like they’re way out of their depth.


Loaning money in what way ? Because it's pensionable you mean ?

I don't think the smaller £1500 investors will be lending money. The model seems to be that they would be the owners, and either pay themselves some kind of dividend or not, depending on the democratic vote.

The lenders would be the larger financial institutions. I've classified them in a different way because I can't see that they would want to own an institution and therefore be liable for its debts if they could be easily outvoted by smaller investors. That's the whole reason why PLCs work the way they do - the more you invest, the more say you have.

The NUST blurb is very vague in this area. Obviously, the larger the amount that they can obtain from fans chipping in £1500, the less dependent they are on outside investment. But they really would have to raise a lot from fans to attract any serious outside investment, as far as I can see.

Thanks
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:38:31 PM
It sounds like there would be two categories of investor – the £1500 ones who would get a vote, and the large investors from big city institutions who I would assume would be effectively lending the money at a rate of interest. As others have pointed out, the second type of investor wouldn’t be prepared to invest a large amount of money if they were going to be outvoted by two people who’d invested £1500 each. They would need to be getting something else for their money, in the form of interest payments.

In which case, we’d be at a Glazer-type model where the owners of the club (ie the fans) are borrowing money at interest in order to finance the purchase and / or investment in the playing staff. In which case who would be liable for any debt? And would any major lender take the risk on what looks like a very amateur set-up?

The model that they seem to be wanting to avoid is the PLC, presumably because smaller investors would not get much of a say in decision-making, and they’re trying to hook people in on a democratic model.

This is all aside from the equally important issue of whether any of the people at NUST have any kind of senior experience in big business or financial management. It feels to me like they’re way out of their depth.


That kind of confuses me too. I must be missing something ??
They want investors of £1500 minimum, but any size of investment equals only one vote, so why would I invest more that £1500 unless I'm going to see a return on my investment as I would in a PLC.

This should not be confused with the model in Germany/Spain where you are a club member for a small (possibly €10 annual subscription) and much like a working men's club you get to vote for a committee and on certain issues.
This seems more akin to what happened a few years ago when a flotation took place and we all bought shares in the belief we'd live happily ever after, except this time it won't be floated.

I don't think you're missing anything. I think this problem is the reason they're so vague about the structure.

It seems like they're trying to have it every which way - empowering the small investor whilst still attracting the large investor. Unfortunately he who pays the piper etc etc
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: shellshock on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 01:58:02 PM
The whole buy out is based on the concept of one share certificate = one vote, regardless of the amount you invest (the minimum investment for a shre certificate is £2500.  The larger investors will get a better return, ie: 2% of £25000 is greater than 2% of £2500.

The one share certificate = one vote is paramount so that no one person / individual can take over at some point in the future.  A properly elected NUST board will look after the trust issues, and a 'president' will be elected by the people who have invested in the buy out, a professional board would be appointed (commercial director, finace director, legal director, SIP investment director, along with 6 democraticaly elected NUST members) to run the club and be responsible for all operational and football matters.

This will be communicated as the campaign progresses, it would be too much to produce everything today in one go.  All that is asked at the moment is that investors place 10% of their pledged investment into an escrow account, set up and managed independtly from the NUST by a local credible legal firm.  If the buy out does not go ahead, then the deposit would be returned less admin fes, there has to be admin fees, up to now everybody has basically worked pro bono (for nowt!!), but we are now asking financial institutions and businesses to become involed in large money moving tansacations etc, so there will be fees, thats normal in business.

Please keep asking the questions, and please keep reading up on whats happening with the campaign, and hopefully you will be persuaded to invest and help move the club forward, or if you cant invest due to financial reasons then at least back us in what we are trying to do.

Cheers guys and girls.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:00:39 PM
What 'return' are you referring to?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:04:10 PM
£2,500?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:04:29 PM
£2,500?

Yes, please.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:14:36 PM
The whole buy out is based on the concept of one share certificate = one vote, regardless of the amount you invest (the minimum investment for a shre certificate is £2500.  The larger investors will get a better return, ie: 2% of £25000 is greater than 2% of £2500.

The one share certificate = one vote is paramount so that no one person / individual can take over at some point in the future.  A properly elected NUST board will look after the trust issues, and a 'president' will be elected by the people who have invested in the buy out, a professional board would be appointed (commercial director, finace director, legal director, SIP investment director, along with 6 democraticaly elected NUST members) to run the club and be responsible for all operational and football matters.

This will be communicated as the campaign progresses, it would be too much to produce everything today in one go.  All that is asked at the moment is that investors place 10% of their pledged investment into an escrow account, set up and managed independtly from the NUST by a local credible legal firm.  If the buy out does not go ahead, then the deposit would be returned less admin fes, there has to be admin fees, up to now everybody has basically worked pro bono (for nowt!!), but we are now asking financial institutions and businesses to become involed in large money moving tansacations etc, so there will be fees, thats normal in business.

Please keep asking the questions, and please keep reading up on whats happening with the campaign, and hopefully you will be persuaded to invest and help move the club forward, or if you cant invest due to financial reasons then at least back us in what we are trying to do.

Cheers guys and girls.

It's £1,500 now, isn't it?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:19:23 PM
I'm not sure why the fans on the board should only be allowed to be selected from NUSC members.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cubaricho on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:19:39 PM
What a bad bad idea.  These are some of the last people I would want in charge of this club.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:19:42 PM
Right, so if i go and raid my pension fund for this, how much do i need to put in to help/invest in the clubs future?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:21:13 PM
What a bad bad idea.  These are some of the last people I would want in charge of this club.

Yet you are happy for none elected w*****s to run a group of nations called the EU. :razz:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:26:30 PM
What a bad bad idea.  These are some of the last people I would want in charge of this club.

Assuming Mike Ashley is dead last fan ownership is a step up, surely?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:28:22 PM
What a bad bad idea.  These are some of the last people I would want in charge of this club.

Assuming Mike Ashley is dead last fan ownership is a step up, surely?

 :undecided:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:29:24 PM
What a bad bad idea.  These are some of the last people I would want in charge of this club.

Assuming Mike Ashley is dead last fan ownership is a step up, surely?

 :undecided:

Even if its  doing badly at least its accountable to the fans.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cubaricho on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:36:57 PM
What a bad bad idea.  These are some of the last people I would want in charge of this club.

Assuming Mike Ashley is dead last fan ownership is a step up, surely?

I would wager that even at this point having Mike Ashley is better than NUST running the club.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:37:54 PM
What a bad bad idea.  These are some of the last people I would want in charge of this club.

Assuming Mike Ashley is dead last fan ownership is a step up, surely?

I would wager that even at this point having Mike Ashley is better than NUST running the club.

f*** off :lol:

Anyone but Mike Ashley, fans included, could do a better job of running this club. For one we wouldn't have been relegated last season.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: UV on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:40:57 PM
I'm not sure why the fans on the board should only be allowed to be selected from NUSC members.

I'm pretty sure anyone stumping up £1500+ would have the £10 subs waived and automatically become a member of the NUST. Or would you want someone on the board who wasn't willing to put up even £1500? If I were voting on board members I'd certainly want them to be materially invested in it.

What a bad bad idea.  These are some of the last people I would want in charge of this club.

Specifically who and specifically why? Or are you just basing that statement on the anti-NUSC propaganda spread about by Ashley sympathisers last year?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 02:42:18 PM
I'm not sure why the fans on the board should only be allowed to be selected from NUSC members.

I'm pretty sure anyone stumping up £1500+ would have the £10 subs waived and automatically become a member of the NUST. Or would you want someone on the board who wasn't willing to put up even £1500? If I were voting on board members I'd certainly want them to be materially invested in it.

What a bad bad idea.  These are some of the last people I would want in charge of this club.

Specifically who and specifically why? Or are you just basing that statement on the anti-NUSC propaganda spread about last by Ashley sympathisers last year?

UV, Burnip knows all and knows best. 
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:02:50 PM
The whole buy out is based on the concept of one share certificate = one vote, regardless of the amount you invest (the minimum investment for a shre certificate is £2500.  The larger investors will get a better return, ie: 2% of £25000 is greater than 2% of £2500.

The one share certificate = one vote is paramount so that no one person / individual can take over at some point in the future.  A properly elected NUST board will look after the trust issues, and a 'president' will be elected by the people who have invested in the buy out, a professional board would be appointed (commercial director, finace director, legal director, SIP investment director, along with 6 democraticaly elected NUST members) to run the club and be responsible for all operational and football matters.

This will be communicated as the campaign progresses, it would be too much to produce everything today in one go.  All that is asked at the moment is that investors place 10% of their pledged investment into an escrow account, set up and managed independtly from the NUST by a local credible legal firm.  If the buy out does not go ahead, then the deposit would be returned less admin fes, there has to be admin fees, up to now everybody has basically worked pro bono (for nowt!!), but we are now asking financial institutions and businesses to become involed in large money moving tansacations etc, so there will be fees, thats normal in business.

Please keep asking the questions, and please keep reading up on whats happening with the campaign, and hopefully you will be persuaded to invest and help move the club forward, or if you cant invest due to financial reasons then at least back us in what we are trying to do.

Cheers guys and girls.

As has been mentioned you say £2500 the site says £1500, which is right ?

And where does the 2% return come from ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TooonDoom on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:03:50 PM
Please correct me if I am wrong but....

Say the fund raises £80,000,000 and makes that offer to Ashley.  Ashley says na no thanks.  The "Yes we can" campaign says oh well we tried lets return people money (minus 5%).  They keep £4,000,000 as admin fees.  

What happens to that £4,000,000?  
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:04:40 PM
The whole buy out is based on the concept of one share certificate = one vote, regardless of the amount you invest (the minimum investment for a shre certificate is £2500.  The larger investors will get a better return, ie: 2% of £25000 is greater than 2% of £2500.

The one share certificate = one vote is paramount so that no one person / individual can take over at some point in the future.  A properly elected NUST board will look after the trust issues, and a 'president' will be elected by the people who have invested in the buy out, a professional board would be appointed (commercial director, finace director, legal director, SIP investment director, along with 6 democraticaly elected NUST members) to run the club and be responsible for all operational and football matters.

This will be communicated as the campaign progresses, it would be too much to produce everything today in one go.  All that is asked at the moment is that investors place 10% of their pledged investment into an escrow account, set up and managed independtly from the NUST by a local credible legal firm.  If the buy out does not go ahead, then the deposit would be returned less admin fes, there has to be admin fees, up to now everybody has basically worked pro bono (for nowt!!), but we are now asking financial institutions and businesses to become involed in large money moving tansacations etc, so there will be fees, thats normal in business.

Please keep asking the questions, and please keep reading up on whats happening with the campaign, and hopefully you will be persuaded to invest and help move the club forward, or if you cant invest due to financial reasons then at least back us in what we are trying to do.

Cheers guys and girls.

Don't need accurate figures, but what kind of "ball park" salaries and contracts will be on offer for the Commercial, Financial, Legal and SIP directors. The best people won't come cheap.
Will these posts be advertised or do you already have people in mind ?

Is the 2% return on investment guaranteed ? And if so how ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:05:46 PM
Please correct me if I am wrong but....

Say the fund raises £80,000,000 and makes that offer to Ashley.  Ashley says na no thanks.  The "Yes we can" campaign says oh well we tried lets return people money (minus 5%).  They keep £4,000,000 as admin fees.  

What happens to that £4,000,000?  

Solicitor fees, must be something they have agreed with the solicitor. I assume they will have a larger pot than just £80m to bid from however.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:05:47 PM
Please correct me if I am wrong but....

Say the fund raises £80,000,000 and makes that offer to Ashley.  Ashley says na no thanks.  The "Yes we can" campaign says oh well we tried lets return people money (minus 5%).  They keep £4,000,000 as admin fees.  

What happens to that £4,000,000?  

The companies dealing with moving money about get that, they dont do it for free.  NUST wouldn't see it.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: MW on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:06:33 PM
Please correct me if I am wrong but....

Say the fund raises £80,000,000 and makes that offer to Ashley.  Ashley says na no thanks.  The "Yes we can" campaign says oh well we tried lets return people money (minus 5%).  They keep £4,000,000 as admin fees.  

What happens to that £4,000,000?  

Needed to run the campaign?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: gekkotime on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:06:36 PM
I don't want to sound like I'm against this, but I just can't see how this could work in the current financial state of the club.

Let's assume NUST succeeds in raising 80-90m, and buys the club. But the club is losing money aorn, is not in a position to take out a loan, and the squad needs strenghtening. How is NUST planning on financing the club after they bought it?
Who's going to run the club? How much control will the shareholders get? Will there be (x-)yearly elections like in Spain? If so, who's planning to "run for president"?

I don't see a lot of sense in coming forward with this announcement without publishing a detailed account of their future plans. I also have reservations about this whole election thing, politics and business require a different skillset and motivation, i'm not very fond of mixing the two.  
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:07:50 PM

Don't need accurate figures, but what kind of "ball park" salaries and contracts will be on offer for the Commercial, Financial, Legal and SIP directors. The best people won't come cheap.
Will these posts be advertised or do you already have people in mind ?


Surely this is part of the job of the chairman of the club not the job of NUST ? The salaries would therefore come out of the clubs budget as it does now ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:09:26 PM
I don't want to sound like I'm against this, but I just can't see how this could work in the current financial state of the club.

Let's assume NUST succeeds in raising 80-90m, and buys the club. But the club is losing money aorn, is not in a position to take out a loan, and the squad needs strenghtening. How is NUST planning on financing the club after they bought it?
Who's going to run the club? How much control will the shareholders get? Will there be (x-)yearly elections like in Spain? If so, who's planning to "run for president"?

I don't see a lot of sense in coming forward with this announcement without publishing a detailed account of their future plans. I also have reservations about this whole election thing, politics and business require a different skillset and motivation, i'm not very fond of mixing the two.  

I do think it would have been better them coming out with a business plan before asking for the cash.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:10:27 PM
Surely the admin fees would be closer to £40,000 if the magic number was £80 million as it's 5% of the 10% deposit?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:11:01 PM
I'm not sure why the fans on the board should only be allowed to be selected from NUSC members.

I'm pretty sure anyone stumping up £1500+ would have the £10 subs waived and automatically become a member of the NUST. Or would you want someone on the board who wasn't willing to put up even £1500? If I were voting on board members I'd certainly want them to be materially invested in it.


 NUST alienated a lot of supporters last season and there's still an element of distrust between them and a lot of fans.

I wouldn't have any problem in an independant person or persons being on the board who isn't involved with the Trust. It's how the majority of large company boards are made up in fact.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:13:05 PM

Don't need accurate figures, but what kind of "ball park" salaries and contracts will be on offer for the Commercial, Financial, Legal and SIP directors. The best people won't come cheap.
Will these posts be advertised or do you already have people in mind ?


Surely this is part of the job of the chairman of the club not the job of NUST ? The salaries would therefore come out of the clubs budget as it does now ?

I'm sure it will be and I'm sure they would, but it doesn't answer the questions I asked.
I'm sure they will be able to answer, you can hardly commence a multi million pound takeover without plans for what happens should the takeover succeed.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:13:16 PM
Surely the admin fees would be closer to £40,000 if the magic number was £80 million as it's 5% of the 10% deposit?

Man talks sense
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:14:41 PM
I'm not sure why the fans on the board should only be allowed to be selected from NUSC members.

I'm pretty sure anyone stumping up £1500+ would have the £10 subs waived and automatically become a member of the NUST. Or would you want someone on the board who wasn't willing to put up even £1500? If I were voting on board members I'd certainly want them to be materially invested in it.


 NUST alienated a lot of supporters last season and there's still an element of distrust between them and a lot of fans.

I wouldn't have any problem in an independant person or persons being on the board who isn't involved with the Trust. It's how the majority of large company boards are made up in fact.

If I remember correctly it was suggested to FFS during audits that the club should have a non member on the board. They got round it somehow
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:15:02 PM
I don't want to sound like I'm against this, but I just can't see how this could work in the current financial state of the club.

Let's assume NUST succeeds in raising 80-90m, and buys the club. But the club is losing money aorn, is not in a position to take out a loan, and the squad needs strenghtening. How is NUST planning on financing the club after they bought it?
Who's going to run the club? How much control will the shareholders get? Will there be (x-)yearly elections like in Spain? If so, who's planning to "run for president"?

I don't see a lot of sense in coming forward with this announcement without publishing a detailed account of their future plans. I also have reservations about this whole election thing, politics and business require a different skillset and motivation, i'm not very fond of mixing the two.  

Sshh !  This is no time for a reality check.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:15:43 PM

Don't need accurate figures, but what kind of "ball park" salaries and contracts will be on offer for the Commercial, Financial, Legal and SIP directors. The best people won't come cheap.
Will these posts be advertised or do you already have people in mind ?


Surely this is part of the job of the chairman of the club not the job of NUST ? The salaries would therefore come out of the clubs budget as it does now ?

I'm sure it will be and I'm sure they would, but it doesn't answer the questions I asked.
I'm sure they will be able to answer, you can hardly commence a multi million pound takeover without plans for what happens should the takeover succeed.

i agree, like I said seems strange to ask for cash without a business plan. Just not sure we're asking the questions at the correct place. Would be good if NUST could get someone to answer all these questions on all the different sites.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:20:27 PM
Surely the admin fees would be closer to £40,000 if the magic number was £80 million as it's 5% of the 10% deposit?

Man talks sense

Not entirely sure, as that would imply that takeover discussions would be taking place on the strength of an £8M escrow account.
Ashley made it clear he needed to see the real money previously, so I think it should be clarified whether it's 5% of the pledged amount or 5% of the amount required to make the deal happen.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:20:54 PM
I'm not sure why the fans on the board should only be allowed to be selected from NUSC members.

I'm pretty sure anyone stumping up £1500+ would have the £10 subs waived and automatically become a member of the NUST. Or would you want someone on the board who wasn't willing to put up even £1500? If I were voting on board members I'd certainly want them to be materially invested in it.


 NUST alienated a lot of supporters last season and there's still an element of distrust between them and a lot of fans.

I wouldn't have any problem in an independant person or persons being on the board who isn't involved with the Trust. It's how the majority of large company boards are made up in fact.

If I remember correctly it was suggested to FFS during audits that the club should have a non member on the board. They got round it somehow

By setting up the FLC which was cockless.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:22:21 PM
I'm not sure why the fans on the board should only be allowed to be selected from NUSC members.

I'm pretty sure anyone stumping up £1500+ would have the £10 subs waived and automatically become a member of the NUST. Or would you want someone on the board who wasn't willing to put up even £1500? If I were voting on board members I'd certainly want them to be materially invested in it.


 NUST alienated a lot of supporters last season and there's still an element of distrust between them and a lot of fans.

I wouldn't have any problem in an independant person or persons being on the board who isn't involved with the Trust. It's how the majority of large company boards are made up in fact.

If I remember correctly it was suggested to FFS during audits that the club should have a non member on the board. They got round it somehow

By setting up the FLC which was cockless.

I wasn't suggesting what they did was a good idea, they just got round it on the audit. The audit had it there for a good reason so NUST should do it.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:24:28 PM
Surely the admin fees would be closer to £40,000 if the magic number was £80 million as it's 5% of the 10% deposit?

Man talks sense

Not entirely sure, as that would imply that takeover discussions would be taking place on the strength of an £8M escrow account.
Ashley made it clear he needed to see the real money previously, so I think it should be clarified whether it's 5% of the pledged amount or 5% of the amount required to make the deal happen.

It's from the escrow account

Quote
Supporters will be asked to pledge 10% of their investment into this account which would be returned if the bid was unsuccessful.

Maybe they have £2m in the bank already from one of their investors that gets mentioned as all Ashley wanted to progress with the sale was proof of £10m.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:53:40 PM

Don't need accurate figures, but what kind of "ball park" salaries and contracts will be on offer for the Commercial, Financial, Legal and SIP directors. The best people won't come cheap.
Will these posts be advertised or do you already have people in mind ?


Surely this is part of the job of the chairman of the club not the job of NUST ? The salaries would therefore come out of the clubs budget as it does now ?

I'm sure it will be and I'm sure they would, but it doesn't answer the questions I asked.
I'm sure they will be able to answer, you can hardly commence a multi million pound takeover without plans for what happens should the takeover succeed.

i agree, like I said seems strange to ask for cash without a business plan. Just not sure we're asking the questions at the correct place. Would be good if NUST could get someone to answer all these questions on all the different sites.

Well purely out of interest I've registered for this. I've not been asked for any money yet and have absolutely no intention of paying over anything unless I do see a workable business plan. I am sceptical that NUST can launch a robust and viable plan and am pretty certain that attempting to do any sort of deal with Ashley would be a complete nightmare. But I applaud the initiative and will follow it closely.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 03:59:58 PM
May be a daft question but where is this £80m figure to raise coming from? Surely not based on the fact that Moat was offered the club at that price BEFORE Ashley said no and 'injected £20m into it'? The price as previously would be at least £100m provided Ashley actually chooses to sell up in whatever timeframe this would all be in? :undecided:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:00:59 PM
It's quite bizarre that this has been their most ambitious, fanciful plan yet and at the same time their least divisive.

I don't think i've seen an NUST discussion as tame as this one on here.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:02:05 PM
It's quite bizarre that this has been their most ambitious, fanciful plan yet and at the same time their least divisive.

I don't think i've seen an NUST discussion as tame as this one on here.

Know what you mean, guess everyones keeping their powder dry til the full details are released.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:02:25 PM
May be a daft question but where is this £80m figure to raise coming from?

People on here. I don't think NUST have set a magic amount yet.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:07:33 PM
At least they

Don't need accurate figures, but what kind of "ball park" salaries and contracts will be on offer for the Commercial, Financial, Legal and SIP directors. The best people won't come cheap.
Will these posts be advertised or do you already have people in mind ?


Surely this is part of the job of the chairman of the club not the job of NUST ? The salaries would therefore come out of the clubs budget as it does now ?

I'm sure it will be and I'm sure they would, but it doesn't answer the questions I asked.
I'm sure they will be able to answer, you can hardly commence a multi million pound takeover without plans for what happens should the takeover succeed.

i agree, like I said seems strange to ask for cash without a business plan. Just not sure we're asking the questions at the correct place. Would be good if NUST could get someone to answer all these questions on all the different sites.

The pledges of money promised by big businesses is impressive although it sounds unlikely.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:08:41 PM
It's quite bizarre that this has been their most ambitious, fanciful plan yet and at the same time their least divisive.

I don't think i've seen an NUST discussion as tame as this one on here.

Know what you mean, guess everyones keeping their powder dry til the full details are released.

True. Also I don't think too many people want to diss any attempt to do something positive, even if it might ultimately come to nothing. 
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:10:11 PM
May be a daft question but where is this £80m figure to raise coming from?

People on here. I don't think NUST have set a magic amount yet.

 O0
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:22:49 PM
Apologies as Ive not had time to read the whole thread (its been a busy day so far) so things I say here may have already been said/ discussed.

Firstly, lets dispel the rumour about us writing to members asking them to invest. Below is the email that was sent out, its aim is to inform and notify people of whats going on, its not designed to say "give us your cash now" thats not what we are saying..

Quote
Today the Newcastle United Supporters Trust formally launches an ambitious bid to take back our football club. We need supporters like yourself to back a supporter takeover - for more information visit http://www.nust.org.uk

There are a number of ways to invest in the club and after discussions with serious Newcastle-based investors we believe that the time is right for the fans to lead the charge and reclaim their football club. The investment is backed by a local consortium of companies advising the Trust, and we've made sure that any investment is safe and guaranteed to be returned to you if the bid fails.

The Yes We Can campaign will run for 6 weeks, and we have a financial target which we are not announcing yet, as we want to negotiate from a position of strength with Mike Ashley.

The fans can lead the way where others have failed - by standing together and investing together - we can make our club the shining beacon of honesty and integrity and bring the city together to save our club from the current regime, its mistakes and its calculated snubs.

When Derek Llambias said the fans could not buy the club - we said YES WE CAN - and now we aim to prove it with your support.

Newcastle United Supporters Trust on Behalf of the City of Newcastle, Geordies and Newcastle Supporters everywhere.

My first advice is simple and straight forward. Clear your mind of any thoughts you may have had, statements such as "the NUST alienated a lot of people last year" and such, people are talking about early on when we were protesting, things that we are now being slated for not doing. We felt it was right to do that then, others didnt, fair enough but as has been said on here many a time, the past is the past, we were learning (and still are), we're not experts or experienced in this, we're just a group of fans that felt we needed to start something.

The next thing to do is to read everything thats released about the scheme, whats there now is the overview and information on how it can be done. Over the next few days/ weeks we'll be releasing more, thats for a number of reasons, firstly we dont want to swamp everyone with tons of financial gumph on day 1. Theres no reason why you have to jump in now and sign up, paying over your cash today, no reason at all and frankly anyone who does so is mad in my view.

Read everything, take in what it means for you as an investor, decide which route (if any) you would be interested in, get further info on it either from what we release or by speaking to a financial advisor, we are going to have details of the 27 or so Indipendant Advisors throughout the North East that will be involved in this. Theres going to be a place opening in town where you can drop in and discuss your particular aspects with someone face to face. After speaking to one of our people to get the full facts etc then have a think, if you're then considering it Id say go and talk about it with someone you know personally and trust who has financial experience. Only then should you consider investing.

We're not here to rip off people or buy a football club and get ourselves on the board. Someone made the point about why all the board members had to be Trust people, maybe its a misunderstanding of the meaning Im not sure but whats meant by that is all of those involved would be investors, Ant and Dec may stick a million in each, the bloke that owns Sage might put in 2, you however could have invested the minimum, you've all got the same right to be on that board, if you can show your ability and forward thinking then maybe you will be. Someone who has put nothing in however has no right however to be there. If you thought it mean current committee members then you're wrong. Being on the committee for the NUST has absolutely no bearing on the board of the club, Id be hugely surprised if I for instance got a role in there, delighted obviously but I reckon there'll be a thousand ahead of me with better CVs for the positions.

The President will be elected by the investors, one member one vote thats the rule so same as above applies. The President however is less likely to be one of us unknowns in the business world because you want someone who has experience of big business and multi million pound decisions, someone with a football past as well as business. We cant say who would be standing because we dont know yet and wont until the day we have bought the club.

One question Ive seen already in this thread is where the day to day running costs will come from, we are realistically believe we could raise around £200m through the plan we have in place, that may sound fanciful but when you imagine it would be 8,000 people investing £25000 pension and not actually forking out any cash themselves then it becomes quite realistic (thats not taking into account the cash investors or big business/ individual investments). Overall it could be possible to actually raise £300m.

What is important to remember is that £200m @ 2% interest is £4m, roughly the same as we are paying per year in interest on the £40m overdraft and that once we've raised £100m, £200m or even £300m we dont have to stop however the financiers would have to predict the overall impact long term on the amount we pay in interest etc so somewhere there would be a break point.

People are questioning whether Moat is involved and why he didnt speak to us when he was "attempting" to buy the club. Those that see it as a bad thing against the NUST should maybe have a sit back and think of the other possible reasons why he didnt. Maybe just maybe he wasnt the white knight hes being seen as, what I will say is that our bid does not involves the football club paying to buy itself and make someone a big profit in the future. Make of that what you will.

Everything thats being planned has been drawn up with professional people, not just a fanciful idea ran past a solicitor, welder, shop assistant and civil servant or two sat at a committee meeting, its been scrutinised, discussed, amended and redrafted a number of times to make it what you will see over the coming weeks.

Talk of the Barcelona on the Tyne are not wrong, IF this works then we will have achieved something which only one other football league club (Exeter City) currently has, full fan ownership, we however will be the biggest by a country mile. I was speaking to Exeter reps at the Supporters Direct AGM a few weeks ago and although they're not a big successful club they hold their own and more importantly would not change it for the world.

Thats another thing that really needs to be drawn out, the increase in income this could generate, a successful club which is heavily linked with the local community will bring more money into the city, increase the feel good factor for both the club and city and as a result increase the ticket sales and merchandise.

Oh and St James' Park will always be St James' Park when its owned by the fans.

Apologies if Ive not answered a lot of the questions, Im happy to answer anything you put forward, if I have the answer, if someone else has it then I'll get it but if its things such as "when will we see Champions League football under this regime" then Im not going to bullshit and say we'll be there next year.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:28:48 PM
One thing I will say is the new image is definitely working and has helped to dispel alot of negative imagery taken over from when it was NUSC. The logo is f***ing lush as well.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:34:54 PM
Apologies as Ive not had time to read the whole thread (its been a busy day so far) so things I say here may have already been said/ discussed.

Firstly, lets dispel the rumour about us writing to members asking them to invest. Below is the email that was sent out, its aim is to inform and notify people of whats going on, its not designed to say "give us your cash now" thats not what we are saying..

Quote
Today the Newcastle United Supporters Trust formally launches an ambitious bid to take back our football club. We need supporters like yourself to back a supporter takeover - for more information visit http://www.nust.org.uk

There are a number of ways to invest in the club and after discussions with serious Newcastle-based investors we believe that the time is right for the fans to lead the charge and reclaim their football club. The investment is backed by a local consortium of companies advising the Trust, and we've made sure that any investment is safe and guaranteed to be returned to you if the bid fails.

The Yes We Can campaign will run for 6 weeks, and we have a financial target which we are not announcing yet, as we want to negotiate from a position of strength with Mike Ashley.

The fans can lead the way where others have failed - by standing together and investing together - we can make our club the shining beacon of honesty and integrity and bring the city together to save our club from the current regime, its mistakes and its calculated snubs.

When Derek Llambias said the fans could not buy the club - we said YES WE CAN - and now we aim to prove it with your support.

Newcastle United Supporters Trust on Behalf of the City of Newcastle, Geordies and Newcastle Supporters everywhere.

My first advice is simple and straight forward. Clear your mind of any thoughts you may have had, statements such as "the NUST alienated a lot of people last year" and such, people are talking about early on when we were protesting, things that we are now being slated for not doing. We felt it was right to do that then, others didnt, fair enough but as has been said on here many a time, the past is the past, we were learning (and still are), we're not experts or experienced in this, we're just a group of fans that felt we needed to start something.

The next thing to do is to read everything thats released about the scheme, whats there now is the overview and information on how it can be done. Over the next few days/ weeks we'll be releasing more, thats for a number of reasons, firstly we dont want to swamp everyone with tons of financial gumph on day 1. Theres no reason why you have to jump in now and sign up, paying over your cash today, no reason at all and frankly anyone who does so is mad in my view.

Read everything, take in what it means for you as an investor, decide which route (if any) you would be interested in, get further info on it either from what we release or by speaking to a financial advisor, we are going to have details of the 27 or so Indipendant Advisors throughout the North East that will be involved in this. Theres going to be a place opening in town where you can drop in and discuss your particular aspects with someone face to face. After speaking to one of our people to get the full facts etc then have a think, if you're then considering it Id say go and talk about it with someone you know personally and trust who has financial experience. Only then should you consider investing.

We're not here to rip off people or buy a football club and get ourselves on the board. Someone made the point about why all the board members had to be Trust people, maybe its a misunderstanding of the meaning Im not sure but whats meant by that is all of those involved would be investors, Ant and Dec may stick a million in each, the bloke that owns Sage might put in 2, you however could have invested the minimum, you've all got the same right to be on that board, if you can show your ability and forward thinking then maybe you will be. Someone who has put nothing in however has no right however to be there. If you thought it mean current committee members then you're wrong. Being on the committee for the NUST has absolutely no bearing on the board of the club, Id be hugely surprised if I for instance got a role in there, delighted obviously but I reckon there'll be a thousand ahead of me with better CVs for the positions.

The President will be elected by the investors, one member one vote thats the rule so same as above applies. The President however is less likely to be one of us unknowns in the business world because you want someone who has experience of big business and multi million pound decisions, someone with a football past as well as business. We cant say who would be standing because we dont know yet and wont until the day we have bought the club.

One question Ive seen already in this thread is where the day to day running costs will come from, we are realistically believe we could raise around £200m through the plan we have in place, that may sound fanciful but when you imagine it would be 8,000 people investing £25000 pension and not actually forking out any cash themselves then it becomes quite realistic (thats not taking into account the cash investors or big business/ individual investments). Overall it could be possible to actually raise £300m.

What is important to remember is that £200m @ 2% interest is £4m, roughly the same as we are paying per year in interest on the £40m overdraft and that once we've raised £100m, £200m or even £300m we dont have to stop however the financiers would have to predict the overall impact long term on the amount we pay in interest etc so somewhere there would be a break point.

People are questioning whether Moat is involved and why he didnt speak to us when he was "attempting" to buy the club. Those that see it as a bad thing against the NUST should maybe have a sit back and think of the other possible reasons why he didnt. Maybe just maybe he wasnt the white knight hes being seen as, what I will say is that our bid does not involves the football club paying to buy itself and make someone a big profit in the future. Make of that what you will.

Everything thats being planned has been drawn up with professional people, not just a fanciful idea ran past a solicitor, welder, shop assistant and civil servant or two sat at a committee meeting, its been scrutinised, discussed, amended and redrafted a number of times to make it what you will see over the coming weeks.

Talk of the Barcelona on the Tyne are not wrong, IF this works then we will have achieved something which only one other football league club (Exeter City) currently has, full fan ownership, we however will be the biggest by a country mile. I was speaking to Exeter reps at the Supporters Direct AGM a few weeks ago and although they're not a big successful club they hold their own and more importantly would not change it for the world.

Thats another thing that really needs to be drawn out, the increase in income this could generate, a successful club which is heavily linked with the local community will bring more money into the city, increase the feel good factor for both the club and city and as a result increase the ticket sales and merchandise.

Oh and St James' Park will always be St James' Park when its owned by the fans.

Apologies if Ive not answered a lot of the questions, Im happy to answer anything you put forward, if I have the answer, if someone else has it then I'll get it but if its things such as "when will we see Champions League football under this regime" then Im not going to bullshit and say we'll be there next year.


While I still have doubts as to whether this will work in practice, in theory it's a very exciting idea. I really hope it takes off :thup:

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:36:07 PM
Cheers for clearing up the bit about the board. It was suggested by someone else who I assume is from NUSC that only NUSC members could be elected rather than anyone putting finance in.

I do think you should consider people outside of the shareholders for non executive type roles, subject to them being voted for by the shareholders of course. Nothing wrong with at least one pair of independant eyes.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:38:40 PM
One other thing I would add is that people should notice something missing from our publicity on this compared to everyone else thats ever talked about owning the club (including the current regime).

We're not making pie in the sky predictions for the future, we're not saying buy into this and we'll win the Premiership in three years or we'll install Shearer, Keegan, Mouriniho in the hot seat, we'll not promise a giant screen so you can see adverts during the game or tell you you'll get a free season ticket. The board you install may well promise or do all those things but that would be down to them (and you).

What we do promise is your chance to make a difference to the football club you love, your chance to say "you were part of something huge" and most importantly we promise to try wherever possible to make our football club a club that you're proud to be part of.

Im expecting my first child in January, a boy, one day I want him to run out at SJP, if we pull this off then that day will be a thousand times sweeter should it happen.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:41:21 PM
I do think you should consider people outside of the shareholders for non executive type roles, subject to them being voted for by the shareholders of course. Nothing wrong with at least one pair of independant eyes.

Can you clarify why you think its a good thing to do? Im not saying I disagree just personally I feel you'd have to have an affinity with the club to be on the board. If theres 8000 people who have staked their future in this, should they not have more of a right to be there and what would someone that hasnt put money in bring to the table that they wouldnt?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ericz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:41:37 PM
I do admire their spirit.

Compared to many self-proclaimed fans out there, they are in fact attempting to do something and/or putting their words/thoughts into action, rather than engaged in mere chatters.

I don't see why others criticism(s) against them can be warranted.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:47:52 PM
I do think you should consider people outside of the shareholders for non executive type roles, subject to them being voted for by the shareholders of course. Nothing wrong with at least one pair of independant eyes.

Can you clarify why you think its a good thing to do? Im not saying I disagree just personally I feel you'd have to have an affinity with the club to be on the board. If theres 8000 people who have staked their future in this, should they not have more of a right to be there and what would someone that hasnt put money in bring to the table that they wouldnt?

yeah, you'll have to wait until I'm not posting on my phone though. :lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:48:21 PM
I do think you should consider people outside of the shareholders for non executive type roles, subject to them being voted for by the shareholders of course. Nothing wrong with at least one pair of independant eyes.

Can you clarify why you think its a good thing to do? Im not saying I disagree just personally I feel you'd have to have an affinity with the club to be on the board. If theres 8000 people who have staked their future in this, should they not have more of a right to be there and what would someone that hasnt put money in bring to the table that they wouldnt?

So is the intention for the elected board to be made up of a selection of the 8000 or so shareholders?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 04:58:58 PM
The 6 members of the board that come from the Trust (ie not the President and his elected three positions) would be taken from the x thousands of investors. Everyone who has a vote also has a right to stand for election to the board.

I think the Barca model is different in the fact that they randomly elect people to the board, that personally doesnt seem fair or totally sensible to me, saying that theyve not done too badly from it like  bluelaugh.gif

My understanding of our model is that people will stand for election to the board, they will put forward their CVs (for want of a better word) and all members would then decide who they felt were the most able to bring something worthwhile to the table.

As someone pointed out earlier, there would be nothing to stop 20 of you on N-O each buying a share and agreeing who to vote for at the time, thats perfectly understandable and legal after all Id assume the person you'd put forward would be sensibly elected on here first. Maybe we'll see a board that has a rep from N-O, one from Toontastic and another from Skunkers all elected in the same way. I dont necessarily see that as a bad thing as long as we're careful who we put forward from each!

Apologies if Im not putting it across right, its clear in my head but not necessarily as easy to convey.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 05:02:42 PM
Apologies if Im not putting it across right, its clear in my head but not necessarily as easy to convey.

No, that's just what I wanted to know more about. Cheers :thup:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Inferior Acuña on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 05:05:27 PM
George Caulkin article:

http://timesonline.typepad.com/thegame/2009/11/newcastle-fans-launch-takeover-campaign.html#more

[quoteThe emails were dispatched at 2am on Tuesday morning. All 40,000 of them, which the Newcastle United Supporters Trust [NUST] believes might just make it the biggest-ever mail-out to football fans. In spite of the bleary-eyed hour, within the first 20 minutes, 120 people had signed up for more information and pledges of financial backing had come from as far afield as Australia.

There was a humbling message from an orphanage in Ghana, where the NUST have previously sent Newcastle shirts to disadvantaged children, kids whose lives put notions such as sport, victory and defeat into its proper perspective, with an offer to invest £5. In emotive terms, a value could not be placed on their gesture and at that moment, their challenge felt that bit more manageable.

Eight hours later, the NUST officially launched a six-week campaign to raise awareness about their ‘Yes We Can‘ proposal to buy Newcastle United from Mike Ashley. Organisers stood on the Millennium Bridge their backs to a mural on the exterior of the Baltic art gallery. “Victory to the miners,” it read. “Victory to the working class.” It felt like a symbolic message.

Their scheme is bold and it has to be, but it has not been formulated on the back of a cigarette packet. Over the past few months and weeks, they have spoken to fans‘ groups, local businesses (it is understood that Barry Moat, whose recent takeover attempt failed, is not one of them), institutions and politicians about the viability of their project and how to take it forward. As they put it, “It’s about reclaiming our football club for the city". 

They mean business. About £35,000 will be spent on an advertising campaign, the initial aim of which is to raise enough money (£10million would be a decent start) to demonstrate their intent to larger investors who, the NUSC insists, are already committed in principle. And, indeed, to Ashley. They have, they say, some impressive partners on board, whose identities will be revealed over the coming days.

The ultimate goal is fan ownership of Newcastle, a model operated, famously, by Barcelona, but also elsewhere, with a president voted for by members who would themselves be able to stand for election to the trust’s board. It will require investment from individuals, from a minimum £1,500 in cash or the reallocation of pension funds. All of that information can be found here.

Could it work? Yes. Will it? That, of course, is the £80m question (or however much Ashley now values Newcastle at), and it is not coincidental that the NUST have appropriated Barack Obama’s optimisitc, against-the-odds campaign slogan for last year’s American presidential election: ‘Yes we can’. What cannot be doubted is that they are good, decent, serious people who adore their football club.

A lot has been written and said about Ashley’s stewardship of Newcastle (even he has called it “catastrophic”). Most depressing about it is that alternatives have dissolved away. Aside from apathy or anger for the sake of it, only one remains. What follows is a brief chat with Mark Jensen, editor of the respected fanzine The Mag, who is acting as a spokesman for the campaign.

What is ‘Yes We Can’ all about?

MJ: “Everybody has seen the protests, both verbal and visible, against Mike Ashley and what’s happened at the club, but it’s not just about him. For years before him, the club wasn’t run in the way it should have been in most people’s eyes and the biggest protest comes now: the fans are leading the way in looking to buy the club. It sounds very ambitious, but everything we’ve done in the last few months behind the scenes - the research we’ve done with businesses and supporters - leads us to believe that it's definitely achievable. We’re putting the final touches to the business plan and this six-week campaign will see us advertising in the local media and doing various events to raise awareness. The first base is to get a seat at the table whereby representatives can negotiate with Mike Ashley the full amount to buy the club then that would become the target. In private, we've been meeting with very, very credible local businesses and people. They’ve assured us that as long as the fans have the appetite to raise X amount, they’ll come in behind it and make this all a reality.”

How do you persuade people that buying the club is a viable proposition?

MJ: “You only have to go back to 1997, when the club was floated on the Stock Market: the fans bought 10 per cent of the club then and, actually, the offer was oversubscribed. They were prepared to raise money then. The point has been reached now where everybody who is willing and able to could and should invest in the club. We’ve got an opportunity for Newcastle United to be the shining light in this country, as to how a club should be run. That’s the carrot being dangled in front of everybody; as well as having a club that could hopefully go on to win things, it would also be run in the right way and for all the right reasons. It isn’t just a few fans expecting to turn up and the run the club. It’s about fans giving the platform whereby fans, businesses and local institutions could all invest to make a viable club and then appoint people who could run it on a day-to-day basis. Nobody could tell me that what we’ve got in mind wouldn’t end up being better than what we’ve got now.”

So it’s about giving the club back to the city?

MJ: Reclaiming it, yes. That’s it in a nutshell. People are so fed up. But it’s been unbelievable this season. If you’d told me in the summer that Newcastle would be averaging crowds of more than 40,000 in these circumstances ... People are showing their opposition to Mike Ashley but also showing their support for the team and there was no better example of that than on Saturday. The atmosphere was brilliant and we were playing Peterborough United with nearly 44,000 people there. It was more than Liverpool had at home in the Premier League on Monday night. If anybody asks ‘how can Newcastle be a success in the future?’, that tells you everything. The fans desperately want to go and support their team and this is their opportunity to have much more than that.”

Newcastle are top of the league, but how perilous is the club’s position away from that?

MJ: “In the short-term you can look at the results and how we’re doing in the Championship and think that things aren’t too bad, but the more games we win and the more that promotion becomes a reality, the more it looks as though we would have to buy pretty much a whole new team. Judging on their past performances, I don’t think anybody would have faith in Ashley or Derek Llambias to successfully do that. People have been hoping that some white knight would be out there, but they have to accept that it’s very unlikely to happen. And that’s how we once felt about Ashley, too. He’s proved to be anything but. Maybe the salvation for Newcastle United is with the people who care most about it, ordinary fans and business people.

You’re asking for a big financial commitment from people. What guarantees do they have that their money will be looked after properly?

MJ: “Firstly, it’s not a case of fans looking after other fans’ money. It’s about appointing proper professional people, the best people possible, to do that job. As things stand, is Derek Llambias the best qualified person to be in control of the money that comes into the club now? I think we know the answer to that. We would emulate what successful clubs have done and learn from them - up until now, Newcastle haven’t done that and that’s why we’ve ended up in this position.

So you have substantive people waiting in the background who will become involved?

MJ: “Yes. Newcastle is a damaged brand - that’s one of those phrases we have to use these days - it’s a business and to be successful on the pitch, it has to be successful off it. There are very, very credible people from the local business community - names that people will recognise - who are committed to coming on board. But they need the fans to show they’ve got the appetite to do their bit and then, together, we can turn the club around. Maybe it wouldn’t work for those businesses to come in by themselves. Why can’t we create something much bigger and better than just expecting local businessmen to come in and do everything? Why shouldn’t we do our bit and, potentially, have a really sound, long-term investment in a club we all invest in week after week?

Long-term is the key, isn’t it?

MJ: “How quickly things can happen will depend on how many people respond. We’ve sent out 40,000 emails to names we’ve collected over the last few months and we’ve already had a very good response from them. The financial plan will be ready in six to seven days’ time, whereby people will have all the information they need as to how they can go about making an investment. We’ll be pointing towards independent financial advisors, because the level of investment possible depends on individual circumstances, but if it’s right for them, hopefully they’ll come on board. The committee members are all putting money into it - it's not throwing money down the drain, it’s about investing in what could be a great club again and a very successful business.”[/quote]
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 05:25:35 PM
The 6 members of the board that come from the Trust (ie not the President and his elected three positions) would be taken from the x thousands of investors. Everyone who has a vote also has a right to stand for election to the board.

I think the Barca model is different in the fact that they randomly elect people to the board, that personally doesnt seem fair or totally sensible to me, saying that theyve not done too badly from it like  bluelaugh.gif

My understanding of our model is that people will stand for election to the board, they will put forward their CVs (for want of a better word) and all members would then decide who they felt were the most able to bring something worthwhile to the table.

As someone pointed out earlier, there would be nothing to stop 20 of you on N-O each buying a share and agreeing who to vote for at the time, thats perfectly understandable and legal after all Id assume the person you'd put forward would be sensibly elected on here first. Maybe we'll see a board that has a rep from N-O, one from Toontastic and another from Skunkers all elected in the same way. I dont necessarily see that as a bad thing as long as we're careful who we put forward from each!

Apologies if Im not putting it across right, its clear in my head but not necessarily as easy to convey.


If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Village Idiot on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 05:27:28 PM
I think the Barca model is different in the fact that they randomly elect people to the board, that personally doesnt seem fair or totally sensible to me, saying that theyve not done too badly from it like  bluelaugh.gif

It works like this: the elected president names the board, and he names whoever he wishes, and he is fit to replace them as he wishes. Think of it as a Prime Minister and his cabinet. Then, every year during preseason, an assembly is held where members have to approve the budget and most major policies the board wants to conduct (for example the board had to obtain permission from the assembly in order to have a kit sponsor, the same when the name of the stadium was changed...). The assembly is made up of 4% (IIRC) of club members with more than a year of membership and over 18 years old, elected by lottery.

I like the model since it gives free reign to the board to act as it sees best, which is the way it should be in my opinion, while giving fans a check and balance at the end of the season. It's rare that the board loses a voting in the assembly, but it's also rare that the board will put forward measures that they know are rejected by the fans. To be completely honest not many people show up at the assembly when things go well, but that's to be expected I guess.

There are also mechanisms in place to impeach the president (and the board) if enough member signatures are collected (Laporta had to face a motion of no confidence last season, and only narrowly "won" it).

All that said, good luck. One of the things I'm most proud of my club is the fact it is fan-owned, I wish more could follow that way.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 05:27:30 PM
The 6 members of the board that come from the Trust (ie not the President and his elected three positions) would be taken from the x thousands of investors. Everyone who has a vote also has a right to stand for election to the board.

I think the Barca model is different in the fact that they randomly elect people to the board, that personally doesnt seem fair or totally sensible to me, saying that theyve not done too badly from it like  bluelaugh.gif

My understanding of our model is that people will stand for election to the board, they will put forward their CVs (for want of a better word) and all members would then decide who they felt were the most able to bring something worthwhile to the table.

As someone pointed out earlier, there would be nothing to stop 20 of you on N-O each buying a share and agreeing who to vote for at the time, thats perfectly understandable and legal after all Id assume the person you'd put forward would be sensibly elected on here first. Maybe we'll see a board that has a rep from N-O, one from Toontastic and another from Skunkers all elected in the same way. I dont necessarily see that as a bad thing as long as we're careful who we put forward from each!

Apologies if Im not putting it across right, its clear in my head but not necessarily as easy to convey.


Don't need accurate figures, but what kind of "ball park" salaries and contracts will be on offer for the Commercial, Financial, Legal and SIP directors. The best people won't come cheap.
Will these posts be advertised or do you already have people in mind ?

Is the 2% return on investment guaranteed ? And if so how ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 05:37:43 PM
Will these posts be advertised or do you already have people in mind ?

Is the 2% return on investment guaranteed ? And if so how ?

On the 1st question I dont have the answer, I know there are some names in the frame (and I promise you I dont know who the names are) but obviously not all of them yet as we dont know who else will come out of the woodwork as such and we'd be daft to draw up a list based on people we've spoken to and then say "right no more", the list wouldnt be drawn up until election time. As for the salaries, again I dont have that answer, you'd have to assume that they would be the going rate for that kind of position, its no good getting people on the cheap, at the same time theyre not going to be silly money above the likes of Man U, Chelsea etc. I'll ask the question but I would honestly assume that there is no actual figure decided yet.

The 2% is guaranteed for the first two years, after that its dependant on how the club is doing. Promotion would obviously see us having a higher income but as we know also higher outgoings. Nobody could say until two years time what the possible figures would be. Again I could do a Graham Roberts and promise 10% as in two years time who would remember? but frankly we're not interested in doing that, all answers will be honest ones not made up to get you to buy in.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 05:38:55 PM
As long as it's not a case of 'jobs for the boys' like it is now, then I'm all for this.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cinside on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 05:41:43 PM
I'll be investing. The club already 'owns' us. It's about time we owned the club so that we can create a club to be proud of again.  O0
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 06:13:39 PM
Will these posts be advertised or do you already have people in mind ?

Is the 2% return on investment guaranteed ? And if so how ?

On the 1st question I dont have the answer, I know there are some names in the frame (and I promise you I dont know who the names are) but obviously not all of them yet as we dont know who else will come out of the woodwork as such and we'd be daft to draw up a list based on people we've spoken to and then say "right no more", the list wouldnt be drawn up until election time. As for the salaries, again I dont have that answer, you'd have to assume that they would be the going rate for that kind of position, its no good getting people on the cheap, at the same time theyre not going to be silly money above the likes of Man U, Chelsea etc. I'll ask the question but I would honestly assume that there is no actual figure decided yet.

The 2% is guaranteed for the first two years, after that its dependant on how the club is doing. Promotion would obviously see us having a higher income but as we know also higher outgoings. Nobody could say until two years time what the possible figures would be. Again I could do a Graham Roberts and promise 10% as in two years time who would remember? but frankly we're not interested in doing that, all answers will be honest ones not made up to get you to buy in.

Thanks.
The elected board member structure is clear, it's the "managing" directors bit that interests me.
If as you say there are already "names in the frame" then it sounds like people already involved fancy the posts, which doesn't sound too good unless they already have considerable experience of running football clubs.

I assume if you say the 2% is guaranteed for 2 years it will be placed on deposit during that time ?
As most pensions funds have gained 25%+ in the last 9 months and lost 40% in the year before that it may or may not seem attractive to a potential investor, but as you say "after that it's dependant on how the club is doing"  which I assume means our investments will be more of a a market driven PLC type arrangement.

My questions stem from a post by "Shellshock" who sounded like he/she was from NUST, on page 6.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 06:15:09 PM
Well you've already suceeded IMO. Making it onto the FIFA 10 news scroll! :pow:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ObiChrisKenobi on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 06:17:16 PM
I can honestly see Mike Ashley refusing any bid from the trust just to p*ss them and the fans off - even if it matched his previous selling price.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 06:18:11 PM
I can honestly see Mike Ashley refusing any bid from the trust just to p*ss them and the fans off - even if it matched his previous selling price.

No chance. If it meets his asking price, he'd snap all 16000 hands off to get it and run away.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 06:51:47 PM

Compared to many self-proclaimed fans out there, they are in fact attempting to do something and/or putting their words/thoughts into action, rather than engaged in mere chatters.


To be more exact, they're attempting to do something with other people's money, including big chunks of people's pension funds. In that position, you have to know what you're doing, and to convince people that you know what you're doing.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: toonlass on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 06:54:32 PM
I was talking to someone about this today and they asked me to ask this.

"If you are a current season ticket holder, and you cannot afford to buy a stake, will the NUST guarantee that their seat is safe, that it won't be sold from underneath them to be given to stake holder?"
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dokko on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 07:04:58 PM
It's probably been mentioned, but so fuk, its worth hearing again:

"There was a humbling message from an orphanage in Ghana, where the NUST have previously sent Newcastle shirts to disadvantaged children, kids whose lives put notions such as sport, victory and defeat into its proper perspective, with an offer to invest £5. In emotive terms, a value could not be placed on their gesture and at that moment, their challenge felt that bit more manageable. "

 :weep:

Had a little shiver down the old spine when i read that.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 07:38:57 PM
The elected board member structure is clear, it's the "managing" directors bit that interests me.
If as you say there are already "names in the frame" then it sounds like people already involved fancy the posts, which doesn't sound too good unless they already have considerable experience of running football clubs.

When I talked about names in the frame though I made it clear that these were experienced business people, I honestly dont know any of the names because Im not involved in the discussions at that level. What I do know though is that these would be people that we would be happy to see running the club. As I also said, these are names that have been sounded out as to whether they were interested, more will appear as candidates Im sure as time goes on. Hell if you know someone suitable then make sure their name is in the frame.

None of the current committee have the experience to do this and would not be in there. I can safely say I wouldnt personally vote for them if they were. We need big business brains and a football knowledge. Thats not to say the President would have the football knowledge but you'd expect at least one of the people who surround him to have that.

At the end of the day, its the voters that decide the President. 5,6,10,15k Newcastle fans arent going to vote for some daft arsed shop assistant or civil servant over some self made business genius.

As I said earlier, this is not a stitch up to get ourselves in there and make a shed load of money. If you want that then give Moat a call and offer him your cash. As far as Im concerned, the day this happens and everything is in place then I will be moving back into working on the Supporters Club side of things and have nothing to do with the football club stuff. Theres many better qualified to sit on the board than the likes of me.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 07:44:11 PM
I was talking to someone about this today and they asked me to ask this.

"If you are a current season ticket holder, and you cannot afford to buy a stake, will the NUST guarantee that their seat is safe, that it won't be sold from underneath them to be given to stake holder?"

There are no plans for anything like this in fact in all honesty you'd have to assume that those that are willing to put £1500 or more into this are more than likely to be ST holders anyway, those that arent probably live too far away to attend regular games. We're not offering STs as part of the deal or giving any guarantees of anything other than a 2% return on your investment.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: toonlass on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 07:44:59 PM
I was talking to someone about this today and they asked me to ask this.

"If you are a current season ticket holder, and you cannot afford to buy a stake, will the NUST guarantee that their seat is safe, that it won't be sold from underneath them to be given to stake holder?"

There are no plans for anything like this in fact in all honesty you'd have to assume that those that are willing to put £1500 or more into this are more than likely to be ST holders anyway, those that arent probably live too far away to attend regular games. We're not offering STs as part of the deal or giving any guarantees of anything other than a 2% return on your investment.

Tbh, I said that I thought it would be like that.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 07:48:58 PM

Compared to many self-proclaimed fans out there, they are in fact attempting to do something and/or putting their words/thoughts into action, rather than engaged in mere chatters.
To be more exact, they're attempting to do something with other people's money, including big chunks of people's pension funds. In that position, you have to know what you're doing, and to convince people that you know what you're doing.

Not exactly true, a chunk of my pension will be tied up in this as well. I wouldnt ask anyone to do something I wasnt willing to do myself. You are right though. When doing something of this magnitude with other peoples money you do need to know exactly what you're doing, which we dont.

We do however have the backing of a shedload of people who do this day in day out and are willing to put their businesses names to it, if its not worked out properly then theres a hell of a lot more at stake for them than just personal pride. They believe its doable, theyve worked out the finer points and they are the ones that will be promoting this to their customers and the rest of the world.

You have to remember that you're not sending your money to a paypal account for the NUST, its not going to sit in our bank account while we try raising it. Funds will be paid to a top solicitors, regulated by the FSA and audited by relevant authorities.

We are merely the group that have put this in place.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: geordie_b on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 07:57:27 PM
peasepud, where were all of the email addresses used today gathered from? I have never given my email address to NUSC or NUST and recieved 2 emails. I have emailed NUST and recieved no response
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TaylorJ_01 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 07:59:22 PM
peasepud, where were all of the email addresses used today gathered from? I have never given my email address to NUSC or NUST and recieved 2 emails. I have emailed NUST and recieved no response

Did you sign the petition against the name change?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TaylorJ_01 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 08:06:04 PM
I wonder if anyone from the actual team would be interested in this. If they all put a weeks wages in it would probably help quite a bit!
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: geordie_b on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 08:11:19 PM
peasepud, where were all of the email addresses used today gathered from? I have never given my email address to NUSC or NUST and recieved 2 emails. I have emailed NUST and recieved no response

Did you sign the petition against the name change?

no
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:03:31 PM
In case anyone was wondering, Newcastle-Online did not and never would pass on members' account email addresses.

If members do not have their email address hidden via their account preferences however, there is nothing (barring time) preventing a member on here harvesting them.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Robster on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:10:17 PM
It's probably been mentioned, but so fuk, its worth hearing again:
"There was a humbling message from an orphanage in Ghana, where the NUST have previously sent Newcastle shirts to disadvantaged children, kids whose lives put notions such as sport, victory and defeat into its proper perspective, with an offer to invest £5. In emotive terms, a value could not be placed on their gesture and at that moment, their challenge felt that bit more manageable. "
 :weep:
Had a little shiver down the old spine when i read that.
Bloody hell
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Jill on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:13:48 PM
It's an interesting idea and I'll be following its progress. Got no spare money though so don't think I'll be joining in. :no:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:20:36 PM
It's an interesting idea and I'll be following its progress. Got no spare money though so don't think I'll be joining in. :no:


check the thread we were talking about clubbing together to buy NO shares for those who havent got 1500. £10 each was suggested.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Jill on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:22:56 PM
It's an interesting idea and I'll be following its progress. Got no spare money though so don't think I'll be joining in. :no:

check the thread we were talking about clubbing together to buy NO shares for those who havent got 1500. £10 each was suggested.

Aye, I saw, don't really fancy chipping in with others though. At least not random forumers, no offence intended btw. :lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cajun on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:23:43 PM
Without checking the thread can you still transfer a pension in to buy a share, one was bordering on £2,500 but if its now £1,500 I could definitely do it.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: johnnypd on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:34:06 PM
can't see this raising enough money, sadly, though i'd love to be proved wrong. How much dough did the liverpool fan's buyout raise?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:42:20 PM
It's an interesting idea and I'll be following its progress. Got no spare money though so don't think I'll be joining in. :no:

check the thread we were talking about clubbing together to buy NO shares for those who havent got 1500. £10 each was suggested.

Aye, I saw, don't really fancy chipping in with others though. At least not random forumers, no offence intended btw. :lol:


oh im offended alright, your basically saying i couldnt be trusted to share a £10 investment.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 09:46:38 PM
It's an interesting idea and I'll be following its progress. Got no spare money though so don't think I'll be joining in. :no:

check the thread we were talking about clubbing together to buy NO shares for those who havent got 1500. £10 each was suggested.

Aye, I saw, don't really fancy chipping in with others though. At least not random forumers, no offence intended btw. :lol:


oh im offended alright, your basically saying i couldnt be trusted to share a £10 investment.

Told you we shouldn't have invited her.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:00:22 PM

Compared to many self-proclaimed fans out there, they are in fact attempting to do something and/or putting their words/thoughts into action, rather than engaged in mere chatters.
To be more exact, they're attempting to do something with other people's money, including big chunks of people's pension funds. In that position, you have to know what you're doing, and to convince people that you know what you're doing.

Not exactly true, a chunk of my pension will be tied up in this as well. I wouldnt ask anyone to do something I wasnt willing to do myself. You are right though. When doing something of this magnitude with other peoples money you do need to know exactly what you're doing, which we dont.

We do however have the backing of a shedload of people who do this day in day out and are willing to put their businesses names to it, if its not worked out properly then theres a hell of a lot more at stake for them than just personal pride. They believe its doable, theyve worked out the finer points and they are the ones that will be promoting this to their customers and the rest of the world.

You have to remember that you're not sending your money to a paypal account for the NUST, its not going to sit in our bank account while we try raising it. Funds will be paid to a top solicitors, regulated by the FSA and audited by relevant authorities.

We are merely the group that have put this in place.


In that case, I'd suggest that the people who do know what they're doing, start talking, and fast.

If this is supposed to be a new era of openness and accountability, it doesn't look good that so much information is apparently being held back at this point. If you have all this financial backing and / or professional expertise on board with you at this point, then let's hear about it. The more detail you can give, the more confident people can be that this is a viable plan and not a dream. You say that you are 'merely the group that has put this in place', but you're the only people that are talking at the moment.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:05:59 PM
peasepud, where were all of the email addresses used today gathered from? I have never given my email address to NUSC or NUST and recieved 2 emails. I have emailed NUST and recieved no response

I can honestly say that I dont know, as far as I was aware these were email addresses that we had collected over a number of different campaigns, the petitions, signups, facebook, twitter that sort of thing. However Im not responsible for the website these days so I will check to confirm.

What I can safely say is that N-O have not passed on email addresses thats for sure, I and the other admins on TT would never do that and Im 110% sure that Dave, Phil and those responsible for this place wouldnt either.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:12:05 PM
In that case, I'd suggest that the people who do know what they're doing, start talking, and fast.

If this is supposed to be a new era of openness and accountability, it doesn't look good that so much information is apparently being held back at this point. If you have all this financial backing and / or professional expertise on board with you at this point, then let's hear about it. The more detail you can give, the more confident people can be that this is a viable plan and not a dream. You say that you are 'merely the group that has put this in place', but you're the only people that are talking at the moment.

No offence here but you're trying to find fault with this and using the lack of in depth information on day 1 to beat us with. As I said earlier, weve issued the important information to let people see what is involved and what sort of figures we're talking about. Nobody is asking anyone to part with cash at this stage all we've asked for is the name, email and Date of Birth of those that are interested, you dont even have to commit that much at this stage. In return we've stated that we'll send additional information out to those interested so they can see whats what.

No doubt we'll be putting that info into the public domain as well but frankly coming across with the whole "this is meant to be a new era of openness and accountability" is a bit crap tbh.

We're the only people talking because its day 1, lets see what happens in days 2, 3, 4....14...30..etc before ripping us apart eh?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:14:07 PM
Without checking the thread can you still transfer a pension in to buy a share, one was bordering on £2,500 but if its now £1,500 I could definitely do it.

My understanding is that the minimum pension investment is £25,000. Cash investments are £1,500.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:20:46 PM
In that case, I'd suggest that the people who do know what they're doing, start talking, and fast.

If this is supposed to be a new era of openness and accountability, it doesn't look good that so much information is apparently being held back at this point. If you have all this financial backing and / or professional expertise on board with you at this point, then let's hear about it. The more detail you can give, the more confident people can be that this is a viable plan and not a dream. You say that you are 'merely the group that has put this in place', but you're the only people that are talking at the moment.

No offence here but you're trying to find fault with this and using the lack of in depth information on day 1 to beat us with. As I said earlier, weve issued the important information to let people see what is involved and what sort of figures we're talking about. Nobody is asking anyone to part with cash at this stage all we've asked for is the name, email and Date of Birth of those that are interested, you dont even have to commit that much at this stage. In return we've stated that we'll send additional information out to those interested so they can see whats what.

No doubt we'll be putting that info into the public domain as well but frankly coming across with the whole "this is meant to be a new era of openness and accountability" is a bit crap tbh.

We're the only people talking because its day 1, lets see what happens in days 2, 3, 4....14...30..etc before ripping us apart eh?

Why don't you publish the 'additional information' now? What is it that's so secret?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Keefaz on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:24:29 PM
In that case, I'd suggest that the people who do know what they're doing, start talking, and fast.

If this is supposed to be a new era of openness and accountability, it doesn't look good that so much information is apparently being held back at this point. If you have all this financial backing and / or professional expertise on board with you at this point, then let's hear about it. The more detail you can give, the more confident people can be that this is a viable plan and not a dream. You say that you are 'merely the group that has put this in place', but you're the only people that are talking at the moment.

No offence here but you're trying to find fault with this and using the lack of in depth information on day 1 to beat us with. As I said earlier, weve issued the important information to let people see what is involved and what sort of figures we're talking about. Nobody is asking anyone to part with cash at this stage all we've asked for is the name, email and Date of Birth of those that are interested, you dont even have to commit that much at this stage. In return we've stated that we'll send additional information out to those interested so they can see whats what.

No doubt we'll be putting that info into the public domain as well but frankly coming across with the whole "this is meant to be a new era of openness and accountability" is a bit crap tbh.

We're the only people talking because its day 1, lets see what happens in days 2, 3, 4....14...30..etc before ripping us apart eh?

Why don't you publish the 'additional information' now? What is it that's so secret?

They have to release it in stages or it might blow...your...MIND!
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:25:44 PM
In that case, I'd suggest that the people who do know what they're doing, start talking, and fast.

If this is supposed to be a new era of openness and accountability, it doesn't look good that so much information is apparently being held back at this point. If you have all this financial backing and / or professional expertise on board with you at this point, then let's hear about it. The more detail you can give, the more confident people can be that this is a viable plan and not a dream. You say that you are 'merely the group that has put this in place', but you're the only people that are talking at the moment.

No offence here but you're trying to find fault with this and using the lack of in depth information on day 1 to beat us with. As I said earlier, weve issued the important information to let people see what is involved and what sort of figures we're talking about. Nobody is asking anyone to part with cash at this stage all we've asked for is the name, email and Date of Birth of those that are interested, you dont even have to commit that much at this stage. In return we've stated that we'll send additional information out to those interested so they can see whats what.

No doubt we'll be putting that info into the public domain as well but frankly coming across with the whole "this is meant to be a new era of openness and accountability" is a bit crap tbh.

We're the only people talking because its day 1, lets see what happens in days 2, 3, 4....14...30..etc before ripping us apart eh?

Why don't you publish the 'additional information' now? What is it that's so secret?

Give the man a chance. They've got to put together a business plan for this that will persuade people to part with proper money and commit pensions, that takes time. And whats the rush anyway - Ashley isn't going to p*ss away the club's cash resources in January is he?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:38:14 PM
Theres nothing secret, theres just a simple tried and tested method for running campaigns of this size and that is not to pile in with too much info in one go. Look at any public share issue thats been carried out for instance, they never issue a big pile of documentation in one go, the British Gas one ran for months with a simple strapline on radio, television and in newspapers. Everyone knew what it was for but it never gave any more than that away. They all do exactly as we have done, put out the basic overview and give people a day or so to take that in then move into the more in depth information.

Today was about giving the press and fans the overview, this is who we are, this is what we plan and this is basically how we do it. Theres no secret conspiracy because the pension experts havent come out and said their piece or the bankers theirs. They will do so when the time is right but rest assured it will be before we expect people to commit anything. Theres six weeks of this campaign to come, dont blow it all on one momentous day.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:52:24 PM
The elected board member structure is clear, it's the "managing" directors bit that interests me.
If as you say there are already "names in the frame" then it sounds like people already involved fancy the posts, which doesn't sound too good unless they already have considerable experience of running football clubs.

When I talked about names in the frame though I made it clear that these were experienced business people, I honestly dont know any of the names because Im not involved in the discussions at that level. What I do know though is that these would be people that we would be happy to see running the club. As I also said, these are names that have been sounded out as to whether they were interested, more will appear as candidates Im sure as time goes on. Hell if you know someone suitable then make sure their name is in the frame.

None of the current committee have the experience to do this and would not be in there. I can safely say I wouldnt personally vote for them if they were. We need big business brains and a football knowledge. Thats not to say the President would have the football knowledge but you'd expect at least one of the people who surround him to have that.

At the end of the day, its the voters that decide the President. 5,6,10,15k Newcastle fans arent going to vote for some daft arsed shop assistant or civil servant over some self made business genius.

As I said earlier, this is not a stitch up to get ourselves in there and make a shed load of money. If you want that then give Moat a call and offer him your cash. As far as Im concerned, the day this happens and everything is in place then I will be moving back into working on the Supporters Club side of things and have nothing to do with the football club stuff. Theres many better qualified to sit on the board than the likes of me.


Thanks but it doesn't really address the bit I wrote below the bit you highlighted which was :-

I assume if you say the 2% is guaranteed for 2 years it will be placed on deposit during that time ?
As most pensions funds have gained 25%+ in the last 9 months and lost 40% in the year before that it may or may not seem attractive to a potential investor, but as you say "after that it's dependant on how the club is doing"  which I assume means our investments will be more of a a market driven PLC type arrangement.


Also I've asked the following twice :-

If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?


Sorry if these questions are difficult, but I would have thought that on the day a multi-million pound  buyout plan is rolled out to the press and the public, you'd have been able to give potential investors this information.

I don't really understand why you said  to me "As I said earlier, this is not a stitch up to get ourselves in there and make a shed load of money. If you want that then give Moat a call and offer him your cash "  Is there something we should know about him ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 10:56:43 PM
PP your post above has explained some of the issues I raised in mine. :rolleyes:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:06:59 PM
Theres nothing secret, theres just a simple tried and tested method for running campaigns of this size and that is not to pile in with too much info in one go. Look at any public share issue thats been carried out for instance, they never issue a big pile of documentation in one go, the British Gas one ran for months with a simple strapline on radio, television and in newspapers. Everyone knew what it was for but it never gave any more than that away. They all do exactly as we have done, put out the basic overview and give people a day or so to take that in then move into the more in depth information.

Today was about giving the press and fans the overview, this is who we are, this is what we plan and this is basically how we do it. Theres no secret conspiracy because the pension experts havent come out and said their piece or the bankers theirs. They will do so when the time is right but rest assured it will be before we expect people to commit anything. Theres six weeks of this campaign to come, dont blow it all on one momentous day.



Well, seeing as you revealed in a previous post that you didn't actually know who these backers are, you'll forgive me if I remain a little sceptical.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:09:17 PM
Quote
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

Any alternative bid that was made would be a rival bid of course it would. However how that was perceived and dealt with would depend on the bid. If for instance Moat reappeared then, as far as Im concerned I cant see how that would change our plans as we know our model is better for the club.

if however some massive businessman came in and said "Ill buy the club and give the supporters 50% for free" then obviously that would need to be viewed differently. It would still need to be assessed to see exactly what was involved.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:10:54 PM
Quote
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

Any alternative bid that was made would be a rival bid of course it would. However how that was perceived and dealt with would depend on the bid. If for instance Moat reappeared then, as far as Im concerned I cant see how that would change our plans as we know our model is better for the club.

if however some massive businessman came in and said "Ill buy the club and give the supporters 50% for free" then obviously that would need to be viewed differently. It would still need to be assessed to see exactly what was involved.

How?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: geordie_b on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:13:56 PM
peasepud, where were all of the email addresses used today gathered from? I have never given my email address to NUSC or NUST and recieved 2 emails. I have emailed NUST and recieved no response

I can honestly say that I dont know, as far as I was aware these were email addresses that we had collected over a number of different campaigns, the petitions, signups, facebook, twitter that sort of thing. However Im not responsible for the website these days so I will check to confirm.

What I can safely say is that N-O have not passed on email addresses thats for sure, I and the other admins on TT would never do that and Im 110% sure that Dave, Phil and those responsible for this place wouldnt either.

I have now had an email from NUST explaining how they got my email address. Whilst im not over the moon about it the intentions were good
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:17:23 PM
Quote
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

Any alternative bid that was made would be a rival bid of course it would. However how that was perceived and dealt with would depend on the bid. If for instance Moat reappeared then, as far as Im concerned I cant see how that would change our plans as we know our model is better for the club.

if however some massive businessman came in and said "Ill buy the club and give the supporters 50% for free" then obviously that would need to be viewed differently. It would still need to be assessed to see exactly what was involved.


If that's what an acceptable bid would require, then I don't think you are going to see any acceptable bids. :idiot2:
We need businessmen running the show not lunatics.  By lunatic I mean the benevolent businessman not the fans - just to be clear.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: michaelfoster on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:18:17 PM
I have now had an email from NUST explaining how they got my email address. Whilst im not over the moon about it the intentions were good

What did it say?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:23:19 PM
Quote
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

Any alternative bid that was made would be a rival bid of course it would. However how that was perceived and dealt with would depend on the bid. If for instance Moat reappeared then, as far as Im concerned I cant see how that would change our plans as we know our model is better for the club.

if however some massive businessman came in and said "Ill buy the club and give the supporters 50% for free" then obviously that would need to be viewed differently. It would still need to be assessed to see exactly what was involved.

How?

Does smack slightly of naive arrogance.
I'm absolutely certain they do and it may well be, but this is the time for convincing potential subscribers/investors not themselves.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Jayson on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:31:07 PM
I like the idea, not sure how realistic a prospect it is but its something id be behind. The only issue as a few others have mentioned is i dont see Ashley selling anytime this season with the chance of promotion atall now. I think hes made his choice. Also the fact that you're basically on a deadline to raise this massive amount of money, before anyone else comes in to buy the club. Doesnt give you the biggest amount of time really, i dont see Ashley sticking around after the end of this season regardless of the outcome.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: midds on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:45:52 PM
First off, I've not got a spare £2500 (or anywhere near it tbh) to invest so I'm ruled out straight away. Secondly, it sounds like an excellent idea in theory. I've got some doubts as to whether or not enough cash can be raised to take over and keep things ticking along until the club begins to generate enough money to run itself properly though.

The other query (my apologies if it's already been answered elsewhere) is that I can't really see the incentive to more affluent people investing more money if they still only get one vote. I've read that the 'one share=one vote' thing is fundamental to it going ahead but why should a rich bloke put in, say, £50k if it only gets him the same voting power as someone who only chips in £2500?

I'm not trying to be negative and I hope things take off but I've got my doubts as to whether it'll actually come off. Credit to them for getting off their arses and attempting to do something positive to force some change.  :thup:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Tuesday 10 November 2009, 11:54:37 PM
Looks like i will invest but not on my own, having got one or two grand spare but after talking to a few people tonight am putting a little consortium of 10 and we'll put £250 in each,  initialy deposit is only £25 each.

Also would recommend that people who haven't joined NUST previously, for whatever reason, sign up and pay there tenner,  just think of the cash boost that say an extra 10000 people joining up this week adds to the pot, even better if 20000 join! The NUST are also linked to easy fundraising by signing up for that doing your xmas shopping online at places like amazon also puts money in the NUST's coffers.  Also saw today on Facebook that the ASHLEY OUT - UNITED FRONT protest group are selling ashley out t-shirts and all the money made from those t shirts are going to NUST as well.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: OzzieMandias on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 12:39:12 AM
Quote
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

Any alternative bid that was made would be a rival bid of course it would. However how that was perceived and dealt with would depend on the bid. If for instance Moat reappeared then, as far as Im concerned I cant see how that would change our plans as we know our model is better for the club.

if however some massive businessman came in and said "Ill buy the club and give the supporters 50% for free" then obviously that would need to be viewed differently. It would still need to be assessed to see exactly what was involved.

How?

I don't want to put words into Peasepud's mouth, but reading between his lines upthread he seems to be implying that Moat's plan would have meant that the cost of purchasing the club would be met out of the club's future income. The club would basically be acquiring more debt as the result of the change of ownership. Wouldn't surprise me if that was the case.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Decky on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 12:48:08 AM
This happened in Football Manager, and it worked. So that means its gonna happen and work in real life. Im convinced.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 12:56:01 AM
Quote
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

Any alternative bid that was made would be a rival bid of course it would. However how that was perceived and dealt with would depend on the bid. If for instance Moat reappeared then, as far as Im concerned I cant see how that would change our plans as we know our model is better for the club.

if however some massive businessman came in and said "Ill buy the club and give the supporters 50% for free" then obviously that would need to be viewed differently. It would still need to be assessed to see exactly what was involved.

How?

I don't want to put words into Peasepud's mouth, but reading between his lines upthread he seems to be implying that Moat's plan would have meant that the cost of purchasing the club would be met out of the club's future income. The club would basically be acquiring more debt as the result of the change of ownership. Wouldn't surprise me if that was the case.

Does that make it worse for the club by default?

I'm certainly not in a position to say anyone is wrong, but I don't know how anyone can know which is better for the club without having complete knowledge of what the other parties are planning and willing to do.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: madras on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 01:02:20 AM
Quote
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

Any alternative bid that was made would be a rival bid of course it would. However how that was perceived and dealt with would depend on the bid. If for instance Moat reappeared then, as far as Im concerned I cant see how that would change our plans as we know our model is better for the club.

if however some massive businessman came in and said "Ill buy the club and give the supporters 50% for free" then obviously that would need to be viewed differently. It would still need to be assessed to see exactly what was involved.

How?

I don't want to put words into Peasepud's mouth, but reading between his lines upthread he seems to be implying that Moat's plan would have meant that the cost of purchasing the club would be met out of the club's future income. The club would basically be acquiring more debt as the result of the change of ownership. Wouldn't surprise me if that was the case.

Does that make it worse for the club by default?

I'm certainly not in a position to say anyone is wrong, but I don't know how anyone can know which is better for the club without having complete knowledge of what the other parties are planning and willing to do.
and thats something we'll never know even after any takeover has happened.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: alpal78 on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 06:28:58 AM
First off, I've not got a spare £2500 (or anywhere near it tbh) to invest so I'm ruled out straight away. Secondly, it sounds like an excellent idea in theory. I've got some doubts as to whether or not enough cash can be raised to take over and keep things ticking along until the club begins to generate enough money to run itself properly though.

The other query (my apologies if it's already been answered elsewhere) is that I can't really see the incentive to more affluent people investing more money if they still only get one vote. I've read that the 'one share=one vote' thing is fundamental to it going ahead but why should a rich bloke put in, say, £50k if it only gets him the same voting power as someone who only chips in £2500?

I'm not trying to be negative and I hope things take off but I've got my doubts as to whether it'll actually come off. Credit to them for getting off their arses and attempting to do something positive to force some change.  :thup:

I'm with Midds on this. I don't see how you can have it both ways. You either go for the equal vote feel good factor or you focus on getting the big fish. As it is, there is no incentive to invest more than the minimum. I read a few pages back that the incentive to invest more would be that 2% of 20,000K is more than 2% of 1,500K. I'm sorry but that's a silly point. Whilst it is true that if you invest 20,000K you get more returns on absolute level than if you invested just 1,500K, but from an investment standpoint, people (certainly the big fish) look at return of investment (ROI). And given that most savings account would give you more than 2% interest and most mutual funds would give you anywhere between 5-20%, the opportunity cost for investing 20,000K is actually worse than 1,500K.

Sure we could say that the contribution is to save the club and not really an 'investment', whilst I can see some people doing that out of love for the club, I can't see any serious money coming in purely based on emotions.

For the record, I appreciate the effort (credit where it is due) but I can't see how this will work unles this fundamental issue is addressed.   
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 08:40:57 AM
Quote
If this campaign gathers momentum, would NUST view any subsequent offer to buy the club from Ashley as a rival bid ?
In the future would they be sympathetic to a serious bid from serious investors or do they now see themselves as the only way forward ?

Any alternative bid that was made would be a rival bid of course it would. However how that was perceived and dealt with would depend on the bid. If for instance Moat reappeared then, as far as Im concerned I cant see how that would change our plans as we know our model is better for the club.

if however some massive businessman came in and said "Ill buy the club and give the supporters 50% for free" then obviously that would need to be viewed differently. It would still need to be assessed to see exactly what was involved.


If that's what an acceptable bid would require, then I don't think you are going to see any acceptable bids. :idiot2:
We need businessmen running the show not lunatics.  By lunatic I mean the benevolent businessman not the fans - just to be clear.

You knew exactly what I meant by that, every bid that comes in is obviously a rival bid, thats not arrogance or anything else you want to portray it as. If the fans have raised x million and are in discussions with the owner then we're not going to say "oh forget it then, someone else has come in, lets stop and hope they're going to do things right".

Anyone (and that includes us) who buys this club has the potential to be the best thing to happen or the worst ever and frankly we will not know the answer until years after they've completed the purchase. For us to just stop our bid when some multibillionaire appears would be more foolish than not bothering with the bid at all. I used the "give 50% to the fans for free" as an example, something that would be such an amazing offer that we'd have to look at it. not just blindly continue down the path.

I don't want to put words into Peasepud's mouth, but reading between his lines upthread he seems to be implying that Moat's plan would have meant that the cost of purchasing the club would be met out of the club's future income. The club would basically be acquiring more debt as the result of the change of ownership. Wouldn't surprise me if that was the case.
Does that make it worse for the club by default?

I'm certainly not in a position to say anyone is wrong, but I don't know how anyone can know which is better for the club without having complete knowledge of what the other parties are planning and willing to do.
I would say it does, heres a "hypothetical" scenario, man pays 30% of purchase price then takes the other 70% out of club over next two years to pay balance, all money during that time is channeled into repaying this, no purchases, more redundancies etc. Club finally repays debt and man owns club outright, man then sells club on for profit on his original stake.

Apart from our bid, any potential purchaser does not need to say what their motives are or what they plan long term. Anyone with the cash can come in and do what they like. This bid is obviously different, the fans know what the plan is, the fans own the club, the fans elect who will run it, the fans have their peers on the board and can ensure things are done properly inside.

If things arent going right and we, the fans can see that the current President is not competent then there are methods in place to remove them through the correct channels. Thats the difference, if it goes wrong at the moment all we can do is moan about it, make a banner or go on SSN and shout for the heads. Under fan ownership we can simply muster the required number of voters and call for them to be replaced. For obvious reasons that in itself isnt a simple process but its there to ensure that the fans keep control and can remove anyone thats abusing their power or acting incorrectly.

First off, I've not got a spare £2500 (or anywhere near it tbh) to invest so I'm ruled out straight away. Secondly, it sounds like an excellent idea in theory. I've got some doubts as to whether or not enough cash can be raised to take over and keep things ticking along until the club begins to generate enough money to run itself properly though.

The other query (my apologies if it's already been answered elsewhere) is that I can't really see the incentive to more affluent people investing more money if they still only get one vote. I've read that the 'one share=one vote' thing is fundamental to it going ahead but why should a rich bloke put in, say, £50k if it only gets him the same voting power as someone who only chips in £2500?

I'm not trying to be negative and I hope things take off but I've got my doubts as to whether it'll actually come off. Credit to them for getting off their arses and attempting to do something positive to force some change.  :thup:

Firstly, Id say you need to reread everything and see what other options are given over the coming days / weeks, the minimum investment is £1500 not £2500 although I agree finding £1500 is only a little easier than £2500. The pension option may be something you'd consider or grouping with a couple of family members to get one between you, 5 family members and its £300 each. At the end of the day though theres no problem if those that cant invest dont, as said earlier this isnt meant to be a "go out and sell your car, your club needs the cash" scenario. Those that dont invest are no different to those that dont, we're all fans, all passionate that will never change. You never know, maybe in a year or two's time you will have some spare and think "ok I'll go for it now".

The point about why would people invest more than the minimum if its one member one vote? I too was sceptical of this however its true that they do, no doubt over the next few weeks you will see examples of it as celebrity and business fans do just that. Its happened already and will no doubt keep happening. Its pride in the club, its wanting to be part of something and feeling that they can make a difference. At the same time they still get a return on their money so its not even like they're handing it over in a donation. Maybe we need to look at it like a charity, when theres an appeal we'll put our hand in our pockets and pull out some cash. If that appeal is for someone you know or something close to your heart you'll pull out more or sit in a bath of beans to raise more again.

A couple of people have asked if theres the facility to pay via Credit Card as the view would be to take out a 0% interest one and pay it using that, I dont know the answer to that yet but will update when I find out.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Delima on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:14:53 AM
Peasepud - you are doing a very fine job as the spokeperson of NUST.

At this moment I am not financially able to contribute to this, but in the near future (half a year) I would.

I just have 1 concern in my mind - it has been raised by others.

I think the 1 member 1 vote policy regardless of investment size is fundamentally unfair - and would eventually put wealthier fans off.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:26:00 AM
Peasepud - you are doing a very fine job as the spokeperson of NUST.

At this moment I am not financially able to contribute to this, but in the near future (half a year) I would.

I just have 1 concern in my mind - it has been raised by others.

I think the 1 member 1 vote policy regardless of investment size is fundamentally unfair - and would eventually put wealthier fans off.

Like I said in the post above, I too had concerns about that however one member one vote is fundamental to the way this works. If it doesnt work then that just means we have to find more investors or it ultimately fails however from my understanding it isnt failing so far. Most people are just happy to have their vote, those that think £1500 is spare change for buying a drink with dont have a problem in sticking in ten times that.

If you base it on the amount you put in then its simply a share issue and the likes of Shepherd etc will walk in pay in £10m and take control of the club again, overriding the fans descisions. If say it was one vote per £1500 then Shepherd would only need to put in £1.5m to have 1000 votes, you me and the rest of us on here wouldnt stand a chance, every vote raised would go the way he wanted. The board would end up being Shepherd, Shepherd Jr, Shepherds brother etc. Even the 6 others on the board would end up being the next 6 that had paid the most.

True fans ownership means making all equal, changing that to try and ensure we get the money would (in my opinion) be counter productive and not result in fans having the say they required or the future we see for the club.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:51:46 AM
peasepud,

assuming that this catches the imagination of the local public and everything goes to plan and we raise £300m, what makes you think that Ashley won't see all this available cash and move the goalposts by raising the price? Has negotiating a buyout price been factored in or are we just going to pay whatever it takes once the funds are in place?

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:56:09 AM
peasepud,

assuming that this catches the imagination of the local public and everything goes to plan and we raise £300m, what makes you think that Ashley won't see all this available cash and move the goalposts by raising the price? Has negotiating a buyout price been factored in or are we just going to pay whatever it takes once the funds are in place?



Think thats why they weren't saying the amount they were raising, were only collecting deposits for now and I'm guessing they simply wouldn't accept the deal and so Ashley would get more hell and no cash.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:59:59 AM
peasepud,

assuming that this catches the imagination of the local public and everything goes to plan and we raise £300m, what makes you think that Ashley won't see all this available cash and move the goalposts by raising the price? Has negotiating a buyout price been factored in or are we just going to pay whatever it takes once the funds are in place?



Think thats why they weren't saying the amount they were raising, were only collecting deposits for now and I'm guessing they simply wouldn't accept the deal and so Ashley would get more hell and no cash.

I don't think Ashley will give a flying f*** about getting hell, it will come down to cold hard cash at the end of the day.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 10:16:33 AM
peasepud,

assuming that this catches the imagination of the local public and everything goes to plan and we raise £300m, what makes you think that Ashley won't see all this available cash and move the goalposts by raising the price? Has negotiating a buyout price been factored in or are we just going to pay whatever it takes once the funds are in place?

Basically, its being ran in two stages, the first is to raise an amount which is seen as a sensible "proof of intent" then we will sit down with MA, do due diligence and agree a price. We will not be held to ransom over this, what will be paid is a fair price for the club depending on its current financial state etc. You're right though it would be far too easy for us to raise £200m and shout about it just to then have Ashley say "the price is £200m take it or leave it".

If that happened then we'd leave it, buying the club for over the odds would just mean we'd all be screwed in the long term, ideal scenario is we leave the money sitting there until he sees sense but otherwise we hand everyone their money back and give up. All we've lost is 5% of our deposits so on a £1500 investment that would be £7.50.

Thats a gamble Im willing to take.

We raise enough to prove we're serious, talk to him, agree a price, raise that, buy the club and then pull in the rest. Obviously we'll already have an understanding from those that have shown an interest as to just how much in total we will have but nobody other than those directly involved would know that.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: PJ87 on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 10:37:39 AM
peasepud,

assuming that this catches the imagination of the local public and everything goes to plan and we raise £300m, what makes you think that Ashley won't see all this available cash and move the goalposts by raising the price? Has negotiating a buyout price been factored in or are we just going to pay whatever it takes once the funds are in place?

Basically, its being ran in two stages, the first is to raise an amount which is seen as a sensible "proof of intent" then we will sit down with MA, do due diligence and agree a price. We will not be held to ransom over this, what will be paid is a fair price for the club depending on its current financial state etc. You're right though it would be far too easy for us to raise £200m and shout about it just to then have Ashley say "the price is £200m take it or leave it".

If that happened then we'd leave it, buying the club for over the odds would just mean we'd all be screwed in the long term, ideal scenario is we leave the money sitting there until he sees sense but otherwise we hand everyone their money back and give up. All we've lost is 5% of our deposits so on a £1500 investment that would be £7.50.

Thats a gamble Im willing to take.

We raise enough to prove we're serious, talk to him, agree a price, raise that, buy the club and then pull in the rest. Obviously we'll already have an understanding from those that have shown an interest as to just how much in total we will have but nobody other than those directly involved would know that.

Do we REALLY want more people who are bad with numbers running our club?

NUST OUT!

;)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 10:45:28 AM
Do we REALLY want more people who are bad with numbers running our club?

NUST OUT!

;)

Do you want to have a rethink of exactly what Im talking about and come back on that? ;)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Interpolic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 10:47:06 AM
peasepud,

assuming that this catches the imagination of the local public and everything goes to plan and we raise £300m, what makes you think that Ashley won't see all this available cash and move the goalposts by raising the price? Has negotiating a buyout price been factored in or are we just going to pay whatever it takes once the funds are in place?

Basically, its being ran in two stages, the first is to raise an amount which is seen as a sensible "proof of intent" then we will sit down with MA, do due diligence and agree a price. We will not be held to ransom over this, what will be paid is a fair price for the club depending on its current financial state etc. You're right though it would be far too easy for us to raise £200m and shout about it just to then have Ashley say "the price is £200m take it or leave it".

If that happened then we'd leave it, buying the club for over the odds would just mean we'd all be screwed in the long term, ideal scenario is we leave the money sitting there until he sees sense but otherwise we hand everyone their money back and give up. All we've lost is 5% of our deposits so on a £1500 investment that would be £7.50.

Thats a gamble Im willing to take.

We raise enough to prove we're serious, talk to him, agree a price, raise that, buy the club and then pull in the rest. Obviously we'll already have an understanding from those that have shown an interest as to just how much in total we will have but nobody other than those directly involved would know that.

Do we REALLY want more people who are bad with numbers running our club?

NUST OUT!

;)

I typed a similar message but deleted it sharpish - he means 5% of £150 (the initial deposit) I think.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: PJ87 on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 10:47:23 AM
Do we REALLY want more people who are bad with numbers running our club?

NUST OUT!

;)

Do you want to have a rethink of exactly what Im talking about and come back on that? ;)

Ah bollocks. I've just realised what you meant. If you change the word 'deposit' to 'investment', i'd be right. ;)

NUST IN!
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 10:51:53 AM
Random question I guess, but how would the club support itself after the purchase? We know it isn't making a profit at the moment, and Ashley has put in his own money to take on debts.

Where would finance come from once the club was owned by fans. Sorry if this is a stupid question, I haven't really been keeping up with this thread.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:03:48 AM
Random question I guess, but how would the club support itself after the purchase? We know it isn't making a profit at the moment, and Ashley has put in his own money to take on debts.

Where would finance come from once the club was owned by fans. Sorry if this is a stupid question, I haven't really been keeping up with this thread.

Im sorry but I cant keep repeating answers to earlier questions, its all there in the thread and in the info we've put up so far.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:04:23 AM
Random question I guess, but how would the club support itself after the purchase? We know it isn't making a profit at the moment, and Ashley has put in his own money to take on debts.

Where would finance come from once the club was owned by fans. Sorry if this is a stupid question, I haven't really been keeping up with this thread.

I think once the protest songs have died down and hard headed figures take over this is a very sobering thought.
There is a serious deficit in the club's operating budget and frankly we did well to retain the number of players we did post relegation when many clubs would have had to shed almost all high earners.
Whatever anyone says about the FCB it does seem the operating deficit is being made up by himself at present and circa £20M p.a. would not be too far wide of the mark.
Any new owners (the NUST or other) will have to factor this in and without a wealthy benefactor it could be quite painful.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:14:11 AM
Random question I guess, but how would the club support itself after the purchase? We know it isn't making a profit at the moment, and Ashley has put in his own money to take on debts.

Where would finance come from once the club was owned by fans. Sorry if this is a stupid question, I haven't really been keeping up with this thread.

I think once the protest songs have died down and hard headed figures take over this is a very sobering thought.
There is a serious deficit in the club's operating budget and frankly we did well to retain the number of players we did post relegation when many clubs would have had to shed almost all high earners.
Whatever anyone says about the FCB it does seem the operating deficit is being made up by himself at present and circa £20M p.a. would not be too far wide of the mark.
Any new owners (the NUST or other) will have to factor this in and without a wealthy benefactor it could be quite painful.

Indeed - but if the whole thing is put together by professionals (and the understanding is that it is) then that issue will be dealt with in a detailed business plan. People won't invest unless the plan hangs together, especially the wealthier "business savvy" types.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:17:03 AM
Random question I guess, but how would the club support itself after the purchase? We know it isn't making a profit at the moment, and Ashley has put in his own money to take on debts.

Where would finance come from once the club was owned by fans. Sorry if this is a stupid question, I haven't really been keeping up with this thread.

Im sorry but I cant keep repeating answers to earlier questions, its all there in the thread and in the info we've put up so far.

Understood!
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:20:44 AM
It'd probably be worth creating a sticky thread with all the Q&As from this thread in, just to stop people from repreating themselves or other people.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:25:48 AM
It'd probably be worth creating a sticky thread with all the Q&As from this thread in, just to stop people from repreating themselves or other people.

Good point, its only going to get more confusing as more info is released if people are mixing new and old stuff
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:31:39 AM
If you could do that then Id appreciate it, I dont want to appear like an arsey sod but the thought of me having to repeat stuff regularly instead of posters reading the thread is not a good one especially as Im doing this on a number of message boards.

Any help in that way would be appreciated.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: toonlass on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:55:41 AM
Who would NUST install as manager if they were successful in their bid?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: madras on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:57:17 AM
Who would NUST install as manager if they were successful in their bid?
the answer has to be........."the best we consider available at the time"
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: toonlass on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:59:36 AM
Who would NUST install as manager if they were successful in their bid?
the answer has to be........."the best we consider available at the time"

And if they were successful now, who would it be?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 12:03:52 PM
NUST wouldn't be in charge of installing a manager. Haven't you read any of this thread?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 12:13:43 PM
Who would NUST install as manager if they were successful in their bid?
the answer has to be........."the best we consider available at the time"

And if they were successful now, who would it be?

Getting way, way ahead of the situation here.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 12:32:23 PM
Who would NUST install as manager if they were successful in their bid?
the answer has to be........."the best we consider available at the time"

And if they were successful now, who would it be?

Getting way, way ahead of the situation here.

Exactly, that is off in the future and frankly down to the President and board to decide. No doubt part of their election campaigns would include all of those details so technically its then down to the fans to ultimately decide who we go for.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Shearergol on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 12:48:24 PM
Is the ultimate aim to get 70000+ fans putting in £1500 each, or is there an expectation that 2 or 3 parties will donate a lot more? Sorry if that's already been asked.

I'd certainly go with the suggestion earlier that we each put £10 in :D
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: toonlass on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 01:44:34 PM
NUST wouldn't be in charge of installing a manager. Haven't you read any of this thread?

Some of it.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 01:46:41 PM
Is the ultimate aim to get 70000+ fans putting in £1500 each, or is there an expectation that 2 or 3 parties will donate a lot more? Sorry if that's already been asked.

I'd certainly go with the suggestion earlier that we each put £10 in :D


£10 isnt laughable. those who want to go down the 1500 route still can, but those who cant, who still want to contribute, could own part of a share.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Kaizero on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:05:33 PM
Is Sting a part of this? Not bothered reading the whole thread, but saw a headline "Furious Newcastle fans get celeb support" with a picture of Sting.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:16:00 PM
Is the ultimate aim to get 70000+ fans putting in £1500 each, or is there an expectation that 2 or 3 parties will donate a lot more? Sorry if that's already been asked.

I'd certainly go with the suggestion earlier that we each put £10 in :D


£10 isnt laughable. those who want to go down the 1500 route still can, but those who cant, who still want to contribute, could own part of a share.



CP, i think getting loads to put in £10 each will be a nightmare as you'd be canvassing too many peoples opinions when it comes to voting.  Ideally think it would be much more workable trying to get 30 people off here all investing £50 each.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Kaizero on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:18:14 PM
If NUST = a NUFC version of (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/fr/thumb/d/df/Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg/240px-Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg)+(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f2/Myfclogo.png) = This will not end well.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Frazzle on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:29:01 PM
First of all, I don't want my post to come across as an attack because I'm fully behind this idea.

I do have some gripes though, as has been said in the last few posts there's the problem with everyone putting in £10.  I read donations to the trust will be added together to form 1.5k chunks.  As binnsy says, surely this will be a nightmare?  Who would be the representative for these chunks?  I'd be happy to give £20-£40 to just contribute and wouldn't be bothered about having a say but if not everyone agrees with this it would be a nightmare.

Secondly, with regard to the election of presidents.  Surely here we'd end up with the crap that goes on at Barca and Real elections? Someone will come along promising to sign David Villa (or whatever) just to get everyone on side?  I realise the fans can just ignore this bloke and vote for the most suitable but I reckon most the candidates will want to come up with wild claims to get noticed, just like real politics, all style and no substance.  In an ideal world we'd give the manager the money he wants and let him do his thing, otherwise there'll be a lack of stability with trophy signings being forced on managers.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:30:26 PM
Is the ultimate aim to get 70000+ fans putting in £1500 each, or is there an expectation that 2 or 3 parties will donate a lot more? Sorry if that's already been asked.

I'd certainly go with the suggestion earlier that we each put £10 in :D


£10 isnt laughable. those who want to go down the 1500 route still can, but those who cant, who still want to contribute, could own part of a share.



CP, i think getting loads to put in £10 each will be a nightmare as you'd be canvassing too many peoples opinions when it comes to voting.  Ideally think it would be much more workable trying to get 30 people off here all investing £50 each.

its open to discussion. but and its a big but, the poll facility on here is a ready made way to canvass opinions.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:45:33 PM
Is the ultimate aim to get 70000+ fans putting in £1500 each, or is there an expectation that 2 or 3 parties will donate a lot more? Sorry if that's already been asked.

I'd certainly go with the suggestion earlier that we each put £10 in :D


£10 isnt laughable. those who want to go down the 1500 route still can, but those who cant, who still want to contribute, could own part of a share.



CP, i think getting loads to put in £10 each will be a nightmare as you'd be canvassing too many peoples opinions when it comes to voting.  Ideally think it would be much more workable trying to get 30 people off here all investing £50 each.

its open to discussion. but and its a big but, the poll facility on here is a ready made way to canvass opinions.

Yeah for the one on here it would be pretty easy. All who put money in (whoever collects is open to debate) get access to a section on the board called NUST or whatever. When something has to be decided for NUST like a new chairman, the poll is added to that board and votes are cast, the result of that poll would then be the vote cast by the members of N-O. Simple really.

As for the people putting money into NUST I'm not sure how that will work as to people having a say, I'm not sure they would actually get a say or if that vote would just come through NUST somehow.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:48:07 PM
Secondly, with regard to the election of presidents.  Surely here we'd end up with the crap that goes on at Barca and Real elections? Someone will come along promising to sign David Villa (or whatever) just to get everyone on side?  I realise the fans can just ignore this bloke and vote for the most suitable but I reckon most the candidates will want to come up with wild claims to get noticed, just like real politics, all style and no substance.  In an ideal world we'd give the manager the money he wants and let him do his thing, otherwise there'll be a lack of stability with trophy signings being forced on managers.

As has been mentioned before they are all held accountable by the board and NUST members so although they may get appointed down to 1 key point they have to have other key points else the club wouldn't progress and they could be voted off early as can be done at Barca. At the end of the day people who will be going for this job will have lots of experience in football you would hope. The likes of David Dein for arguments sake would never offer this, he is well known to want to build up from youth.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:48:32 PM
If NUST = a NUFC version of (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/fr/thumb/d/df/Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg/240px-Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg)+(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f2/Myfclogo.png) = This will not end well.

it's not
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:50:33 PM
If NUST = a NUFC version of (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/fr/thumb/d/df/Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg/240px-Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg)+(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f2/Myfclogo.png) = This will not end well.

Having done a bundle research and writing on the subject of Ebbsfleet & MyFC I can categorically state that this set up is completely different.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Kaizero on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:51:39 PM
If NUST = a NUFC version of (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/fr/thumb/d/df/Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg/240px-Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg)+(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f2/Myfclogo.png) = This will not end well.

Having done a bundle research and writing on the subject of Ebbsfleet & MyFC I can categorically state that this set up is completely different.

People pool money together, vote who gets to run it etc etc. Seems the same tbh (bar voting for who starts and who they should buy).
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 02:55:53 PM
If NUST = a NUFC version of (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/fr/thumb/d/df/Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg/240px-Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg)+(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f2/Myfclogo.png) = This will not end well.

Having done a bundle research and writing on the subject of Ebbsfleet & MyFC I can categorically state that this set up is completely different.

People pool money together, vote who gets to run it etc etc. Seems the same tbh (bar voting for who starts and who they should buy).

The vote is only really for the chairman and board members though, the chairman makes all decisions on the club unlike ebbsfleet where the people who bought the club decided everything from ticket prices, players bought and sold, manager etc.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 03:02:07 PM
If NUST = a NUFC version of (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/fr/thumb/d/df/Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg/240px-Ebbsfleet_United_Football_Club.jpg)+(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f2/Myfclogo.png) = This will not end well.

Having done a bundle research and writing on the subject of Ebbsfleet & MyFC I can categorically state that this set up is completely different.

People pool money together, vote who gets to run it etc etc. Seems the same tbh (bar voting for who starts and who they should buy).

That's the problem though, it never happened that way. There has been no transparency from those in charge, it's been a vehicle for those who thought the idea up to run a football club using others peoples cash and because of the bad press it generated and the fact Ebbsfleet doesn't have a fanbase they nearly went under when subscriptions were up for renewal.

Ebbsfleet is arguably the polar opposite of the fan ownership ethos.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 03:11:37 PM
A question if I may:

How liquid is the investment? For example lets say I pay in £1,500 and the issue of the new manager comes up. Now (hypothetically) say I really want us to go for Roy Hodgson but the elected president (as is his right) comes out with Shearer being his number one choice. If I wished to withdraw my £1,500 due to me no longer believing in the direction of the board could I do this?

Also, have the founders considered what is happen when (and it will) things go wrong and the tide turns against the trust/president? I'll stick my neck on the line and suggest that at least one of the guys pushing this idea would like to be el presidente. Are they prepared for the backlash on their decisions?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 03:20:50 PM
A question if I may:

How liquid is the investment? For example lets say I pay in £1,500 and the issue of the new manager comes up. Now (hypothetically) say I really want us to go for Roy Hodgson but the elected president (as is his right) comes out with Shearer being his number one choice. If I wished to withdraw my £1,500 due to me no longer believing in the direction of the board could I do this?

Also, have the founders considered what is happen when (and it will) things go wrong and the tide turns against the trust/president? I'll stick my neck on the line and suggest that at least one of the guys pushing this idea would like to be el presidente. Are they prepared for the backlash on their decisions?

As mentioned before if they did go for the Barca model they have to get so many signatures from members asking for the president/chairman to leave. There is then a new election on for the new chairman. To be honest I doubt very much it would be a NUST member in charge, people will want a football man in charge who has a clue what he's doing.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 03:32:12 PM
Not wanting to speak for them, but I would think the investment couldn't be very liquid at all. I don't see how it would work if you could have people withdrawing their money as easily as that.

It would put the club in a very precarious position if any number of investers could ask for their money back at any time, surely?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 03:35:54 PM
Not wanting to speak for them, but I would think the investment couldn't be very liquid at all. I don't see how it would work if you could have people withdrawing their money as easily as that.

It would put the club in a very precarious position if any number of investers could ask for their money back at any time, surely?

How do other pensionable schemes work ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Stephen927 on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 03:51:12 PM
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_727OBkoI4tw/R8hUS05EDnI/AAAAAAAAEAg/L6Mr3VTmimM/s400/Wake+Up+&+Smell....jpg)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 03:52:46 PM
A question if I may:

How liquid is the investment? For example lets say I pay in £1,500 and the issue of the new manager comes up. Now (hypothetically) say I really want us to go for Roy Hodgson but the elected president (as is his right) comes out with Shearer being his number one choice. If I wished to withdraw my £1,500 due to me no longer believing in the direction of the board could I do this?

Also, have the founders considered what is happen when (and it will) things go wrong and the tide turns against the trust/president? I'll stick my neck on the line and suggest that at least one of the guys pushing this idea would like to be el presidente. Are they prepared for the backlash on their decisions?

So you would want your money back after one decsion you didn't agree with went through.  Regardless of all other things that might be heading in the right direction.
Great.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:15:36 PM
A question if I may:

How liquid is the investment? For example lets say I pay in £1,500 and the issue of the new manager comes up. Now (hypothetically) say I really want us to go for Roy Hodgson but the elected president (as is his right) comes out with Shearer being his number one choice. If I wished to withdraw my £1,500 due to me no longer believing in the direction of the board could I do this?

Also, have the founders considered what is happen when (and it will) things go wrong and the tide turns against the trust/president? I'll stick my neck on the line and suggest that at least one of the guys pushing this idea would like to be el presidente. Are they prepared for the backlash on their decisions?

So you would want your money back after one decsion you didn't agree with went through.  Regardless of all other things that might be heading in the right direction.
Great.

Think he's just giving an example.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:16:40 PM
A question if I may:

How liquid is the investment? For example lets say I pay in £1,500 and the issue of the new manager comes up. Now (hypothetically) say I really want us to go for Roy Hodgson but the elected president (as is his right) comes out with Shearer being his number one choice. If I wished to withdraw my £1,500 due to me no longer believing in the direction of the board could I do this?

Also, have the founders considered what is happen when (and it will) things go wrong and the tide turns against the trust/president? I'll stick my neck on the line and suggest that at least one of the guys pushing this idea would like to be el presidente. Are they prepared for the backlash on their decisions?

I would think the liquidity would be the same as any private company  .i.e. not very. If you don't like what the company is doing you can try and sell your shares, but it's down to you to find a buyer as there won't be a ready made market.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:30:34 PM
A question if I may:

How liquid is the investment? For example lets say I pay in £1,500 and the issue of the new manager comes up. Now (hypothetically) say I really want us to go for Roy Hodgson but the elected president (as is his right) comes out with Shearer being his number one choice. If I wished to withdraw my £1,500 due to me no longer believing in the direction of the board could I do this?

Also, have the founders considered what is happen when (and it will) things go wrong and the tide turns against the trust/president? I'll stick my neck on the line and suggest that at least one of the guys pushing this idea would like to be el presidente. Are they prepared for the backlash on their decisions?

So you would want your money back after one decsion you didn't agree with went through.  Regardless of all other things that might be heading in the right direction.
Great.

Think he's just giving an example.

Sorry, jumped into it.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:31:55 PM
A question if I may:

How liquid is the investment? For example lets say I pay in £1,500 and the issue of the new manager comes up. Now (hypothetically) say I really want us to go for Roy Hodgson but the elected president (as is his right) comes out with Shearer being his number one choice. If I wished to withdraw my £1,500 due to me no longer believing in the direction of the board could I do this?

Also, have the founders considered what is happen when (and it will) things go wrong and the tide turns against the trust/president? I'll stick my neck on the line and suggest that at least one of the guys pushing this idea would like to be el presidente. Are they prepared for the backlash on their decisions?

So you would want your money back after one decsion you didn't agree with went through.  Regardless of all other things that might be heading in the right direction.
Great.

Think he's just giving an example.

Sorry, jumped into it.

it does imply tho, that if you didnt agree with decisions you would to use an anolgy,.. take your ball home.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:32:43 PM
A question if I may:

How liquid is the investment? For example lets say I pay in £1,500 and the issue of the new manager comes up. Now (hypothetically) say I really want us to go for Roy Hodgson but the elected president (as is his right) comes out with Shearer being his number one choice. If I wished to withdraw my £1,500 due to me no longer believing in the direction of the board could I do this?

Also, have the founders considered what is happen when (and it will) things go wrong and the tide turns against the trust/president? I'll stick my neck on the line and suggest that at least one of the guys pushing this idea would like to be el presidente. Are they prepared for the backlash on their decisions?

I would think the liquidity would be the same as any private company  .i.e. not very. If you don't like what the company is doing you can try and sell your shares, but it's down to you to find a buyer as there won't be a ready made market.

Thats more what I was trying to get at - would there be a market as such for the shares. This potentially leaves the scheme open to a take over
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:37:35 PM
I know there have been reasons given for not doing it, but the last few pages on here show that all cards should have been put on the table by NUST as to how this is going to work at the initial launch.

The more people are thinking about this without the benefit of the full facts, the more people seem to be going off the idea.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:38:05 PM
A question if I may:

How liquid is the investment? For example lets say I pay in £1,500 and the issue of the new manager comes up. Now (hypothetically) say I really want us to go for Roy Hodgson but the elected president (as is his right) comes out with Shearer being his number one choice. If I wished to withdraw my £1,500 due to me no longer believing in the direction of the board could I do this?

Also, have the founders considered what is happen when (and it will) things go wrong and the tide turns against the trust/president? I'll stick my neck on the line and suggest that at least one of the guys pushing this idea would like to be el presidente. Are they prepared for the backlash on their decisions?

So you would want your money back after one decsion you didn't agree with went through.  Regardless of all other things that might be heading in the right direction.
Great.

Think he's just giving an example.

Sorry, jumped into it.

it does imply tho, that if you didnt agree with decisions you would to use an anolgy,.. take your ball home.

That was the point. The manager point was just a one off, as it is likely to come up soon. But a shareholder could completely disagree with a number of key decisions and decide that their cash input leaves them in no better a decision than now (in that they disagree with the direction of the club rightly or wrongly). In that situation I think that there needs to be some mechanism to sell the shares, whether on a closed market or back into the club
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:39:38 PM
I know there have been reasons given for not doing it, but the last few pages on here show that all cards should have been put on the table by NUST as to how this is going to work at the initial launch.

The more people are thinking about this without the benefit of the full facts, the more people seem to be going off the idea.

Isn't that the story of NUST from day one though?

Any good ideas/actions/decisions have been tarred by poor communication (where have we seen that before??) and a cock handed way of putting information into the supporters domain
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:40:08 PM
I think you've got to realise that a democratic approach doesn't mean what you vote for will happen. The fact you had your say is the objective, not the specific outcome.

I mean, the Tories are going to win the next election.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:49:10 PM
I think you've got to realise that a democratic approach doesn't mean what you vote for will happen. The fact you had your say is the objective, not the specific outcome.

I mean, the Tories are going to win the next election.

Oranges and Apples.

If you buy a share in something and don't agree with its direction you should be able to pull out of whatever you've bought into.
I don't pay for the right to vote in a General Election so have to take the decision on the chin. Similarly the support for NUFC won't go away because I disagree with the owners direction - otherwise I wouldn't be supporting Ashleys regime at present. Wishing to sell a share in the club because I don't agree with a decision shouldn't be the end of my options, and if I wish to sell then there should be something in place to allow it - whether this is on an open market or back into the club should be the only thing open for debate
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: healthyaddiction on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:53:51 PM
But you won't even vote for the manager, only the president.  At least that's what I understand and that should be how it would work.  If we start voting for everything to do with the team such as the manager or players we sign then it'll be a joke and won't work.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 04:56:25 PM
But you won't even vote for the manager, only the president.  At least that's what I understand and that should be how it would work.  If we start voting for everything to do with the team such as the manager or players we sign then it'll be a joke and won't work.

nah thats missing the point, I'm not advocating voting for a manager (as an example), but if el presidente makes a series of decisions that I disagree with, do I have a mechanism to get out of the trust
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 05:00:14 PM
I think you've got to realise that a democratic approach doesn't mean what you vote for will happen. The fact you had your say is the objective, not the specific outcome.

I mean, the Tories are going to win the next election.

Oranges and Apples.

If you buy a share in something and don't agree with its direction you should be able to pull out of whatever you've bought into.
I don't pay for the right to vote in a General Election so have to take the decision on the chin. Similarly the support for NUFC won't go away because I disagree with the owners direction - otherwise I wouldn't be supporting Ashleys regime at present. Wishing to sell a share in the club because I don't agree with a decision shouldn't be the end of my options, and if I wish to sell then there should be something in place to allow it - whether this is on an open market or back into the club should be the only thing open for debate

I don't know if this will be addressed by the NUST scheme but I can't really see how it can be properly. So if anyone is considering investing but one of their criteria is that they want a liquid investment then the advice has to be don't touch this. On the other hand if they're happy to stick their money in so as to feel they've got a voice and own a part of the club they support then have a look.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: High Five o/ on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 05:04:48 PM
I would be very happy and proud of the club and supporters if this pulled through.
I just have to await more info from NUST to see if i can justify to pay a so big chunk of my saving on it.

Hope more people are exited about this, its a way to make the club more unique, and i think it would boost our reputation and support in both UK and around the world.
If this is successful, a lot of other fans will admire and envy us this. 
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 05:36:30 PM
If you could do that then Id appreciate it, I dont want to appear like an arsey sod but the thought of me having to repeat stuff regularly instead of posters reading the thread is not a good one especially as Im doing this on a number of message boards.

Any help in that way would be appreciated.

What position, if any, do you occupy within NUST? Are you some kind of designated spokesman?

What I'm getting at is whether the various bits of advice and information that you're giving carries any kind of official weight, or whether you're an ordinary member of NUST just giving your own personal perspective.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: abcdefg on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 05:50:56 PM
I hate to be a negative Nelly, but this is never going to happen. I admire the efforts, heaven knows (I'm miserable now) I'm doing bugger all, but I'm convinced of this.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 05:54:48 PM
I hate to be a negative Nelly, but this is never going to happen. I admire the efforts, heaven knows (I'm miserable now) I'm doing bugger all, but I'm convinced of this.

Do you not even have any constructive reasons as to why you think it is 'never going to happen'? What you've done there is an absolute piece of p*ss, to just say it's bollocks and not give any opinion as to why.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mr Logic on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 07:00:49 PM
I'm praying it does happen, on so many levels it would be an astonishing coup that could potentially change football as we know it. Though don't ask me how.
At least the southern press couldn't call us deluded anymore, they'd have to doff their caps.. 'f*** me, they've only gone and bought the club.'

And if Moat was trying to buy the club with (mostly) borrowed money, don't want that; what's the point in saddling the club with debt just to get your hands on it?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: abcdefg on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 07:51:10 PM
I hate to be a negative Nelly, but this is never going to happen. I admire the efforts, heaven knows (I'm miserable now) I'm doing bugger all, but I'm convinced of this.

Do you not even have any constructive reasons as to why you think it is 'never going to happen'? What you've done there is an absolute piece of p*ss, to just say it's bollocks and not give any opinion as to why.

OK, I think the NUST will fall apart due to in-fighting, that there won't be anything like enough money forthcoming to launch a serious bid anyway, and that in the unlikely event of a successful bid that the resulting administration will lack the direction to run a football club.

I don't know this, it's more a gut feeling, and as I said, I'm not criticising the people involved, for me the pint's always half-empty, and it's your round.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: nfrederi on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 08:13:03 PM
I'm praying it does happen, on so many levels it would be an astonishing coup that could potentially change football as we know it. Though don't ask me how.
At least the southern press couldn't call us deluded anymore, they'd have to doff their caps.. 'f*** me, they've only gone and bought the club.'

And if Moat was trying to buy the club with (mostly) borrowed money, don't want that; what's the point in saddling the club with debt just to get your hands on it?

We will reclaim a piece of footballs soul and lead the way for others to follow.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 08:28:16 PM
I'm praying it does happen, on so many levels it would be an astonishing coup that could potentially change football as we know it. Though don't ask me how.
At least the southern press couldn't call us deluded anymore, they'd have to doff their caps.. 'f*** me, they've only gone and bought the club.'

And if Moat was trying to buy the club with (mostly) borrowed money, don't want that; what's the point in saddling the club with debt just to get your hands on it?

We will reclaim a piece of footballs soul and lead the way for others to follow.

Will we f***.

The trust will fall apart from infighting. As a forum we can't even agree if Jonas' goal a the weekend was good or not
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: BlacknWhiteArmy on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 08:31:53 PM
I hate to be a negative Nelly, but this is never going to happen. I admire the efforts, heaven knows (I'm miserable now) I'm doing bugger all, but I'm convinced of this.

Do you not even have any constructive reasons as to why you think it is 'never going to happen'? What you've done there is an absolute piece of p*ss, to just say it's bollocks and not give any opinion as to why.

Oh come on surely you must know it will never happen. We will never gather enough support or funds for anything meaningful to be achieved.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 08:34:34 PM
If you could do that then Id appreciate it, I dont want to appear like an arsey sod but the thought of me having to repeat stuff regularly instead of posters reading the thread is not a good one especially as Im doing this on a number of message boards.

Any help in that way would be appreciated.

What position, if any, do you occupy within NUST? Are you some kind of designated spokesman?

What I'm getting at is whether the various bits of advice and information that you're giving carries any kind of official weight, or whether you're an ordinary member of NUST just giving your own personal perspective.


Im an original member of the committee, as is Shellshock and Tom_NUFC, both members on here.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 08:37:22 PM
I hate to be a negative Nelly, but this is never going to happen. I admire the efforts, heaven knows (I'm miserable now) I'm doing bugger all, but I'm convinced of this.

Do you not even have any constructive reasons as to why you think it is 'never going to happen'? What you've done there is an absolute piece of p*ss, to just say it's bollocks and not give any opinion as to why.

Oh come on surely you must know it will never happen. We will never gather enough support or funds for anything meaningful to be achieved.

Not with that attitude, no.

I'm glad there are people willing to try rather than sit and moan like you do.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:07:48 PM
I hate to be a negative Nelly, but this is never going to happen. I admire the efforts, heaven knows (I'm miserable now) I'm doing bugger all, but I'm convinced of this.

Do you not even have any constructive reasons as to why you think it is 'never going to happen'? What you've done there is an absolute piece of p*ss, to just say it's bollocks and not give any opinion as to why.

Oh come on surely you must know it will never happen. We will never gather enough support or funds for anything meaningful to be achieved.

Not with that attitude, no.

I'm glad there are people willing to try rather than sit and moan like you do.

Well said.

Cant afford it, dont believe its a safe place for your funds, have a kid on the way, been made redundant, your lass says she wants to spend the money on shoes or just plain dont want to do it.

All  of those are good enough reasons not to invest and nobody should ever be looked at any differently because of it but dont just sit back and say "it'll never work because we wont get enough funds" while all the time sitting on your funds, because thats exactly how it wouldnt work.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:15:44 PM
If you could do that then Id appreciate it, I dont want to appear like an arsey sod but the thought of me having to repeat stuff regularly instead of posters reading the thread is not a good one especially as Im doing this on a number of message boards.

Any help in that way would be appreciated.

What position, if any, do you occupy within NUST? Are you some kind of designated spokesman?

What I'm getting at is whether the various bits of advice and information that you're giving carries any kind of official weight, or whether you're an ordinary member of NUST just giving your own personal perspective.


Im an original member of the committee, as is Shellshock and Tom_NUFC, both members on here.

So can I take it that you're still on the committee, and your statements therefore represent the current views and aims of that committee?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:23:40 PM
Is this in any way related to the Graham Roberts group? Are they still involved?

No its got nothing to do with Graham Roberts.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ikri on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:28:16 PM
I hate to be a negative Nelly, but this is never going to happen. I admire the efforts, heaven knows (I'm miserable now) I'm doing bugger all, but I'm convinced of this.

Do you not even have any constructive reasons as to why you think it is 'never going to happen'? What you've done there is an absolute piece of p*ss, to just say it's bollocks and not give any opinion as to why.

Oh come on surely you must know it will never happen. We will never gather enough support or funds for anything meaningful to be achieved.

Not with that attitude, no.

I'm glad there are people willing to try rather than sit and moan like you do.

A few years ago there was a survey that suggested that around 50% of UK voters would vote Lib Dem if they believed they stood a chance of getting elected.  As it happens, any party winning 50% of the vote would win a general election in a massive landslide but it won't happen because people don't (or won't) believe that it could happen.

I'm not certain whether or not a supporter's trust buyout can succeed, but I can guarantee that it won't succeed if people simply assume that the plan is doomed from the start.

I can't personally afford £1500 to buy into the plan, but I'm willing to give what I can to help it succeed.  Even if people don't believe right now that it can't work or that £1500 is too much to risk, it's surely worth putting a few ££ into a pot with others to achieve the £1500.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:40:50 PM
If you could do that then Id appreciate it, I dont want to appear like an arsey sod but the thought of me having to repeat stuff regularly instead of posters reading the thread is not a good one especially as Im doing this on a number of message boards.

Any help in that way would be appreciated.

What position, if any, do you occupy within NUST? Are you some kind of designated spokesman?

What I'm getting at is whether the various bits of advice and information that you're giving carries any kind of official weight, or whether you're an ordinary member of NUST just giving your own personal perspective.


Im an original member of the committee, as is Shellshock and Tom_NUFC, both members on here.

So can I take it that you're still on the committee, and your statements therefore represent the current views and aims of that committee?

Yes I am still on the committee and the details Im giving here are those of the scheme, personal views however are my own not those of the committee.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:46:18 PM
http://goal.com/en/news/12/spain/2009/11/11/1618868/barcelona-vice-president-joan-franquesa-resigns

Trouble in paradise.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:47:29 PM
If you could do that then Id appreciate it, I dont want to appear like an arsey sod but the thought of me having to repeat stuff regularly instead of posters reading the thread is not a good one especially as Im doing this on a number of message boards.

Any help in that way would be appreciated.

What position, if any, do you occupy within NUST? Are you some kind of designated spokesman?

What I'm getting at is whether the various bits of advice and information that you're giving carries any kind of official weight, or whether you're an ordinary member of NUST just giving your own personal perspective.


Im an original member of the committee, as is Shellshock and Tom_NUFC, both members on here.

So can I take it that you're still on the committee, and your statements therefore represent the current views and aims of that committee?

Yes I am still on the committee and the details Im giving here are those of the scheme, personal views however are my own not those of the committee.

Thank you.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Kasper on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 09:51:07 PM
Have to say I was very sceptical about this when some stuff came up couple months ago but reading this thread now and your website has completely turned me around. Best of luck with your efforts and I'll be definitely taking part if a share is purchased by a group of people from here :thup:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 10:00:09 PM
I think this has been mentioned here once or twice and Im going to get proper confirmation but where we say on the website that people can donate any amount and we'll bundle them up into totals of £1500 to buy a share then I dont believe we are offering voting rights to those that contributed. I believe that these are plainly and simply a way to let those donate that want to help but are unable to invest themselves.

I'll get proper full confirmation on that but its worth remembering for those that are wondering whether to go down that route or through somewhere such as here.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: BlacknWhiteArmy on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 10:23:23 PM
I hate to be a negative Nelly, but this is never going to happen. I admire the efforts, heaven knows (I'm miserable now) I'm doing bugger all, but I'm convinced of this.

Do you not even have any constructive reasons as to why you think it is 'never going to happen'? What you've done there is an absolute piece of p*ss, to just say it's bollocks and not give any opinion as to why.

Oh come on surely you must know it will never happen. We will never gather enough support or funds for anything meaningful to be achieved.

Not with that attitude, no.

I'm glad there are people willing to try rather than sit and moan like you do.


Valid point, perhaps my attitude isn't perfect- but it will never happen because people don't have enough money to throw round these days. I admire the efforts of those trying but I really doubt anything will happen.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Stu on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:10:56 PM

Basically, its being ran in two stages, the first is to raise an amount which is seen as a sensible "proof of intent" then we will sit down with MA, do due diligence and agree a price. We will not be held to ransom over this, what will be paid is a fair price for the club depending on its current financial state etc. You're right though it would be far too easy for us to raise £200m and shout about it just to then have Ashley say "the price is £200m take it or leave it".

If that happened then we'd leave it, buying the club for over the odds would just mean we'd all be screwed in the long term, ideal scenario is we leave the money sitting there until he sees sense but otherwise we hand everyone their money back and give up. All we've lost is 5% of our deposits so on a £1500 investment that would be £7.50.

Thats a gamble Im willing to take.

We raise enough to prove we're serious, talk to him, agree a price, raise that, buy the club and then pull in the rest. Obviously we'll already have an understanding from those that have shown an interest as to just how much in total we will have but nobody other than those directly involved would know that.

Do we REALLY want more people who are bad with numbers running our club?

NUST OUT!

;)

Pure Gold.

:mackems:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Kasper on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:47:38 PM

Basically, its being ran in two stages, the first is to raise an amount which is seen as a sensible "proof of intent" then we will sit down with MA, do due diligence and agree a price. We will not be held to ransom over this, what will be paid is a fair price for the club depending on its current financial state etc. You're right though it would be far too easy for us to raise £200m and shout about it just to then have Ashley say "the price is £200m take it or leave it".

If that happened then we'd leave it, buying the club for over the odds would just mean we'd all be screwed in the long term, ideal scenario is we leave the money sitting there until he sees sense but otherwise we hand everyone their money back and give up. All we've lost is 5% of our deposits so on a £1500 investment that would be £7.50.

Thats a gamble Im willing to take.

We raise enough to prove we're serious, talk to him, agree a price, raise that, buy the club and then pull in the rest. Obviously we'll already have an understanding from those that have shown an interest as to just how much in total we will have but nobody other than those directly involved would know that.

Do we REALLY want more people who are bad with numbers running our club?

NUST OUT!

;)

Pure Gold.

:mackems:

The fact that he didnt read it properly is "Pure Gold"? Or the fact that you didnt?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Heneage on Wednesday 11 November 2009, 11:59:14 PM
How do the NUST plan to raise more funds to purchase players as well as the day to day running of the club.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:01:37 AM
Read the thread man.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Heneage on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:06:50 AM
Read the thread man.
All 11/12 pages? Be sensible.


Ok, so we all put money in, what happens when say Dave puts money in and eveyrthing he votes for doesn't happen? And he feels like he's not being heard and wants to leave? Sorry but I just don't trust their ability to raise enough cash.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: madras on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:07:35 AM
Maybe this has already been answered and I apologise if it has.

According to the NUST site "The Trust will be revealing partners over the coming days, and has in place a buy out structure led by local firms and renowned names in the financial world", what level of finance and/or influence is NUST hoping/needing to achieve to keep these partners involved ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:11:42 AM
Read the thread man.
All 11/12 pages? Be sensible.

Lazy as f***.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Heneage on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:13:09 AM
Read the thread man.
All 11/12 pages? Be sensible.

Lazy as f***.
Oh I'm terribly sorry I am not blessed with your commitment and work ethic, but amazingly I don't fancy sifting through 12 pages (Which btw I have since done) only to find out their theory is based on huge 'Ifs' and something we both know will never happen.

This thing has major flaws that many are quite happy to just play ignorant too.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:16:30 AM
So you can't be arsed reading the thread (or you can, I don't quite get that bit) AND you've nothing to say other than 'it'll never happen'. Why exactly did you come into this thread again?

Look for Peasepud's posts. If you press Ctrl+F then you can find them easily enough. Or look here: http://www.newcastle-online.org/nufcforum/index.php?action=profile;u=54;sa=showPosts
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Thespence on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:20:45 AM
I would be willing to invest if I know who is going to be standing for elections as El Presidente. No offence to chaps who have set this up because in this day & age the vast majority of us are whingers/negative pricks on the sidelines or a bunch of snide c***s on computers so it nice to see people put themselves out there BUT non of them appeal as people for the top job for me. I would only be willing to commit hard cash if the people standing for the election were pukka business men (I know must of these c***s have been useless in football) but I don't want someone who has lives in house less than 2 weeks Colo wages, I would want someone who has done transactions involving 7 figures & more.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Heneage on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:22:52 AM
So you can't be arsed reading the thread (or you can, I don't quite get that bit) AND you've nothing to say other than 'it'll never happen'. Why exactly did you come into this thread again?

Look for Peasepud's posts. If you press Ctrl+F then you can find them easily enough. Or look here: http://www.newcastle-online.org/nufcforum/index.php?action=profile;u=54;sa=showPosts
I came here to see what the fuss was about, and you calling me 'Lazy' is f***ing ludicrous, because I share the lack of desire to read 12 pages of an internet message board? Have a word with yourself man, not all of us are so keen on these internet campaigns you set about.

Our fans could not raise £80M to begin with, then there's the fact that the club is now operating at a loss still because of the demotion to the league we are in, when a man with a net value of 2billion is struggling to keep us going that should be all the indication you need. He's said he'll put £20m into the club as of January, that's not on players, that's just in the club, that's keeping the lights on, paying the staff, £20m. Could Nusc draft that up at short notice? You'd need a full house at St James to donate around £400 each to raise that sort of cash, there's no way our fans have that kind of disposable income.

It's a truly lovely and romantic idea of the fans owning the club, but unfortunately business isn't romantic, it's cold and hard, we need someone with solid money and lots of it, and that's not Barry Moat either btw, IF, a new owner offers to sell part of the club to the NUSC then so be it, why they'd want to do that I don't know, but I'm entertaining ideas here.

Out of curiosity are you for this idea or against it?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Thespence on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:25:32 AM
when a man with a net value of 2billion is struggling to keep us going that should be all the indication you need.

Seriously you need to read a more up to date Times Rich list
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: madras on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:26:01 AM
on having a quick look through it still seems a little vague on when/why the partners come in to it ?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:26:28 AM
So you can't be arsed reading the thread (or you can, I don't quite get that bit) AND you've nothing to say other than 'it'll never happen'. Why exactly did you come into this thread again?

Look for Peasepud's posts. If you press Ctrl+F then you can find them easily enough. Or look here: http://www.newcastle-online.org/nufcforum/index.php?action=profile;u=54;sa=showPosts
I came here to see what the fuss was about, and you calling me 'Lazy' is f***ing ludicrous, because I share the lack of desire to read 12 pages of an internet message board? Have a word with yourself man, not all of us are so keen on these internet campaigns you set about.

Our fans could not raise £80M to begin with, then there's the fact that the club is now operating at a loss still because of the demotion to the league we are in, when a man with a net value of 2billion is struggling to keep us going that should be all the indication you need. He's said he'll put £20m into the club as of January, that's not on players, that's just in the club, that's keeping the lights on, paying the staff, £20m. Could Nusc draft that up at short notice? You'd need a full house at St James to donate around £400 each to raise that sort of cash, there's no way our fans have that kind of disposable income.

It's a truly lovely and romantic idea of the fans owning the club, but unfortunately business isn't romantic, it's cold and hard, we need someone with solid money and lots of it, and that's not Barry Moat either btw, IF, a new owner offers to sell part of the club to the NUSC then so be it, why they'd want to do that I don't know, but I'm entertaining ideas here.

Out of curiosity are you for this idea or against it?

I'm undecided as to whether it will work due to the sheer numbers of people with your attitude, but I'm certainly for the idea and wish the people behind it all the best.

It's lazy that you just go into a thread and ask the same questions about twenty other people have asked, yes. If you don't have the desire to read up on it then why are you even bothering to ask questions?

Are you going to follow me around the forum for a day or two now, like you normally do when someone makes a post you don't like? I'd rather you didn't.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: OzzieMandias on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:29:13 AM
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2009/nov/12/newcastle-united-rangers-football-ideals
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Heneage on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:30:27 AM
So you can't be arsed reading the thread (or you can, I don't quite get that bit) AND you've nothing to say other than 'it'll never happen'. Why exactly did you come into this thread again?

Look for Peasepud's posts. If you press Ctrl+F then you can find them easily enough. Or look here: http://www.newcastle-online.org/nufcforum/index.php?action=profile;u=54;sa=showPosts
I came here to see what the fuss was about, and you calling me 'Lazy' is f***ing ludicrous, because I share the lack of desire to read 12 pages of an internet message board? Have a word with yourself man, not all of us are so keen on these internet campaigns you set about.

Our fans could not raise £80M to begin with, then there's the fact that the club is now operating at a loss still because of the demotion to the league we are in, when a man with a net value of 2billion is struggling to keep us going that should be all the indication you need. He's said he'll put £20m into the club as of January, that's not on players, that's just in the club, that's keeping the lights on, paying the staff, £20m. Could Nusc draft that up at short notice? You'd need a full house at St James to donate around £400 each to raise that sort of cash, there's no way our fans have that kind of disposable income.

It's a truly lovely and romantic idea of the fans owning the club, but unfortunately business isn't romantic, it's cold and hard, we need someone with solid money and lots of it, and that's not Barry Moat either btw, IF, a new owner offers to sell part of the club to the NUSC then so be it, why they'd want to do that I don't know, but I'm entertaining ideas here.

Out of curiosity are you for this idea or against it?

I'm undecided as to whether it will work due to the sheer numbers of people with your attitude, but I'm certainly for the idea and wish the people behind it all the best.

It's lazy that you just go into a thread and ask the same questions about twenty other people have asked, yes. If you don't have the desire to read up on it then why are you even bothering to ask questions?

Are you going to follow me around the forum for a day or two now, like you normally do when someone makes a post you don't like? I'd rather you didn't.
Lovely mature approach at the end their btw, shining example you are sir, but don't give yourself the credit, the fact you even entertain this idea is all I needed to know.

I'm asking for curisoity, but Jesus Christ Dave, I'm so sorry I didn't want to read double figure pages at this time at night, I'm sorry I don't have your level of commitment. If this was early evening I'd happily sit and trawl through posts, but right now amazingly, I just wanted a quick summary. Why are you so bothered? Did I ask you personally? I don't think I did.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:32:35 AM
You could have read the thread by now tbh, it's been half an hour.

And I don't claim to or have to set any kind of 'example'. Why on earth should I? :lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Heneage on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:33:59 AM
You could have read the thread by now tbh, it's been half an hour.

And I don't claim to or have to set any kind of 'example'. Why on earth should I? :lol:
Dave will you stop following me around and replying to my posts cos you didn't like what I said please.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:36:49 AM
Pitiful.

Night mate.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Thursday 12 November 2009, 08:35:44 AM
I think this has been mentioned here once or twice and Im going to get proper confirmation but where we say on the website that people can donate any amount and we'll bundle them up into totals of £1500 to buy a share then I dont believe we are offering voting rights to those that contributed. I believe that these are plainly and simply a way to let those donate that want to help but are unable to invest themselves.

I'll get proper full confirmation on that but its worth remembering for those that are wondering whether to go down that route or through somewhere such as here.

If I remember correctly the wording on the site is you can donate from £10 upwards so by that phrasing it suggests you don't get a vote unless you put in £1500 min. Unless you do it through a group like has been mentioned for on here.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 08:47:00 AM
I think this has been mentioned here once or twice and Im going to get proper confirmation but where we say on the website that people can donate any amount and we'll bundle them up into totals of £1500 to buy a share then I dont believe we are offering voting rights to those that contributed. I believe that these are plainly and simply a way to let those donate that want to help but are unable to invest themselves.

I'll get proper full confirmation on that but its worth remembering for those that are wondering whether to go down that route or through somewhere such as here.

If I remember correctly the wording on the site is you can donate from £10 upwards so by that phrasing it suggests you don't get a vote unless you put in £1500 min. Unless you do it through a group like has been mentioned for on here.

Yeah, and the £10 upwards is the bit thats causing me a little confusion, if its merely a donation (as I believe it is and we both agree it reads like) then why put a minimum amount on it? might just be poor wording or confusion on my behalf. Maybe we're thinking of sending them a certificate or something and the tenner ensures that the costs of that are covered in the donation.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Thursday 12 November 2009, 08:53:14 AM
I think this has been mentioned here once or twice and Im going to get proper confirmation but where we say on the website that people can donate any amount and we'll bundle them up into totals of £1500 to buy a share then I dont believe we are offering voting rights to those that contributed. I believe that these are plainly and simply a way to let those donate that want to help but are unable to invest themselves.

I'll get proper full confirmation on that but its worth remembering for those that are wondering whether to go down that route or through somewhere such as here.

If I remember correctly the wording on the site is you can donate from £10 upwards so by that phrasing it suggests you don't get a vote unless you put in £1500 min. Unless you do it through a group like has been mentioned for on here.

Yeah, and the £10 upwards is the bit thats causing me a little confusion, if its merely a donation (as I believe it is and we both agree it reads like) then why put a minimum amount on it? might just be poor wording or confusion on my behalf. Maybe we're thinking of sending them a certificate or something and the tenner ensures that the costs of that are covered in the donation.


prehaps your website could make people aware that there are some syndicates being proposed for buying shares like on here,.( maybe with our Admins permission some links? i know toontastic are doing something similar with a £30 pledge each)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 09:08:43 AM
I think this has been mentioned here once or twice and Im going to get proper confirmation but where we say on the website that people can donate any amount and we'll bundle them up into totals of £1500 to buy a share then I dont believe we are offering voting rights to those that contributed. I believe that these are plainly and simply a way to let those donate that want to help but are unable to invest themselves.

I'll get proper full confirmation on that but its worth remembering for those that are wondering whether to go down that route or through somewhere such as here.

If I remember correctly the wording on the site is you can donate from £10 upwards so by that phrasing it suggests you don't get a vote unless you put in £1500 min. Unless you do it through a group like has been mentioned for on here.

Yeah, and the £10 upwards is the bit thats causing me a little confusion, if its merely a donation (as I believe it is and we both agree it reads like) then why put a minimum amount on it? might just be poor wording or confusion on my behalf. Maybe we're thinking of sending them a certificate or something and the tenner ensures that the costs of that are covered in the donation.


prehaps your website could make people aware that there are some syndicates being proposed for buying shares like on here,.( maybe with our Admins permission some links? i know toontastic are doing something similar with a £30 pledge each)

tbh I dont think that helps either side out though. At the end of the day we want as many of these "shares" to be sold. If we direct people to here or TT then it could just mean that the price per share on here drops to a quid say and you still only purchase one or two. Having them create their own with friends, family, workmates etc would result in more shares being bought.

At the same time for here, you should want to keep it among the regulars and not open it up to thousands that will pop in once, hand over a quid and then disappear only to jump back up once in a blue moon and ask for their cash back.

I do agree the website needs a little more clarity on that side of things though.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Thursday 12 November 2009, 09:16:57 AM
I think this has been mentioned here once or twice and Im going to get proper confirmation but where we say on the website that people can donate any amount and we'll bundle them up into totals of £1500 to buy a share then I dont believe we are offering voting rights to those that contributed. I believe that these are plainly and simply a way to let those donate that want to help but are unable to invest themselves.

I'll get proper full confirmation on that but its worth remembering for those that are wondering whether to go down that route or through somewhere such as here.

If I remember correctly the wording on the site is you can donate from £10 upwards so by that phrasing it suggests you don't get a vote unless you put in £1500 min. Unless you do it through a group like has been mentioned for on here.

Yeah, and the £10 upwards is the bit thats causing me a little confusion, if its merely a donation (as I believe it is and we both agree it reads like) then why put a minimum amount on it? might just be poor wording or confusion on my behalf. Maybe we're thinking of sending them a certificate or something and the tenner ensures that the costs of that are covered in the donation.


prehaps your website could make people aware that there are some syndicates being proposed for buying shares like on here,.( maybe with our Admins permission some links? i know toontastic are doing something similar with a £30 pledge each)

tbh I dont think that helps either side out though. At the end of the day we want as many of these "shares" to be sold. If we direct people to here or TT then it could just mean that the price per share on here drops to a quid say and you still only purchase one or two. Having them create their own with friends, family, workmates etc would result in more shares being bought.

At the same time for here, you should want to keep it among the regulars and not open it up to thousands that will pop in once, hand over a quid and then disappear only to jump back up once in a blue moon and ask for their cash back.

I do agree the website needs a little more clarity on that side of things though.


i dont think it will go as low as a pound. At £10 / 150 poeple , we will then be looking at multiple shares.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Thursday 12 November 2009, 09:21:43 AM
I'm waiting with bated breath to see who the "local businesses and institutions" are who will be backing this scheme because so far, although well intentioned, enthusiastic and romantic, it really has been quite amateurish and very clouded in it's detail.
I hope the heavyweights they are keeping under wraps can give this scheme some credibility and a solid businesslike basis.

So far we have seen nothing other than the usual suspects, undoubtedly true fans, but the cynic in me thinks they will never be any more than that even if they switch their seats from the Gallowgate to the director's box.  The NUST under any guise is still the often despised NUSC despite the new flash website and less profane manner.

I hope something can come of this, but I fear the romantic notion of "Barcelona on Tyneside" would only have been achievable before we went down the path of becoming a public company many years ago.
My feeling is that this valiant cause is doomed to failure, I hope I'm wrong and I'm looking forward to the already on board "local businesses and institutions" revealing themselves and giving the scheme a whole lot more substance.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mowen on Thursday 12 November 2009, 09:44:41 AM
Will read up on this properly tonight. I'm intruiged though, I guess the main concern is the stability of the money itself and whether there can be any genuine guarantees on it and where it lies. Will probably have questions later.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: abcdefg on Thursday 12 November 2009, 09:49:03 AM
Anyone else got the Bob The Builder tune in their head?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Thursday 12 November 2009, 12:49:53 PM
At the moment, it feels like we're being sold a dream, not a concrete plan. We're being told that the people with the real expertise are going to be unveiled in due course, so whilst a number of us are getting quite excited at the moment, the more difficult questions have yet to be answered.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Pip on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:05:58 PM
Will read up on this properly tonight. I'm intruiged though, I guess the main concern is the stability of the money itself and whether there can be any genuine guarantees on it and where it lies. Will probably have questions later.

This is my biggest concern.

Is there a financial/business plan in place? I suppose you'll require detailed knowledge of the club's finances to answer that so when you have that information, this thing can become a whole lot more serious than it is now because there's no way £80m will be enough.

It'll buy the club but what happens after that? Who invests the money for transfers? What happens in the event that the club suffers serious financial losses and has to be sold? Who's the main creditor? What's the voting structure? How long is a 'presidential' term? Will the prez be able to appoint anyone he wants (eg. his younger brother who knows nothing but will sit on the board and collect £100k/year)? There needs to be clear and proper rules in place, almost like a constitution, if you will, for the governance of the club. If NUST don't have this or don't plan on forming them quite soon then this whole idea is ridiculous.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:07:12 PM
At the moment, it feels like we're being sold a dream, not a concrete plan. We're being told that the people with the real expertise are going to be unveiled in due course, so whilst a number of us are getting quite excited at the moment, the more difficult questions have yet to be answered.

Are you one of us getting excited though ? Just interested.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Brummiemag on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:07:21 PM
This is a fantastic idea. I need to read more about it, the risks involved etc,  but if this goes ahead and it all seems reasonable I would be very interested in investing something.

At the end of the day a football club belongs to its community and its supporters - it should not be owned and controlled by a private individual.   
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:07:55 PM
Will read up on this properly tonight. I'm intruiged though, I guess the main concern is the stability of the money itself and whether there can be any genuine guarantees on it and where it lies. Will probably have questions later.

This is my biggest concern.

Is there a financial/business plan in place? I suppose you'll require detailed knowledge of the club's finances to answer that so when you have that information, this thing can become a whole lot more serious than it is now because there's no way £80m will be enough.

It'll buy the club but what happens after that? Who invests the money for transfers? What happens in the event that the club suffers serious financial losses and has to be sold? Who's the main creditor? What's the voting structure? How long is a 'presidential' term? Will the prez be able to appoint anyone he wants (eg. his younger brother who knows nothing but will sit on the board and collect £100k/year)? There needs to be clear and proper rules in place, almost like a constitution, if you will, for the governance of the club. If NUST don't have this or don't plan on forming them quite soon then this whole idea is ridiculous.

All those questions apparently will come clearer over the next 6 weeks as they launch this.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:08:57 PM
At the moment, it feels like we're being sold a dream, not a concrete plan. We're being told that the people with the real expertise are going to be unveiled in due course, so whilst a number of us are getting quite excited at the moment, the more difficult questions have yet to be answered.

Are you one of us getting excited though ? Just interested.

Nope.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Pip on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:11:51 PM
I received an e-mail this morning asking me to invest, as I imagine a lot of people did. Have to admit I'm very sceptical, but thought I'd take a further look. Since they're asking for investment now, is there any sort of detailed business plan available anywhere for investors to look at, detailing the source of funding for the club post acquisition, how they plan to convince Barclays or another bank to put up a new working capital facility, and what security will be offered to obtain funding?

There is plenty on the website about the make up of the executive committee, but there doesn't seem to be any detailed financial planning. The Barcelona model works mainly because of the huge income generated, so the club is to an extent not completely reliant on bank funding. NUFC are losing £20m a year at the moment, how will that loss be covered in the first year?

There is a full Q and A section on the website in realtion to the proposed buy out.  At the moment we will be asking peple to deposit 10% of their pledged investment into an escrow account which is set up and handled by a respected city centre local legal firm.  If the buy out does not work then the 10% is refundable.  By all means be secptical, ask the questions, read what NUST has to say, and watch the campaign grow over the coming days, the chron, journal etc will feature full page ads, the website will be updated and reflect whats happening, this is the ultimate protest and the best, most organised, professional, clear and transparent way to remove the current regime.

Will investors get the 10% deposit that's put into the escrow account back? What % of it will be deducted for administrative fees?

I think I'll invest more but only through N-O.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Pip on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:15:53 PM
I don't know if this will p*ss Dave off but I haven't read the middle part of the thread and I'm wondering about the exact number of people required to make this buyout work. :lol:

How much is NUST actually looking for from the average joes and how many average joes are they looking for? You say you have people from banks etc. interested so I presume that you're not looking to raise the whole £80m from normal people. So how many people are you looking for? And how many shares do you ultimately see yourself issueing out? 100k shares worth £1500 each?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Atticus on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:20:04 PM
Think "as many as possible" seems to be the idea, not wanting to speak for Peasepud or NUST. I think they're looking to see how much they can amass from Joe Public to ally with funds from elsewhere.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Parky on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:24:38 PM
Whatever happens the clear build up of mass organised support against MA is undeniable and at some point will find a way to oust him. All good.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:29:08 PM
Ashley and Llambias may already be rattled,  according to the Chronicle llambias was trying to set up a meeting with NUST an hour after they launched the campaign.

NUST have apparently turned down the request as they aren't in a position to discuss it with the club.  I agree that NUST shouldn't be talking until they are in a position to act.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:29:10 PM
At the moment, it feels like we're being sold a dream, not a concrete plan. We're being told that the people with the real expertise are going to be unveiled in due course, so whilst a number of us are getting quite excited at the moment, the more difficult questions have yet to be answered.

And thats understandable, I would be fully in that camp if we were coming on and saying "sign up, pay us your money" but we're not, at this point in time we've given the overview and allowing it to sink in with people. I know many are now thinking its bollocks because we havent supplied more info yet, thats the PR peoples way of doing things and when it comes down to that then they know a lot more about these things than you and I (unless you are a PR person that is!, Im not though so I go with what they say).

Ive raised the concern with the relevant people so maybe they'll speed things up a little.

As an aside, to keep you all in the loop we have had contact with Ashley & co via a third party, for now we've politely declined the offer of discussions because we dont want to raise any false hopes with this. It would be daft to go in and start talking takeovers and amounts without being sure of our position.

Too many have already done that (Sheard, Moat, etc) we would prefer to sit down only when we can prove that we're serious and that wont be until you've all seen the full details, know who is involved and then been able to give a proper indication of your views.

Edit: Just seen Binnsy's post since putting this on, thats the bit I was talking about above.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:33:29 PM
I don't know if this will p*ss Dave off but I haven't read the middle part of the thread and I'm wondering about the exact number of people required to make this buyout work. :lol:

How much is NUST actually looking for from the average joes and how many average joes are they looking for? You say you have people from banks etc. interested so I presume that you're not looking to raise the whole £80m from normal people. So how many people are you looking for? And how many shares do you ultimately see yourself issueing out? 100k shares worth £1500 each?

Thats a difficult one to answer because we have a few different ways of investing and differing amounts. Theres the £1500+ cash one, £25000+ pension investment, donations etc.

On top of that its the bigger investments from big names and businesses which confuses the mix. We have figures in mind, how thats reached is dependant on which ways people want to join it. Technically though the way the scheme runs, its no different to the running of the club if we have 5,000 or 50,000 people involved, each get one vote, each get the same level of return.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Frazzle on Thursday 12 November 2009, 01:53:44 PM
One little thing that confuses me, which I don't think has been answered, is the limit on investors.  Say for example (just making numbers up here!) 50,000 fans/businesses invest enough to buy the club, once the club is bought can anybody then come along and say 'here's £1500 I want in'?  Could the amount of investors theoretically reach 100,000+?  Because there must be a point when the numbers becoming unworkable?

On the other hand it would be a shame if people who can't afford to invest now wouldn't be allowed to stick their cash in at a later date.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Thursday 12 November 2009, 02:02:40 PM
One little thing that confuses me, which I don't think has been answered, is the limit on investors.  Say for example (just making numbers up here!) 50,000 fans/businesses invest enough to buy the club, once the club is bought can anybody then come along and say 'here's £1500 I want in'?  Could the amount of investors theoretically reach 100,000+?  Because there must be a point when the numbers becoming unworkable?

On the other hand it would be a shame if people who can't afford to invest now wouldn't be allowed to stick their cash in at a later date.

totally agree, i cant go a 1500 now but cud next yera maybe. It would also be good if the forum could keep taking donations, and continue to increase its stake.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 02:11:55 PM
One little thing that confuses me, which I don't think has been answered, is the limit on investors.  Say for example (just making numbers up here!) 50,000 fans/businesses invest enough to buy the club, once the club is bought can anybody then come along and say 'here's £1500 I want in'?  Could the amount of investors theoretically reach 100,000+?  Because there must be a point when the numbers becoming unworkable?

On the other hand it would be a shame if people who can't afford to invest now wouldn't be allowed to stick their cash in at a later date.

This is one for the financial experts but I agree with your logic, we are looking to keep it open and allow people to invest at any time which would go towards the clubs running costs but somewhere there has to be a limit otherwise the amount you're paying out in interest becomes unworkable.

These are answers that I would want the financial bods attached to this to come out with but the basic answer is that at this point in time we've not set any time limit on the 2nd phase of the campaign so its envisaged that people will still be able to invest a year or two down the line.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: shellshock on Thursday 12 November 2009, 02:23:54 PM
One little thing that confuses me, which I don't think has been answered, is the limit on investors.  Say for example (just making numbers up here!) 50,000 fans/businesses invest enough to buy the club, once the club is bought can anybody then come along and say 'here's £1500 I want in'?  Could the amount of investors theoretically reach 100,000+?  Because there must be a point when the numbers becoming unworkable?

On the other hand it would be a shame if people who can't afford to invest now wouldn't be allowed to stick their cash in at a later date.

Good question, cant answer it fully yet im afraid, but the current model being set up in the business plan allows for future investors by creating a waiting list (i have not seen the maximum number of investors, but i dont think its been settled on yet anyway), then if somebody dies, somebody leaves, etc, that position or share certifcate vote goes to the investor who is on top of the waiting list.  The business plan and financial prospectus will clarify that
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Thursday 12 November 2009, 02:29:00 PM
One little thing that confuses me, which I don't think has been answered, is the limit on investors.  Say for example (just making numbers up here!) 50,000 fans/businesses invest enough to buy the club, once the club is bought can anybody then come along and say 'here's £1500 I want in'?  Could the amount of investors theoretically reach 100,000+?  Because there must be a point when the numbers becoming unworkable?

On the other hand it would be a shame if people who can't afford to invest now wouldn't be allowed to stick their cash in at a later date.

Good question, cant answer it fully yet im afraid, but the current model being set up in the business plan allows for future investors by creating a waiting list (i have not seen the maximum number of investors, but i dont think its been settled on yet anyway), then if somebody dies, somebody leaves, etc, that position or share certifcate vote goes to the investor who is on top of the waiting list.  The business plan and financial prospectus will clarify that


Something on a  simliar line,  what if this really takes off.  We get control with fans investing as well as some businesses etc.

Later if things are running ok, how would it be managed if another business wants to chuck in a large amount.  Would they jump to the top of the queue?

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: jdckelly on Thursday 12 November 2009, 02:49:34 PM
Ashley and Llambias may already be rattled,  according to the Chronicle llambias was trying to set up a meeting with NUST an hour after they launched the campaign.

NUST have apparently turned down the request as they aren't in a position to discuss it with the club.  I agree that NUST shouldn't be talking until they are in a position to act.
on the other hand wheres the harm in a preliminary hearing, the main obstacle i view for the nust is I can't see Ashley wanting to sell to them, they're negotiating position is weak to begin with and possibly offending the current regime by not meeting them isn't a good way to start.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 02:52:26 PM
Ashley and Llambias may already be rattled,  according to the Chronicle llambias was trying to set up a meeting with NUST an hour after they launched the campaign.

NUST have apparently turned down the request as they aren't in a position to discuss it with the club.  I agree that NUST shouldn't be talking until they are in a position to act.
on the other hand wheres the harm in a preliminary hearing, the main obstacle i view for the nust is I can't see Ashley wanting to sell to them, they're negotiating position is weak to begin with and possibly offending the current regime by not meeting them isn't a good way to start.

No offending has taken place, we've politely declined his offer under the logic of we dont want to waste their time if we cant raise the funds.

I think the fact Llambias called an hour after we launched tells you that hes happy to sell.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: jdckelly on Thursday 12 November 2009, 02:55:27 PM
Ashley and Llambias may already be rattled,  according to the Chronicle llambias was trying to set up a meeting with NUST an hour after they launched the campaign.

NUST have apparently turned down the request as they aren't in a position to discuss it with the club.  I agree that NUST shouldn't be talking until they are in a position to act.
on the other hand wheres the harm in a preliminary hearing, the main obstacle i view for the nust is I can't see Ashley wanting to sell to them, they're negotiating position is weak to begin with and possibly offending the current regime by not meeting them isn't a good way to start.

No offending has taken place, we've politely declined his offer under the logic of we dont want to waste their time if we cant raise the funds.

I think the fact Llambias called an hour after we launched tells you that hes happy to sell.
or he's simply curious about it, asking for a meeting to discuss it could also be a way of politely saying not interested in selling, thanks for the interest.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Thursday 12 November 2009, 02:58:41 PM
Ashley and Llambias may already be rattled,  according to the Chronicle llambias was trying to set up a meeting with NUST an hour after they launched the campaign.

NUST have apparently turned down the request as they aren't in a position to discuss it with the club.  I agree that NUST shouldn't be talking until they are in a position to act.
on the other hand wheres the harm in a preliminary hearing, the main obstacle i view for the nust is I can't see Ashley wanting to sell to them, they're negotiating position is weak to begin with and possibly offending the current regime by not meeting them isn't a good way to start.

No offending has taken place, we've politely declined his offer under the logic of we dont want to waste their time if we cant raise the funds.

I think the fact Llambias called an hour after we launched tells you that hes happy to sell.
or he's simply curious about it, asking for a meeting to discuss it could also be a way of politely saying not interested in selling, thanks for the interest.


my suspicion would be he would try and get NUST on board with ashley, just to get thier hands on the investment, then sell the club further down the line anyway.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Thursday 12 November 2009, 02:59:21 PM
Ashley and Llambias may already be rattled,  according to the Chronicle llambias was trying to set up a meeting with NUST an hour after they launched the campaign.

NUST have apparently turned down the request as they aren't in a position to discuss it with the club.  I agree that NUST shouldn't be talking until they are in a position to act.
on the other hand wheres the harm in a preliminary hearing, the main obstacle i view for the nust is I can't see Ashley wanting to sell to them, they're negotiating position is weak to begin with and possibly offending the current regime by not meeting them isn't a good way to start.

No offending has taken place, we've politely declined his offer under the logic of we dont want to waste their time if we cant raise the funds.

I think the fact Llambias called an hour after we launched tells you that hes happy to sell.
or he's simply curious about it, asking for a meeting to discuss it could also be a way of politely saying not interested in selling, thanks for the interest.

Or Dezza has lost another bet and has to run naked through the meeting
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 03:01:57 PM
or he's simply curious about it, asking for a meeting to discuss it could also be a way of politely saying not interested in selling, thanks for the interest.

Then if thats the case he'll no doubt come on SSN and say that, saving us all time in having a meeting. After all hes got a football club to run and we've got a campaign to manage. In seriousness he doesnt have the time to meet up with a group of people who think they can pull the cash together, under his own rules, you need to prove you have the funds before they'll talk to you. We respect that and want to see this all done properly.

We've dealt with DL a number of times, he knows where we are and who we are. He knows we're serious and he has access to the same info the rest of you do. I dont believe he will take this as a snub, if anything I reckon this was a test. If we'd accepted then I reckon he would have viewed us as less serious about this.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Pip on Thursday 12 November 2009, 03:42:36 PM
One little thing that confuses me, which I don't think has been answered, is the limit on investors.  Say for example (just making numbers up here!) 50,000 fans/businesses invest enough to buy the club, once the club is bought can anybody then come along and say 'here's £1500 I want in'?  Could the amount of investors theoretically reach 100,000+?  Because there must be a point when the numbers becoming unworkable?

On the other hand it would be a shame if people who can't afford to invest now wouldn't be allowed to stick their cash in at a later date.

Why would the numbers be unworkable?

There are of course different models of funds and their returns but because most people investing in the club will do so because of their care/love rather than financial interest, I think it'd be reasonable to operate on an equity fund model (with the equity being the club) where you guarantee an interest rate for 2-5 years then after that, it's wholely up to the judgment of the board when to give out 'dividends'. So for the first 2-5 years, no matter how good/bad the club's finances are, investors would get 2% of their investment back per year, then after that their return will be dependent on the club's finances.

Of course, if you operate using this model, the number of shares has to be restricted to a certain amount and people can 'trade' their 'shares' based on the returns. Then, if you have a significant number of people on your waiting list, you issue more shares after x amount of years guaranteeing y% returns for z years, thus increasing the club's capital without guaranteeing that much returns to your investors, meaning the club isn't leveraged to f***. If you raise more capital, you'll only have to guarantee the return to the people you're getting money from, not all of your investors because the initial guarantee is over. This way, you don't risk a lot but you can still raise money when (if) it's needed.

But that's why I asked about how much NUST are looking for from investors and who they are targetting because there needs to be a specific plan in place regarding the finances if you're going to attract public institutions/funds like pension funds etc.

Personally, I think 2% won't be enough. Think about guaranteeing 5% for 3 years and you'll get money from other people and you only have to guarantee the return for 3 years. This form of fundraising would get your pension funds interested, and hopefully that combined with the money raised from fans will be enough.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Thursday 12 November 2009, 03:43:47 PM
Can the club realistically guarantee any kind of return over such a short time though, when it is currently in debt and presumably making a loss every year?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Thursday 12 November 2009, 03:48:25 PM
who wants a return?. put it in an ISA if that matters.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Pip on Thursday 12 November 2009, 03:48:53 PM
It'll have to if it wants to have any hope of raising enough money.

Guarantee 5%, hope to raise £120m, spend £80m on the club, £25m on players to get promoted then spend that £40m extra cash from the Premiership on players/wages and you'll still have £15m left from the initial capital raised. Say you spend £5m on the interest payments, you're still fine because now two years have passed meaning you only have to guarantee the money for a year and since you're in the Premiership, you can refinance some loans etc. and reinvest in the first-team again. There is risk involved but no one's gotten anywhere in life without taking a few risks. Even the best run club in the world (Arsenal) have risked a lot to get to where they are now.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Thursday 12 November 2009, 03:49:48 PM
who wants a return?. put it in an ISA if that matters.

I know what you mean, but if you're not expecting a return then it isn't an investment... it's a charity donation. And I don't think that's what NUST are asking for, is it?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 03:50:39 PM
Can the club realistically guarantee any kind of return over such a short time though, when it is currently in debt and presumably making a loss every year?

When you think that the interest on the £40m overdraft was running at around £4m per year then yes, £200m raised would mean the club would be bought + investment in the team and running costs yet still paying out the same amount as we were for the overdraft alone.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 03:53:03 PM
who wants a return?. put it in an ISA if that matters.

I know what you mean, but if you're not expecting a return then it isn't an investment... it's a charity donation. And I don't think that's what NUST are asking for, is it?

its a combination of both tbh, we're not expecting people to just hand over their money and say "there you go, have it" (of course if you want to then great :D) but rather, "heres an investment opportunity, invest in the club you love and gain a little bit of interest while you're on". The big difference of course is you can get your original money back from an investment not from a donation.

I suppose the way to look at it is, if you have a spare £1500 sitting that you know you're not going to miss then stick it in here instead of the bank, in ten years time you're not going to be rich off either option, using just the basic maths and not all that compound interest malarky....

Good savings account is what 5-6%? so in ten years you'd have got interest of £900. With this (if it stayed at 2%) then you'd get 200. What it would mean however is that you've technically paid £70 per year to have a say in the club and be part of something of this magnitude. Thats working on the logic you'd have left the cash sitting there.

Others are looking at bunging it on a 0% credit card therefore they would be being paid £20 per year to have their say! how good is that? the club paying you for your views! :D

(Im not advocating that people go into debt for this btw)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Thursday 12 November 2009, 03:54:25 PM
who wants a return?. put it in an ISA if that matters.

I know what you mean, but if you're not expecting a return then it isn't an investment... it's a charity donation. And I don't think that's what NUST are asking for, is it?

its a combination of both tbh, we're not expecting people to just hand over their money and say "there you go, have it" (of course if you want to then great :D) but rather, "heres an investment opportunity, invest in the club you love and gain a little bit of interest while you're on". The big difference of course is you can get your original money back from an investment not from a donation.

I see what you're saying, I know there will be a big emotional and/or charitable aspect to most of the investment. What I meant was more that it was a bit flippant to suggest that nobody will need or expect anything back at any time.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 04:01:52 PM
who wants a return?. put it in an ISA if that matters.

I know what you mean, but if you're not expecting a return then it isn't an investment... it's a charity donation. And I don't think that's what NUST are asking for, is it?

its a combination of both tbh, we're not expecting people to just hand over their money and say "there you go, have it" (of course if you want to then great :D) but rather, "heres an investment opportunity, invest in the club you love and gain a little bit of interest while you're on". The big difference of course is you can get your original money back from an investment not from a donation.

I see what you're saying, I know there will be a big emotional and/or charitable aspect to most of the investment. What I meant was more that it was a bit flippant to suggest that nobody will need or expect anything back at any time.

I agree, for me its an emotional thing, I wouldnt hand over £1500 as a donation but when I know its an investment and I'll get it back then Im happy to do it, even if its not increased by much, the fact it has increased at all would just be a little (tiny) bonus.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Thursday 12 November 2009, 04:03:33 PM
Can the club realistically guarantee any kind of return over such a short time though, when it is currently in debt and presumably making a loss every year?

When you think that the interest on the £40m overdraft was running at around £4m per year then yes, £200m raised would mean the club would be bought + investment in the team and running costs yet still paying out the same amount as we were for the overdraft alone.

If Ashley wants £100m plus £130m repaid for his loans you then have £20m or so for the overdraft and the NUST will have to be looking a fair bit higher than £300m in truth. Obviously this depends on what Ashley wants and most importantly if he wants to sell it to the very people who hate him.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 04:08:58 PM
Can the club realistically guarantee any kind of return over such a short time though, when it is currently in debt and presumably making a loss every year?

When you think that the interest on the £40m overdraft was running at around £4m per year then yes, £200m raised would mean the club would be bought + investment in the team and running costs yet still paying out the same amount as we were for the overdraft alone.

If Ashley wants £100m plus £130m repaid for his loans you then have £20m or so for the overdraft and the NUST will have to be looking a fair bit higher than £300m in truth. Obviously this depends on what Ashley wants and most importantly if he wants to sell it to the very people who hate him.

He doesnt though, I always thought that was the case but the deal he was looking at before he took it off was £80m lock stock n barrel, no debts. Whether thats changed because of his last £20m investment who knows.

As for selling to us, the fact they were on the phone an hour after we launched looking to talk to us answers that I think.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Thursday 12 November 2009, 04:12:06 PM
Well its something that has never been clarified unless he has informed the NUST privately, certainly its provided plenty of debate here over the past 12 months. Obviously i dont know as much as you but surely he would have specifically said he was writing it off at the time?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: icemanblue on Thursday 12 November 2009, 04:14:07 PM
Do I get a free season ticket for stumping up the 1.5k?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Thursday 12 November 2009, 04:17:11 PM
Sorry if this has been answered, but does anyone have any idea how the club's existing debt and overdraft would be handled in a takeover? (I have read the whole thread now, promise)

Does the club only owe money to Ashley, or what about the overdraft? Surely £80-100m is a bargain if the club will come with no debts, but could this ever happen?

Bit of a ramble there, sorry.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Thursday 12 November 2009, 04:54:20 PM
Sorry if this has been answered, but does anyone have any idea how the club's existing debt and overdraft would be handled in a takeover? (I have read the whole thread now, promise)

Does the club only owe money to Ashley, or what about the overdraft? Surely £80-100m is a bargain if the club will come with no debts, but could this ever happen?

Bit of a ramble there, sorry.

If you had read a few posts up you would have seen the same queries ;D
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Thursday 12 November 2009, 04:56:15 PM
Sorry if this has been answered, but does anyone have any idea how the club's existing debt and overdraft would be handled in a takeover? (I have read the whole thread now, promise)

Does the club only owe money to Ashley, or what about the overdraft? Surely £80-100m is a bargain if the club will come with no debts, but could this ever happen?

Bit of a ramble there, sorry.

If you had read a few posts up you would have seen the same queries ;D

What is this, a f***ing comprehension test? :lol:

I didn't see any semblance of an answer, but maybe nobody knows. That's fine too.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: gray on Thursday 12 November 2009, 05:16:39 PM
Ashley and Llambias may already be rattled,  according to the Chronicle llambias was trying to set up a meeting with NUST an hour after they launched the campaign.

NUST have apparently turned down the request as they aren't in a position to discuss it with the club.  I agree that NUST shouldn't be talking until they are in a position to act.
on the other hand wheres the harm in a preliminary hearing, the main obstacle i view for the nust is I can't see Ashley wanting to sell to them, they're negotiating position is weak to begin with and possibly offending the current regime by not meeting them isn't a good way to start.

No offending has taken place, we've politely declined his offer under the logic of we dont want to waste their time if we cant raise the funds.

I think the fact Llambias called an hour after we launched tells you that hes happy to sell.

Doesn't sound very polite on the twitter :lol:

Quote from: @nufctrust
NUST turns down meeting offer with #NUFC MD Llambias. We will talk on our terms, when we're ready.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 07:12:14 PM
Sorry if this has been answered, but does anyone have any idea how the club's existing debt and overdraft would be handled in a takeover? (I have read the whole thread now, promise)

Does the club only owe money to Ashley, or what about the overdraft? Surely £80-100m is a bargain if the club will come with no debts, but could this ever happen?

Bit of a ramble there, sorry.

If you had read a few posts up you would have seen the same queries ;D

What is this, a f***ing comprehension test? :lol:

I didn't see any semblance of an answer, but maybe nobody knows. That's fine too.

I gave our understanding 3 posts up from your query ;)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Thursday 12 November 2009, 07:21:28 PM
Cheers, but I'm still not sure I get it fully. If Ashley was to sell the club 'lock, stock and barrel, no debts' for say £80m... what would happen to the debts? Ashley would take a hit on the ones owed to him I presume, and write them off. But the club would still have a sizeable overdraft, right? Or does this not exist anymore?

I'm not really expecting an answer to this fro you personally peaspud, I haven't got a clue myself.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Thursday 12 November 2009, 07:55:07 PM
Cheers, but I'm still not sure I get it fully. If Ashley was to sell the club 'lock, stock and barrel, no debts' for say £80m... what would happen to the debts? Ashley would take a hit on the ones owed to him I presume, and write them off. But the club would still have a sizeable overdraft, right? Or does this not exist anymore?

I'm not really expecting an answer to this fro you personally peaspud, I haven't got a clue myself.

The overdraft is an unknown however its less than £40m now as per Barclays rules. We;d only really find out the true stuff when we do due diligence, if the clubs in a s*** state and we couldnt afford to run it then we wouldnt buy otherwise we'd be putting the club in deeper crap than it is now.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Thursday 12 November 2009, 08:05:31 PM
who wants a return?. put it in an ISA if that matters.

I know what you mean, but if you're not expecting a return then it isn't an investment... it's a charity donation. And I don't think that's what NUST are asking for, is it?

its a combination of both tbh, we're not expecting people to just hand over their money and say "there you go, have it" (of course if you want to then great :D) but rather, "heres an investment opportunity, invest in the club you love and gain a little bit of interest while you're on". The big difference of course is you can get your original money back from an investment not from a donation.

I see what you're saying, I know there will be a big emotional and/or charitable aspect to most of the investment. What I meant was more that it was a bit flippant to suggest that nobody will need or expect anything back at any time.

I agree, for me its an emotional thing, I wouldnt hand over £1500 as a donation but when I know its an investment and I'll get it back then Im happy to do it, even if its not increased by much, the fact it has increased at all would just be a little (tiny) bonus.

It's not been clear what structure NUST are aiming for, and this post makes me even more confused.

If you're guaranteed to get your original money back (with or without interest), then it's effectively a loan. In which case, who actually owns the club and is responsible for the finances?

If on the other hand, you become part of the ownership of the club through your £1500, then it's a share. You have to sell a share, and it may decline in value.

If there's a third way, or if I've got the above wrong, please you or someone else say.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ikri on Thursday 12 November 2009, 10:49:03 PM
Bit of a hypothetical question.

What would NUST's reaction be if a company like Greggs said that they'd be willing to invest £20m to help purchase the club as long as they were given stadium naming rights for 5 years?

Would NUST be willing to accept renaming St James Park to The Greggs Steak Bake Stadium if it meant gaining control of the club?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: colinmk on Thursday 12 November 2009, 10:59:37 PM
Cheers, but I'm still not sure I get it fully. If Ashley was to sell the club 'lock, stock and barrel, no debts' for say £80m... what would happen to the debts? Ashley would take a hit on the ones owed to him I presume, and write them off. But the club would still have a sizeable overdraft, right? Or does this not exist anymore?

I'm not really expecting an answer to this fro you personally peaspud, I haven't got a clue myself.

The overdraft is an unknown however its less than £40m now as per Barclays rules. We;d only really find out the true stuff when we do due diligence, if the clubs in a s*** state and we couldnt afford to run it then we wouldnt buy otherwise we'd be putting the club in deeper crap than it is now.

This is what kind of f***s everything for everyone at the moment. We only find out how much the club costs after due dilligence...
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Thursday 12 November 2009, 11:14:03 PM
Cheers, but I'm still not sure I get it fully. If Ashley was to sell the club 'lock, stock and barrel, no debts' for say £80m... what would happen to the debts? Ashley would take a hit on the ones owed to him I presume, and write them off. But the club would still have a sizeable overdraft, right? Or does this not exist anymore?

I'm not really expecting an answer to this fro you personally peaspud, I haven't got a clue myself.

The overdraft is an unknown however its less than £40m now as per Barclays rules. We;d only really find out the true stuff when we do due diligence, if the clubs in a s*** state and we couldnt afford to run it then we wouldnt buy otherwise we'd be putting the club in deeper crap than it is now.

This is what kind of f***s everything for everyone at the moment. We only find out how much the club costs after due dilligence...

Yes but then again, all that the NUST have done so far is asked for people to REGISTER there interest in the idea,  the next step will be to pay a 10% refundable (minus 5%) deposit, followed by due dillegence if it gets that far, then pay up the rest of the money and hopefully the end result is we get rid of Ashley.  At the minute people are getting too far ahead of themselves.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Friday 13 November 2009, 04:58:37 AM
Cheers, but I'm still not sure I get it fully. If Ashley was to sell the club 'lock, stock and barrel, no debts' for say £80m... what would happen to the debts? Ashley would take a hit on the ones owed to him I presume, and write them off. But the club would still have a sizeable overdraft, right? Or does this not exist anymore?

I'm not really expecting an answer to this fro you personally peaspud, I haven't got a clue myself.

The overdraft is an unknown however its less than £40m now as per Barclays rules. We;d only really find out the true stuff when we do due diligence, if the clubs in a s*** state and we couldnt afford to run it then we wouldnt buy otherwise we'd be putting the club in deeper crap than it is now.

This is what kind of f***s everything for everyone at the moment. We only find out how much the club costs after due dilligence...

Yes but then again, all that the NUST have done so far is asked for people to REGISTER there interest in the idea,  the next step will be to pay a 10% refundable (minus 5%) deposit, followed by due dillegence if it gets that far, then pay up the rest of the money and hopefully the end result is we get rid of Ashley.  At the minute people are getting too far ahead of themselves.

Exactly, and if it then turns out that we werent buying the club the deposits are returned (minus the 5% hamdling fee) so as I said before if you were looking to invest £1500, you'd pay a deposit of £150 to the Escrow account and if it all went pear shaped, you'd get £142.50 back.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: colinmk on Friday 13 November 2009, 09:21:40 AM
Cheers, but I'm still not sure I get it fully. If Ashley was to sell the club 'lock, stock and barrel, no debts' for say £80m... what would happen to the debts? Ashley would take a hit on the ones owed to him I presume, and write them off. But the club would still have a sizeable overdraft, right? Or does this not exist anymore?

I'm not really expecting an answer to this fro you personally peaspud, I haven't got a clue myself.

The overdraft is an unknown however its less than £40m now as per Barclays rules. We;d only really find out the true stuff when we do due diligence, if the clubs in a s*** state and we couldnt afford to run it then we wouldnt buy otherwise we'd be putting the club in deeper crap than it is now.

This is what kind of f***s everything for everyone at the moment. We only find out how much the club costs after due dilligence...

Yes but then again, all that the NUST have done so far is asked for people to REGISTER there interest in the idea,  the next step will be to pay a 10% refundable (minus 5%) deposit, followed by due dillegence if it gets that far, then pay up the rest of the money and hopefully the end result is we get rid of Ashley.  At the minute people are getting too far ahead of themselves.

Exactly, and if it then turns out that we werent buying the club the deposits are returned (minus the 5% hamdling fee) so as I said before if you were looking to invest £1500, you'd pay a deposit of £150 to the Escrow account and if it all went pear shaped, you'd get £142.50 back.

Fair enough, sounds like a really good idea. I wouldn't like the 5% handling fee although I'm sure that something like Escrow is the safest way of doing it?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ian W on Friday 13 November 2009, 09:38:54 AM
Thanks peaspud, some really good explanations as always.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Elbel1 on Friday 13 November 2009, 10:08:14 AM
Cheers, but I'm still not sure I get it fully. If Ashley was to sell the club 'lock, stock and barrel, no debts' for say £80m... what would happen to the debts? Ashley would take a hit on the ones owed to him I presume, and write them off. But the club would still have a sizeable overdraft, right? Or does this not exist anymore?

I'm not really expecting an answer to this fro you personally peaspud, I haven't got a clue myself.

The overdraft is an unknown however its less than £40m now as per Barclays rules. We;d only really find out the true stuff when we do due diligence, if the clubs in a s*** state and we couldnt afford to run it then we wouldnt buy otherwise we'd be putting the club in deeper crap than it is now.

This is what kind of f***s everything for everyone at the moment. We only find out how much the club costs after due dilligence...

Yes but then again, all that the NUST have done so far is asked for people to REGISTER there interest in the idea,  the next step will be to pay a 10% refundable (minus 5%) deposit, followed by due dillegence if it gets that far, then pay up the rest of the money and hopefully the end result is we get rid of Ashley.  At the minute people are getting too far ahead of themselves.

Exactly, and if it then turns out that we werent buying the club the deposits are returned (minus the 5% hamdling fee) so as I said before if you were looking to invest £1500, you'd pay a deposit of £150 to the Escrow account and if it all went pear shaped, you'd get £142.50 back.

So if the NUST manage to raise the estimated £80 million the investors will each pay 10% into the escrow acount, which works out at £8,000,000
If it then goes pearshaped during due diligence all deposits are returned minus 5% handling fee
This handling fee will be worth a total of £400,000 based on a registered £80 million but I would imagine that the NUST are hoping for a lot more than that

The whole financial world is like Chinese maths to me but that seems like an awful lot of money to me
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Friday 13 November 2009, 10:17:17 AM
It does sound a lot, I agree however you have to remember this is a handling fee per investor as such, each investor pledging £1500 would incur a handling fee (if we didnt go ahead) of £7.50. If you think theres the admin to manage that and get the money back to the investor then thats not a huge amount.

Also to note, this isnt our handling fee, its a proper full solicitor that is running that side of things and handling the ESCROW so none of that fee will find its way into the NUST.

£7.50 for a solicitor seems quite cheap tbh!
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Saturday 14 November 2009, 09:07:30 AM
who wants a return?. put it in an ISA if that matters.

I know what you mean, but if you're not expecting a return then it isn't an investment... it's a charity donation. And I don't think that's what NUST are asking for, is it?

its a combination of both tbh, we're not expecting people to just hand over their money and say "there you go, have it" (of course if you want to then great :D) but rather, "heres an investment opportunity, invest in the club you love and gain a little bit of interest while you're on". The big difference of course is you can get your original money back from an investment not from a donation.

I see what you're saying, I know there will be a big emotional and/or charitable aspect to most of the investment. What I meant was more that it was a bit flippant to suggest that nobody will need or expect anything back at any time.

I agree, for me its an emotional thing, I wouldnt hand over £1500 as a donation but when I know its an investment and I'll get it back then Im happy to do it, even if its not increased by much, the fact it has increased at all would just be a little (tiny) bonus.

It's not been clear what structure NUST are aiming for, and this post makes me even more confused.

If you're guaranteed to get your original money back (with or without interest), then it's effectively a loan. In which case, who actually owns the club and is responsible for the finances?

If on the other hand, you become part of the ownership of the club through your £1500, then it's a share. You have to sell a share, and it may decline in value.

If there's a third way, or if I've got the above wrong, please you or someone else say.

Actually, it seems to me there's a simpler way of looking at it. In the unlikely event of a sale taking place, you can't be guaranteed your money back because Mr Ashley will have it. The only way to recover that outlay would be if the club were later sold on, or if you sold your share. In which case, like a plc, the value may go up or down. Yeah?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Saturday 14 November 2009, 09:19:56 AM
Do we know how long before the full information is released on this?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Saturday 14 November 2009, 11:22:46 AM
Do we know how long before the full information is released on this?

I know it would be good to get a bit more out there. I know they are meant to know what their doing but so far the only information the company launching this have released is stuff we kinda already knew before the launch lol
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Saturday 14 November 2009, 12:20:06 PM
bobyule - Im not in a position to answer your query at the mo, not because I dont want to or arent allowed to but because I dont really understand the facts around that myself so Id be wary of any answer I give. What you say makes sense though, however its not matching in with my understanding on certain bits so please bear with me. 

The full financial information will be out shortly (at least a few days thought) , theres a few things still being discussed and amended with the partners and a few additional thoughts and ideas that have come from these type of Q&A's are being looked at therefore it all needs to be watertight and properly organised first. We dont want to be releasing the financial info and then two days later saying "oh this has now changed" or even more worryingly, 2 days after people have started signing up to it.

At the moment, we're getting a handle on how many of you would be interested, not until all the info has been released would be looking for people to start committing. I know its a little frustrating but imagine what its like for us! we know this can work, when you read all the stuff that comes out then Im sure you will be convinced too.

If nothing else has been learnt from the shaky start we had as the NUSC, we've at least learnt not to rush things out and dive in making statements and promises we cant keep.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Saturday 14 November 2009, 04:51:45 PM
You can hear Mark Jensen and Lisa Bullivant from the Trust talking to Kevin Williams on Radio Newcastle tonight 4.50 - 6.30pm. Its a phone in so get your questions ready.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/playlive/bbc_radio_newcastle/

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Frazzle on Saturday 14 November 2009, 05:05:31 PM
Will it be on iplayer later?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cp40 on Saturday 14 November 2009, 06:05:04 PM
You can hear Mark Jensen and Lisa Bullivant from the Trust talking to Kevin Williams on Radio Newcastle tonight 4.50 - 6.30pm. Its a phone in so get your questions ready.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/playlive/bbc_radio_newcastle/







The bird is an irritating listen.


she talks like a contestant off the apprentice.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Sunday 15 November 2009, 11:17:12 AM
Just seen the advert in today's Sunday Sun. Brilliant stuff.

But "Barcelona on Tyne"? Shepherdtastic. :lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mick on Sunday 15 November 2009, 11:51:06 AM
When will NUST be in a position to make an offer for the club?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Sunday 15 November 2009, 12:22:35 PM
The campaign is running for six weeks, by that time we will know whether this is viable and the level of monies we have available, if its enough then we will have our deposits in and be able to prove "proof of funds".
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: SteveMc on Sunday 15 November 2009, 01:22:52 PM
Is that 6 weeks from when the announcement was made last week?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Sunday 15 November 2009, 02:23:23 PM
Is that 6 weeks from when the announcement was made last week?

Yes, in total its a six week campaign.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Pip on Sunday 15 November 2009, 02:36:31 PM
Best of luck, peasepud.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: icemanblue on Sunday 15 November 2009, 02:47:26 PM
Aye, really hope it comes off. I'll be doing my bit.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mick on Sunday 15 November 2009, 05:49:02 PM
The campaign is running for six weeks, by that time we will know whether this is viable and the level of monies we have available, if its enough then we will have our deposits in and be able to prove "proof of funds".

I read that it was 6 weeks in the first post of this thread which is dated 7th October then noticed that Rich had edited the whole post.  :lol:

Anyway, do you think the asking price will change between now and the end of the season?

I think Ashley will want £100 million now that he's put in an extra £20 million and I think that will go up by at least 50% if we get promoted.  The asking price will probably start going up very soon if we're still winning games.

When will the "high profile backers" be named?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Sunday 15 November 2009, 09:56:08 PM
Names of the backers and businesses involved will start coming out very shortly, as it is everyones working on getting the financial aspects finalised, which are almost all complete but as I said earlier, things change once you announce, people such as yourselves ask questions that havent been thought of or give ideas which mean a few tweaks etc.

What it does mean though is that we all get a financial product that should be spot on and have all the questions answered. The big businesses are then happier to be associated with a product which does exactly whats needed.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Teasy on Tuesday 17 November 2009, 12:51:03 AM
I'd love to be involved in this though at the moment there's no way I could find £1500.  All my savings are tied up in Marks and Spencer shares.  I'm still looking forward to reading the full plans though and hope it comes off.  If it does I can hopefully get a share in a year or so.

Also on the subject of interest.  Why not have an option for people to opt out?  It might sound insane, but as long as I know my investment is safe personally I'd be prepared to forgo any interest in order to save costs and provide more money to run things (I'm sure I could live without the £30 a year interest or whatever it'd be).  No idea how many others would but it wouldn't hurt to have the option (like one of those "tick here to donate a certain percentage on top of your payment to charity" buttons you get on some websites).
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Tuesday 17 November 2009, 01:43:18 AM
http://www.sport.es/default.asp?idpublicacio_PK=44&idioma=CAS&idnoticia_PK=661041&idseccio_PK=806

It's even reached the Spanish sports sites. :lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 17 November 2009, 05:41:21 AM
I'd love to be involved in this though at the moment there's no way I could find £1500.  All my savings are tied up in Marks and Spencer shares.  I'm still looking forward to reading the full plans though and hope it comes off.  If it does I can hopefully get a share in a year or so.

Also on the subject of interest.  Why not have an option for people to opt out?  It might sound insane, but as long as I know my investment is safe personally I'd be prepared to forgo any interest in order to save costs and provide more money to run things (I'm sure I could live without the £30 a year interest or whatever it'd be).  No idea how many others would but it wouldn't hurt to have the option (like one of those "tick here to donate a certain percentage on top of your payment to charity" buttons you get on some websites).

hmmm, cheers, I'll put that forward.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: PJ87 on Tuesday 17 November 2009, 07:38:18 AM
Names of the backers and businesses involved will start coming out very shortly, as it is everyones working on getting the financial aspects finalised, which are almost all complete but as I said earlier, things change once you announce, people such as yourselves ask questions that havent been thought of or give ideas which mean a few tweaks etc.

What it does mean though is that we all get a financial product that should be spot on and have all the questions answered. The big businesses are then happier to be associated with a product which does exactly whats needed.


Ant n Dec will surely be in there with a million or two I reckon.

Would Chezza Cole be allowed to invest, as technically she may have an affiliation to Chelsea, with Ashers playing for them?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 08:28:37 AM
The Sun claiming that NUST has snubbed a meeting with Ashley

Quote
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2734647/Fans-not-in-Toon-with-Mike.html

MIKE ASHLEY has been left stunned after the Toon fans who want to buy the club snubbed the chance to meet him.
The Newcastle United Supporters Trust hope to raise £100million to take over on Tyneside and were invited to have a face-to-face chat with the St James' Park owner and his team.

But the Ashley camp cannot understand the logic of them not wanting to look at the finances and get an understanding of how the Premier League club is run.

A source close to Ashley said: "Mike and Derek Llambias have no problem in meeting with anyone to discuss the situation at the club.

"But to hear they were not interested was strange. They need to see what really goes on.

"If they did that, they would see that taking on a club and financing it is anything but straightforward."



Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2734647/Fans-not-in-Toon-with-Mike.html#ixzz0XCK48RMK
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mowen on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 08:48:49 AM
Ashley and Llambias may already be rattled,  according to the Chronicle llambias was trying to set up a meeting with NUST an hour after they launched the campaign.

NUST have apparently turned down the request as they aren't in a position to discuss it with the club.  I agree that NUST shouldn't be talking until they are in a position to act.
on the other hand wheres the harm in a preliminary hearing, the main obstacle i view for the nust is I can't see Ashley wanting to sell to them, they're negotiating position is weak to begin with and possibly offending the current regime by not meeting them isn't a good way to start.

No offending has taken place, we've politely declined his offer under the logic of we dont want to waste their time if we cant raise the funds.

I think the fact Llambias called an hour after we launched tells you that hes happy to sell.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 09:16:11 AM
For whatever reason, NUST are keeping what cards they have very close to their chest and I'm not surprised that they didn't want to meet with Llambias. For the club it would be as much about sussing NUST's position out, as informing them about the state of the business.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 09:33:05 AM
The Sun claiming that NUST has snubbed a meeting with Ashley

Quote
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2734647/Fans-not-in-Toon-with-Mike.html

MIKE ASHLEY has been left stunned after the Toon fans who want to buy the club snubbed the chance to meet him.
The Newcastle United Supporters Trust hope to raise £100million to take over on Tyneside and were invited to have a face-to-face chat with the St James' Park owner and his team.

But the Ashley camp cannot understand the logic of them not wanting to look at the finances and get an understanding of how the Premier League club is run.

A source close to Ashley said: "Mike and Derek Llambias have no problem in meeting with anyone to discuss the situation at the club.

"But to hear they were not interested was strange. They need to see what really goes on.

"If they did that, they would see that taking on a club and financing it is anything but straightforward."



Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2734647/Fans-not-in-Toon-with-Mike.html#ixzz0XCK48RMK

Ah, the "source close to Ashley" :lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 11:10:52 AM
That article even by Sun standards is terrible like. Hope to raise £100m? How can they say that then finish with 'financing it is anything but straightforward'? Of course it isnt you arselicking c***s, thats why they arent getting ahead of themselves by meeting them and discussing figures without knowing how much they will raise :knuppel2:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Ketsbaia on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 11:13:16 AM
The Sun claiming that NUST has snubbed a meeting with Ashley

Quote
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2734647/Fans-not-in-Toon-with-Mike.html

MIKE ASHLEY has been left stunned after the Toon fans who want to buy the club snubbed the chance to meet him.
The Newcastle United Supporters Trust hope to raise £100million to take over on Tyneside and were invited to have a face-to-face chat with the St James' Park owner and his team.

But the Ashley camp cannot understand the logic of them not wanting to look at the finances and get an understanding of how the Premier League club is run.

A source close to Ashley said: "Mike and Derek Llambias have no problem in meeting with anyone to discuss the situation at the club.

"But to hear they were not interested was strange. They need to see what really goes on.

"If they did that, they would see that taking on a club and financing it is anything but straightforward."



Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2734647/Fans-not-in-Toon-with-Mike.html#ixzz0XCK48RMK

 :facepalm:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Northerngimp on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 11:32:10 AM
Terrible article.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Brummiemag on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 12:43:26 PM
To be expected from a s***, right wing, Tory comic like the Sun
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 12:47:27 PM
Ashley's communication is awful. He rarely speaks himself, and it would probably be better if LLambias didn't speak at all. His favoured method of communication seems to be leaking stories in the rags. Shepherd was a plank but at least he wasn't afraid to speak directly to the public.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 12:56:41 PM
Ashley's communication is awful. He rarely speaks himself, and it would probably be better if LLambias didn't speak at all. His favoured method of communication seems to be leaking stories in the rags. Shepherd was a plank but at least he wasn't afraid to speak directly to the public.

In fairness I think his recent interviews with Radio Newcastle were about as open as any club chairman could be but whatever he says he'll be criticised by most.
It really has reached a point where he's damned if he speaks and damned if he doesn't and this is bound to lead to a reticence to communicate.
Thet said the presentation (e.g. stadium sponsorship) leaves a lot to be desired.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Wednesday 18 November 2009, 02:21:12 PM
Ashley's communication is awful. He rarely speaks himself, and it would probably be better if LLambias didn't speak at all. His favoured method of communication seems to be leaking stories in the rags. Shepherd was a plank but at least he wasn't afraid to speak directly to the public.

In fairness I think his recent interviews with Radio Newcastle were about as open as any club chairman could be but whatever he says he'll be criticised by most.
It really has reached a point where he's damned if he speaks and damned if he doesn't and this is bound to lead to a reticence to communicate.
Thet said the presentation (e.g. stadium sponsorship) leaves a lot to be desired.

How can you have openess from someone who has lied his arse off?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Friday 20 November 2009, 06:49:45 AM
http://www.nust.org.uk/images/stories/yeswecan/promo/nust_journal_3.pdf

Has the price gone back up to £2,500?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ohmelads on Friday 20 November 2009, 09:08:53 AM
In fairness I think his recent interviews with Radio Newcastle were about as open as any club chairman could be but whatever he says he'll be criticised by most.
It really has reached a point where he's damned if he speaks and damned if he doesn't and this is bound to lead to a reticence to communicate.
Thet said the presentation (e.g. stadium sponsorship) leaves a lot to be desired.

Which interviews are you referring to?

His interviews have been as clear as mud and give absolutely nothing away at a time when the fans and perhaps most importantly the players want some idea of the club's direction. Communication is crucial in the club's current state. We've been in limbo for 18 months, the club was recently taken off the market with no real explanation. The stadium name has been changed with the excuse of 'showcasing the brand' while keeping the name, despite tagging 'stadium' the end. No explanation for this, nor any explanation as to where the increased revenue would go if we found a sponsor. We lost players in the summer who grew disillusioned and it's his job to come out and reassure people that short- and long-term plans are in place. At worst his interviews are outright lying and at best they fail to inform anyone of anything. For example he said he'd back Hughton if he wanted a player for a million and in the same breath said he'd prefer if Hughton came to him for loan signings, while saying he is looking at the list Hughton has given him already. It's unconvincing bollocks and if it carries on there'll be more players looking for the exits.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Friday 20 November 2009, 01:00:27 PM
http://www.nust.org.uk/images/stories/yeswecan/promo/nust_journal_3.pdf

Has the price gone back up to £2,500?

No, the decision to drop it to £1,500 was made quite late on, by that time the Chronicle had already drawn up the adverts. Not sure why they couldnt have been updated, it could even be that its an oversight on our behalf and not thought to chase them up and get them updated.

Its been raised now, hopefully the next time one appears it will be correct....*crosses fingers
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Sunday 22 November 2009, 12:45:05 AM
In fairness I think his recent interviews with Radio Newcastle were about as open as any club chairman could be but whatever he says he'll be criticised by most.
It really has reached a point where he's damned if he speaks and damned if he doesn't and this is bound to lead to a reticence to communicate.
Thet said the presentation (e.g. stadium sponsorship) leaves a lot to be desired.

Which interviews are you referring to?

His interviews have been as clear as mud and give absolutely nothing away at a time when the fans and perhaps most importantly the players want some idea of the club's direction. Communication is crucial in the club's current state. We've been in limbo for 18 months, the club was recently taken off the market with no real explanation. The stadium name has been changed with the excuse of 'showcasing the brand' while keeping the name, despite tagging 'stadium' the end. No explanation for this, nor any explanation as to where the increased revenue would go if we found a sponsor. We lost players in the summer who grew disillusioned and it's his job to come out and reassure people that short- and long-term plans are in place. At worst his interviews are outright lying and at best they fail to inform anyone of anything. For example he said he'd back Hughton if he wanted a player for a million and in the same breath said he'd prefer if Hughton came to him for loan signings, while saying he is looking at the list Hughton has given him already. It's unconvincing bollocks and if it carries on there'll be more players looking for the exits.

Maybe the Fabrice Pancrate signing is an example of Ashley's financial backing of Hughton. I doubt many other 2nd tier clubs could afford him.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JamesyJazz on Sunday 22 November 2009, 01:44:14 AM
In fairness I think his recent interviews with Radio Newcastle were about as open as any club chairman could be but whatever he says he'll be criticised by most.
It really has reached a point where he's damned if he speaks and damned if he doesn't and this is bound to lead to a reticence to communicate.
Thet said the presentation (e.g. stadium sponsorship) leaves a lot to be desired.

Which interviews are you referring to?

His interviews have been as clear as mud and give absolutely nothing away at a time when the fans and perhaps most importantly the players want some idea of the club's direction. Communication is crucial in the club's current state. We've been in limbo for 18 months, the club was recently taken off the market with no real explanation. The stadium name has been changed with the excuse of 'showcasing the brand' while keeping the name, despite tagging 'stadium' the end. No explanation for this, nor any explanation as to where the increased revenue would go if we found a sponsor. We lost players in the summer who grew disillusioned and it's his job to come out and reassure people that short- and long-term plans are in place. At worst his interviews are outright lying and at best they fail to inform anyone of anything. For example he said he'd back Hughton if he wanted a player for a million and in the same breath said he'd prefer if Hughton came to him for loan signings, while saying he is looking at the list Hughton has given him already. It's unconvincing bollocks and if it carries on there'll be more players looking for the exits.

Maybe the Fabrice Pancrate signing is an example of Ashley's financial backing of Hughton. I doubt many other 2nd tier clubs could afford him.

I doubt we would have even considered scouting him never mind signing him a couple of seasons ago.It just goes to show how desperate we are to put some spin on a 2nd rate player.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Sunday 22 November 2009, 02:25:45 AM
In fairness I think his recent interviews with Radio Newcastle were about as open as any club chairman could be but whatever he says he'll be criticised by most.
It really has reached a point where he's damned if he speaks and damned if he doesn't and this is bound to lead to a reticence to communicate.
Thet said the presentation (e.g. stadium sponsorship) leaves a lot to be desired.

Which interviews are you referring to?

His interviews have been as clear as mud and give absolutely nothing away at a time when the fans and perhaps most importantly the players want some idea of the club's direction. Communication is crucial in the club's current state. We've been in limbo for 18 months, the club was recently taken off the market with no real explanation. The stadium name has been changed with the excuse of 'showcasing the brand' while keeping the name, despite tagging 'stadium' the end. No explanation for this, nor any explanation as to where the increased revenue would go if we found a sponsor. We lost players in the summer who grew disillusioned and it's his job to come out and reassure people that short- and long-term plans are in place. At worst his interviews are outright lying and at best they fail to inform anyone of anything. For example he said he'd back Hughton if he wanted a player for a million and in the same breath said he'd prefer if Hughton came to him for loan signings, while saying he is looking at the list Hughton has given him already. It's unconvincing bollocks and if it carries on there'll be more players looking for the exits.

Maybe the Fabrice Pancrate signing is an example of Ashley's financial backing of Hughton. I doubt many other 2nd tier clubs could afford him.

I doubt we would have even considered scouting him never mind signing him a couple of seasons ago.It just goes to show how desperate we are to put some spin on a 2nd rate player.

Well us being a 2nd rate club what else do you suggest?

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: OzzieMandias on Sunday 22 November 2009, 03:28:02 AM
Quote

Doing the right thing is German football's forte

In putting fans and tradition before profit, the Bundesliga upholds values the Premier League has lost

Robert Enke had been capped eight times at the time of his death and had not quite cemented his position as Germany's No1 goalkeeper. Watching the sincere and moving tributes from team-mates and taking note of the fact that Germany immediately cancelled their friendly fixture with Chile, it was tempting to wonder whether the same thing would have happened in this country, or whether England's game against Brazil would have gone ahead on the always available pretext that it was what the player would have wanted.

One thing it is safe to say is that German football can be relied upon to do the right thing by players and fans, and not necessarily the money‑making thing. That much was spelled out by Dr Reinhard Rauball, president of the Deutsche Fussball Liga, after a meeting of all 36 first and second division clubs in Frankfurt emphatically rejected a proposal to allow teams to be bought, sold and owned as they are here and in Italy. English football has been congratulating itself on finally ousting an owner who failed the fit and proper test, with Stephen Vaughan instructed to reduce his shareholding in Chester City after admitting to a VAT fraud. That's progress of a sort, though typically small scale and English. In Germany, the whole concept of ownership fails the fit and proper test.

Under existing rules, no "outside" investor can own more than 49% of a German club's shares and at least 51%, ie a controlling vote, must remain with club members. Naturally enough this deters the sort of private takeovers that have become the norm in the Premier League and when Hannover proposed a change designed to encourage rich backers to pour their money into clubs they failed to gain a single vote of support.

"The result cannot be any clearer," Rauball said after the Frankfurt meeting had effectively sided 35-1 in favour of the status quo. "The Bundesliga remains faithful to itself and will continue to build on the factors which have made a decisive contribution to making German football successful over recent decades. These are stability, continuity and being close to the fans."

As a mission statement that is almost perfect, and there is only one small thing with which to take issue. German football has not been successful over recent decades, at least not in the way that English football has been successful – generating income, attracting players and viewers from around the world, getting teams into Champions League finals and generally getting itself noticed. German sides are no longer the bullies of the European playground, Bayern Munich look likely to drop into the Europa League, and with Lyon and Bordeaux presently topping their groups it is possible to argue that the French league is now more powerful.

That is not quite the case, however, for European competition is only one measure of success. Inside France, the French league does not look quite so robust, whereas from inside Germany the Bundesliga is as strong as ever. Full stadiums, massive crowds, affordable ticket prices, support from all sections of the community; name something desirable in a national pastime and Germany has it. There is no shortage of players to supply the national team, no embarrassing over-reliance on imported talent on the field or in the dug-out, and while Germany may no longer be automatic favourites to reach the final of any forthcoming tournament their ranking of fifth in the world puts them deservedly ahead of England and France.

Perhaps most astonishing of all to English eyes, the Germans do not ask their public to pay through the nose for subscription television either. A decision to keep all Bundesliga games free to air was estimated to have cost German football €150m four years ago, and when the subject came up again last week the same course was agreed upon. That may seem like taking altruism too far and simply throwing money away, yet the Germans know they have a massive internal market and a business model that works. Maintaining a highly visible TV presence helps keep the game popular and profitable. "We are able to make a profit from our extensive TV presence," the DFL's managing director, Tom Bender, explained. "We are No1 in Europe with €500m (£450m) from sponsorship."

In other words, because German football is on television so often and its popularity remains high, it is more attractive to sponsors and advertisers than its English counterpart. Manchester United and Chelsea may still be prominent enough to make big money from shirt sponsors, but teams lower down the Premier League have lost revenue and even gone without sponsors in recent seasons. The German system is not perfect – Schalke 04 are the latest club with financial problems reportedly bordering on bankruptcy, and Hannover are not quite the lone voice they might appear in arguing that private investment is necessary to compete with Europe's leading clubs – though in general terms Germany seems to have taken a long look at the English model and decided against it.

That, along with a team such as Wolfsburg winning the title last season, ought to make us think. Is Germany really a football nation in decline, or have they got it exactly right?

It may be some time before German teams appear in three Champions League finals in four years, as happened a decade ago, but that hardly seems too high a price to pay when the whole country watches football, can still afford a half-time beer and sausage, and does not have to put up with Mike Ashley or Sky trailers.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2009/nov/22/bundesliga-premier-league-club-ownership
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Sunday 22 November 2009, 02:47:40 PM
That's a very interesting article. Thanks for posting that.

I've sometimes wondered why the German League seems to be operating in a different way to the other major leagues, and that makes it clear.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ohmelads on Sunday 22 November 2009, 03:33:28 PM
Well us being a 2nd rate club what else do you suggest?

That signing only adds more evidence that there is no transfer kitty and Llambias was just running his mouth again. Right wing was one of our biggest priorities, arguably the biggest and it's been filled by an out of contract player turned down by Sheff Utd.

It may have been opportunism but it seems more likely we're scraping the bottom of the barrel. That's that spot sealed for the rest of the season. Looking at the rest of the squad, there's nowhere where you can see them spending a million without selling first. If there was anywhere to spend that money it was right wing and they haven't done it. There's nothing in the kitty.

Signing a good Championship winger, or a young up and coming winger would have been in keeping with the policy Llambias said he's operating. His exact words were 16 - 22 year olds I believe.

The only reason I and anybody else greets this signing as good news is because, let's face it, we had no faith in the club to strengthen the squad at all and he just might turn out to be a handy option. There's been absolutely nowt to cheer about for a long time and noone takes Llambias, Ashley et al seriously any more. I wonder how our Arsenal scouting system is coming along.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ohmelads on Sunday 22 November 2009, 03:43:40 PM
Quote

Doing the right thing is German football's forte

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2009/nov/22/bundesliga-premier-league-club-ownership

Good read that.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Brummiemag on Sunday 22 November 2009, 04:22:15 PM
Quote

Doing the right thing is German football's forte

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2009/nov/22/bundesliga-premier-league-club-ownership

Good read that.

Great read, I wish we had their system. It shows what is possible

As I've said many times the Premier League/subscription tv is the worst thing that has ever happened to English football
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: colinmk on Sunday 22 November 2009, 05:24:55 PM
Quote

Doing the right thing is German football's forte

In putting fans and tradition before profit, the Bundesliga upholds values the Premier League has lost

Robert Enke had been capped eight times at the time of his death and had not quite cemented his position as Germany's No1 goalkeeper. Watching the sincere and moving tributes from team-mates and taking note of the fact that Germany immediately cancelled their friendly fixture with Chile, it was tempting to wonder whether the same thing would have happened in this country, or whether England's game against Brazil would have gone ahead on the always available pretext that it was what the player would have wanted.

One thing it is safe to say is that German football can be relied upon to do the right thing by players and fans, and not necessarily the money‑making thing. That much was spelled out by Dr Reinhard Rauball, president of the Deutsche Fussball Liga, after a meeting of all 36 first and second division clubs in Frankfurt emphatically rejected a proposal to allow teams to be bought, sold and owned as they are here and in Italy. English football has been congratulating itself on finally ousting an owner who failed the fit and proper test, with Stephen Vaughan instructed to reduce his shareholding in Chester City after admitting to a VAT fraud. That's progress of a sort, though typically small scale and English. In Germany, the whole concept of ownership fails the fit and proper test.

Under existing rules, no "outside" investor can own more than 49% of a German club's shares and at least 51%, ie a controlling vote, must remain with club members. Naturally enough this deters the sort of private takeovers that have become the norm in the Premier League and when Hannover proposed a change designed to encourage rich backers to pour their money into clubs they failed to gain a single vote of support.

"The result cannot be any clearer," Rauball said after the Frankfurt meeting had effectively sided 35-1 in favour of the status quo. "The Bundesliga remains faithful to itself and will continue to build on the factors which have made a decisive contribution to making German football successful over recent decades. These are stability, continuity and being close to the fans."

As a mission statement that is almost perfect, and there is only one small thing with which to take issue. German football has not been successful over recent decades, at least not in the way that English football has been successful – generating income, attracting players and viewers from around the world, getting teams into Champions League finals and generally getting itself noticed. German sides are no longer the bullies of the European playground, Bayern Munich look likely to drop into the Europa League, and with Lyon and Bordeaux presently topping their groups it is possible to argue that the French league is now more powerful.

That is not quite the case, however, for European competition is only one measure of success. Inside France, the French league does not look quite so robust, whereas from inside Germany the Bundesliga is as strong as ever. Full stadiums, massive crowds, affordable ticket prices, support from all sections of the community; name something desirable in a national pastime and Germany has it. There is no shortage of players to supply the national team, no embarrassing over-reliance on imported talent on the field or in the dug-out, and while Germany may no longer be automatic favourites to reach the final of any forthcoming tournament their ranking of fifth in the world puts them deservedly ahead of England and France.

Perhaps most astonishing of all to English eyes, the Germans do not ask their public to pay through the nose for subscription television either. A decision to keep all Bundesliga games free to air was estimated to have cost German football €150m four years ago, and when the subject came up again last week the same course was agreed upon. That may seem like taking altruism too far and simply throwing money away, yet the Germans know they have a massive internal market and a business model that works. Maintaining a highly visible TV presence helps keep the game popular and profitable. "We are able to make a profit from our extensive TV presence," the DFL's managing director, Tom Bender, explained. "We are No1 in Europe with €500m (£450m) from sponsorship."

In other words, because German football is on television so often and its popularity remains high, it is more attractive to sponsors and advertisers than its English counterpart. Manchester United and Chelsea may still be prominent enough to make big money from shirt sponsors, but teams lower down the Premier League have lost revenue and even gone without sponsors in recent seasons. The German system is not perfect – Schalke 04 are the latest club with financial problems reportedly bordering on bankruptcy, and Hannover are not quite the lone voice they might appear in arguing that private investment is necessary to compete with Europe's leading clubs – though in general terms Germany seems to have taken a long look at the English model and decided against it.

That, along with a team such as Wolfsburg winning the title last season, ought to make us think. Is Germany really a football nation in decline, or have they got it exactly right?

It may be some time before German teams appear in three Champions League finals in four years, as happened a decade ago, but that hardly seems too high a price to pay when the whole country watches football, can still afford a half-time beer and sausage, and does not have to put up with Mike Ashley or Sky trailers.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2009/nov/22/bundesliga-premier-league-club-ownership

Exactly the way it should be.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Teasy on Sunday 22 November 2009, 11:20:01 PM
Well us being a 2nd rate club what else do you suggest?

That signing only adds more evidence that there is no transfer kitty and Llambias was just running his mouth again. Right wing was one of our biggest priorities, arguably the biggest and it's been filled by an out of contract player turned down by Sheff Utd.

It may have been opportunism but it seems more likely we're scraping the bottom of the barrel. That's that spot sealed for the rest of the season. Looking at the rest of the squad, there's nowhere where you can see them spending a million without selling first. If there was anywhere to spend that money it was right wing and they haven't done it. There's nothing in the kitty.

Signing a good Championship winger, or a young up and coming winger would have been in keeping with the policy Llambias said he's operating. His exact words were 16 - 22 year olds I believe.

It doesn't add any evidence.  The transfer window isn't even open, so if we want a player for a problem position now then its a free or an emergency loan, there are no other options.

By the way, Sheffield United passed up the chance to sign him because his agent wanted a £75k fee to for them to sign the player on a loan for 6 months.  Clearly by there managers words they did actually want to sign him on a free.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Sunday 22 November 2009, 11:30:18 PM
In fairness I think his recent interviews with Radio Newcastle were about as open as any club chairman could be but whatever he says he'll be criticised by most.
It really has reached a point where he's damned if he speaks and damned if he doesn't and this is bound to lead to a reticence to communicate.
Thet said the presentation (e.g. stadium sponsorship) leaves a lot to be desired.

Which interviews are you referring to?

His interviews have been as clear as mud and give absolutely nothing away at a time when the fans and perhaps most importantly the players want some idea of the club's direction. Communication is crucial in the club's current state. We've been in limbo for 18 months, the club was recently taken off the market with no real explanation. The stadium name has been changed with the excuse of 'showcasing the brand' while keeping the name, despite tagging 'stadium' the end. No explanation for this, nor any explanation as to where the increased revenue would go if we found a sponsor. We lost players in the summer who grew disillusioned and it's his job to come out and reassure people that short- and long-term plans are in place. At worst his interviews are outright lying and at best they fail to inform anyone of anything. For example he said he'd back Hughton if he wanted a player for a million and in the same breath said he'd prefer if Hughton came to him for loan signings, while saying he is looking at the list Hughton has given him already. It's unconvincing bollocks and if it carries on there'll be more players looking for the exits.

Maybe the Fabrice Pancrate signing is an example of Ashley's financial backing of Hughton. I doubt many other 2nd tier clubs could afford him.

No i don't think its an example of Ashley's financial backing of Hughton,  picked up a free agent on a short term deal.  I think most clubs in the 2nd tier could afford him,  after all he was unemployed and we are 2 third of the way into the season, any club wanting him would be in the driving seat when it came down to the negotiating stage.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ohmelads on Monday 23 November 2009, 12:44:53 AM
It doesn't add any evidence.  The transfer window isn't even open, so if we want a player for a problem position now then its a free or an emergency loan, there are no other options.

By the way, Sheffield United passed up the chance to sign him because his agent wanted a £75k fee to for them to sign the player on a loan for 6 months.  Clearly by there managers words they did actually want to sign him on a free.

They would not have handed him a contract if there were plans to sign a winger in January, would they? Right wing was the last remaining first team spot.

Do you honestly believe they will invest money in signings without selling first? When was the last time we did that?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Teasy on Monday 23 November 2009, 01:12:02 PM
It doesn't add any evidence.  The transfer window isn't even open, so if we want a player for a problem position now then its a free or an emergency loan, there are no other options.

By the way, Sheffield United passed up the chance to sign him because his agent wanted a £75k fee to for them to sign the player on a loan for 6 months.  Clearly by there managers words they did actually want to sign him on a free.

They would not have handed him a contract if there were plans to sign a winger in January, would they? Right wing was the last remaining first team spot.

Do you honestly believe they will invest money in signings without selling first? When was the last time we did that?

We need players now, rejecting a player the manager wants (especially one on such a favourable contract) in order to wait until January would be a terrible idea, unless the player they were after was pretty special.

I didn't say they'd invest any money in January by the way, I've always doubted we would.  What I didn't expect is for us to bring in a player in a position we needed to fill as soon as possible, which is a very positive move IMO.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Monday 23 November 2009, 06:44:41 PM
It doesn't add any evidence.  The transfer window isn't even open, so if we want a player for a problem position now then its a free or an emergency loan, there are no other options.

By the way, Sheffield United passed up the chance to sign him because his agent wanted a £75k fee to for them to sign the player on a loan for 6 months.  Clearly by there managers words they did actually want to sign him on a free.

They would not have handed him a contract if there were plans to sign a winger in January, would they? Right wing was the last remaining first team spot.

Do you honestly believe they will invest money in signings without selling first? When was the last time we did that?

We need players now, rejecting a player the manager wants (especially one on such a favourable contract) in order to wait until January would be a terrible idea, unless the player they were after was pretty special.

I didn't say they'd invest any money in January by the way, I've always doubted we would.  What I didn't expect is for us to bring in a player in a position we needed to fill as soon as possible, which is a very positive move IMO.

That's my take on it as well. If Pancrate turns out to be a lemon then I would ask questions of Hughton rather than Ashley. We already know that this regime won't invest money in players, but unfortunately neither will anyone else so we are stuck with it. I am actually surprised that Ashley gave his approval to this one, say what you will but plenty of Championship clubs couldn't afford these sort of wages.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 23 November 2009, 09:37:16 PM
I'll ask another question in an attempt to get this thread back on track............


Suppose I'm interested in this and have say £15k that I'd be willing to invest, ie. not enough for the pension option, but 10 times the minimum investment.

If I invest the £15k and then a few years down I want/need to sell my investment (or part of it), will it not just be worth the same as someone who has invested only a £1,500 investment?  What I mean is by buying my £15k investment would someone not just be entitled to one vote, which is exactly the same as if they bought a £1,500 investment from someone else?  Would this mean I am immediately writing of £13,500 of my initial investment as soon as I make it?

Or if I invest £15,000 would it give me ten potential votes that I'd be able to sell at a future date, even though obviously I'd only be entitled to one vote whilst I owned £15,000 worth of "stock"?

Apologies if this has been answered elsewhere.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Monday 23 November 2009, 10:36:58 PM
I'll ask another question in an attempt to get this thread back on track............


Suppose I'm interested in this and have say £15k that I'd be willing to invest, ie. not enough for the pension option, but 10 times the minimum investment.

If I invest the £15k and then a few years down I want/need to sell my investment (or part of it), will it not just be worth the same as someone who has invested only a £1,500 investment?  What I mean is by buying my £15k investment would someone not just be entitled to one vote, which is exactly the same as if they bought a £1,500 investment from someone else?  Would this mean I am immediately writing of £13,500 of my initial investment as soon as I make it?

Or if I invest £15,000 would it give me ten potential votes that I'd be able to sell at a future date, even though obviously I'd only be entitled to one vote whilst I owned £15,000 worth of "stock"?

Apologies if this has been answered elsewhere.

You'd have 1 vote and be earning 2% interest on your 15k.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 23 November 2009, 11:02:09 PM

You'd have 1 vote and be earning 2% interest on your 15k.

Yeah I appreciate that, what I'm wondering is does it place me at a massive disadvantage if I want to cash in my investment, given that people are unlikely to pay a premium just to secure a 2% return.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Monday 23 November 2009, 11:44:37 PM
Why not just put the £1,500 in several different names if you wanted to invest £15,000 and get 10 votes anyway?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: tgarve on Tuesday 24 November 2009, 12:37:09 AM
This whole thing really annoys me, it will never ever happen in a million years, people will invest alot of time and money into this to no avail and it will create a set of supporters who believe they are above the rest because they have invested. I know people will shoot down me for saying this but it will probally be true in the end. I feel as big a supporter as anyone else and i like the way people are so passionate they will do this but people need to have a reality check. Il hold my hands up if wrong.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Tuesday 24 November 2009, 09:17:28 AM

You'd have 1 vote and be earning 2% interest on your 15k.

Yeah I appreciate that, what I'm wondering is does it place me at a massive disadvantage if I want to cash in my investment, given that people are unlikely to pay a premium just to secure a 2% return.

Surprised you didn't get the answer I got on a similar question - why would you want to cash it in if you are a true fan???
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Tuesday 24 November 2009, 09:21:07 AM
Is this still going on? Heard nothing since the first day other than peasepubs own help and news of the wrong adverts being printed.

Now over 2 weeks in and no sign of an update :undecided:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Elliottman on Tuesday 24 November 2009, 04:31:47 PM
Is this still going on? Heard nothing since the first day other than peasepubs own help and news of the wrong adverts being printed.

Now over 2 weeks in and no sign of an update :undecided:

its certainly went pretty quiet, especially after all the talk of names of investors coming out??
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Tuesday 24 November 2009, 04:37:18 PM
its a 6 week campaign,  they are about 12 days into it,  they've launched it, held a roadshow in Gosforth last week,  holding another on at the Strawberry in town this week,  going to Swalwell next week,  there not exactly twiddling there thumbs.  i also think they are planning something for Saturday as its the first home game since the launch.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Tuesday 24 November 2009, 07:52:02 PM
its a 6 week campaign,  they are about 12 days into it,  they've launched it, held a roadshow in Gosforth last week,  holding another on at the Strawberry in town this week,  going to Swalwell next week,  there not exactly twiddling there thumbs.  i also think they are planning something for Saturday as its the first home game since the launch.

I know they have, but not everyone can make them or knows about all of them. It just seems strange that they would let over a week go by when theres no football without keeping the idea in the public as much as possible
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 05:37:55 AM
Apologies, Im chasing this today as I also agree there needs to be more info coming out now. I know it appears to have gone quiet but believe me in the background things are moving at quite a pace, the problem is the financial institutions are still putting those final touches to the documentation (the final touches I said a week ago would be done in a few days  :blush:). Once thats out then things will really start to step up a gear.

Its frustrating though, I agree.

Liam, I've taken your question away, I can definitely see the logic in what you're saying, if you bought a single £1500 investment then thats got to be easier to sell on than a £15,000 one, personally I dont see any reason (other than potential admin costs) as to why you wouldnt be able to sell it off in blocks ie sell 3 "shares" to reduce your investment to £10,500 and three new investors come into play with 3 lots of £1500 from yours.

I'll get back to you on that.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 09:15:02 AM
Cheers for that. As you know the lifespam of a NUFC story is about 7 days(stadium names anyone?) so was wondering why the hold up. Its not a thing to let go stale in the public eye if that makes any sense. :undecided:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 09:32:15 AM
Apologies, Im chasing this today as I also agree there needs to be more info coming out now. I know it appears to have gone quiet but believe me in the background things are moving at quite a pace, the problem is the financial institutions are still putting those final touches to the documentation (the final touches I said a week ago would be done in a few days  :blush:). Once thats out then things will really start to step up a gear.

Its frustrating though, I agree.

Liam, I've taken your question away, I can definitely see the logic in what you're saying, if you bought a single £1500 investment then thats got to be easier to sell on than a £15,000 one, personally I dont see any reason (other than potential admin costs) as to why you wouldnt be able to sell it off in blocks ie sell 3 "shares" to reduce your investment to £10,500 and three new investors come into play with 3 lots of £1500 from yours.

I'll get back to you on that.

Cheers
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 11:03:28 AM
If each investment accrues 2% return then the £80million will cost the club £1,600,000.

Is this 2% per year? or a flat return regardless of the lenght of time the investment is held?

If the latter, are people happy with near enough £2,000,000 going out of the club each year?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 11:10:04 AM
If each investment accrues 2% return then the £80million will cost the club £1,600,000.

Is this 2% per year? or a flat return regardless of the lenght of time the investment is held?

If the latter, are people happy with near enough £2,000,000 going out of the club each year?

Theres an explanation earlier, am not doing the work for you( :razz:) but is the interest currently £4m for whatever we pay out or something? Sure peasepud answered it though
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 11:59:17 AM
I did, it's somewhere in the depths of the thread. Basically we currently pay 12% interest on our overdraft, so £40m was costing £4.8m per year in interest. £200m through this scheme wil cost us £4m so basically if nothing else the football club would save £800k in interest payments but have had a cash injection of £100m+.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Teasy on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 12:58:33 PM
If each investment accrues 2% return then the £80million will cost the club £1,600,000.

Is this 2% per year? or a flat return regardless of the lenght of time the investment is held?

If the latter, are people happy with near enough £2,000,000 going out of the club each year?

Its nothing to be worried about IMO, its certainly a very generous rate of interest (for the club).  For instance before Ashley paid off the debt the club were paying out £8m a year on debts of around £80m.  Even after that was paid off we were still paying more then £1.6m a year just for the overdraft facility (between £2m to £4m depending how much of it we used).  At first it looks like a hindrance as the club has to pay out £1.6m a year just to be owned by the fans.  However as more people buy a share the club gains cash to spend while only having to pay a fraction of the interest they'd have to pay to any other investor.

Though I did mention having the option to opt out of interest payments in order to keep the money in the club.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 01:15:30 PM
If each investment accrues 2% return then the £80million will cost the club £1,600,000.

Is this 2% per year? or a flat return regardless of the lenght of time the investment is held?

If the latter, are people happy with near enough £2,000,000 going out of the club each year?

Before Ashley paid off the debt the club were paying out £8m a year on debts of around £80m.  Even after that was paid off we were still paying more then £1.6m a year just for the overdraft facility (between £2m to £4m depending how much of it we used).  So I don't see £1.6m as anything to be worried about.  Though I did mention having the option to opt out of interest payments in order to keep the money in the club.

If its £1.6million total outflow then fine, my worry is that it is £1.6million to the members, then another trench to service a loan and another trench to service an overdraft etc.

I know I'm a negative bod when it comes to the NUST and this intiative but believe me I'm willing to be converted and if its the best way forward then I'll support them 100%. However, I can't see how we as supporters can generate enough income to get the club back to challenging for Europe without looking for outside assistance, which will come at a cost. We've all seen what happens when you borrow against banking on Europe (Luque/Owen etc) and then you don't get there. I just hope that when the plans are unveiled in their totality that a sustainable path (maybe a 5 year plan or such like) with achievable and sustained improvement are detailed along with how much in full it is likely to cost the club. We should be able to generate more income than Everton purely due to the size of the stadium, the question is though is there a plan on how to use it effectively?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Teasy on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 01:31:13 PM
If each investment accrues 2% return then the £80million will cost the club £1,600,000.

Is this 2% per year? or a flat return regardless of the lenght of time the investment is held?

If the latter, are people happy with near enough £2,000,000 going out of the club each year?

Before Ashley paid off the debt the club were paying out £8m a year on debts of around £80m.  Even after that was paid off we were still paying more then £1.6m a year just for the overdraft facility (between £2m to £4m depending how much of it we used).  So I don't see £1.6m as anything to be worried about.  Though I did mention having the option to opt out of interest payments in order to keep the money in the club.

If its £1.6million total outflow then fine, my worry is that it is £1.6million to the members, then another trench to service a loan and another trench to service an overdraft etc.

I know I'm a negative bod when it comes to the NUST and this intiative but believe me I'm willing to be converted and if its the best way forward then I'll support them 100%. However, I can't see how we as supporters can generate enough income to get the club back to challenging for Europe without looking for outside assistance, which will come at a cost. We've all seen what happens when you borrow against banking on Europe (Luque/Owen etc) and then you don't get there. I just hope that when the plans are unveiled in their totality that a sustainable path (maybe a 5 year plan or such like) with achievable and sustained improvement are detailed along with how much in full it is likely to cost the club. We should be able to generate more income than Everton purely due to the size of the stadium, the question is though is there a plan on how to use it effectively?

It all comes down to how much money the fans put in really, and also how we're run if/when we get back into the Premiership of course.  For instance if we really could raise £200m (which is a major doubt) we'd then be paying out £4m a year to members but we'd have £120m in the clubs bank account.  Not only would that actually generate millions in interest from the bank but it would also mean we'd have no need for an expensive overdraft and no need for outside loans.  Then again if we raise £100m we'll have £20m in the bank (initially of course as shares will still be available to buy) which is still healthier then having nowt in the bank and using a large overdraft as usual.  Of course we may raise £60m and all this will mean nowt.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 02:26:12 PM
The price will not be £80m but the rest sounds about right.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 02:29:06 PM
is anyone from here going to the Roadshow at the Strawberry 2moro night?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 25 November 2009, 03:23:35 PM
If each investment accrues 2% return then the £80million will cost the club £1,600,000.

Is this 2% per year? or a flat return regardless of the lenght of time the investment is held?

If the latter, are people happy with near enough £2,000,000 going out of the club each year?

Before Ashley paid off the debt the club were paying out £8m a year on debts of around £80m.  Even after that was paid off we were still paying more then £1.6m a year just for the overdraft facility (between £2m to £4m depending how much of it we used).  So I don't see £1.6m as anything to be worried about.  Though I did mention having the option to opt out of interest payments in order to keep the money in the club.

If its £1.6million total outflow then fine, my worry is that it is £1.6million to the members, then another trench to service a loan and another trench to service an overdraft etc.

I know I'm a negative bod when it comes to the NUST and this intiative but believe me I'm willing to be converted and if its the best way forward then I'll support them 100%. However, I can't see how we as supporters can generate enough income to get the club back to challenging for Europe without looking for outside assistance, which will come at a cost. We've all seen what happens when you borrow against banking on Europe (Luque/Owen etc) and then you don't get there. I just hope that when the plans are unveiled in their totality that a sustainable path (maybe a 5 year plan or such like) with achievable and sustained improvement are detailed along with how much in full it is likely to cost the club. We should be able to generate more income than Everton purely due to the size of the stadium, the question is though is there a plan on how to use it effectively?

It all comes down to how much money the fans put in really, and also how we're run if/when we get back into the Premiership of course.  For instance if we really could raise £200m (which is a major doubt) we'd then be paying out £4m a year to members but we'd have £120m in the clubs bank account.  Not only would that actually generate millions in interest from the bank but it would also mean we'd have no need for an expensive overdraft and no need for outside loans.  Then again if we raise £100m we'll have £20m in the bank (initially of course as shares will still be available to buy) which is still healthier then having nowt in the bank and using a large overdraft as usual.  Of course we may raise £60m and all this will mean nowt.

Would't have to pay out £4m a year to members either as many members will say the club can have their interest so that number could come down.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Teasy on Thursday 26 November 2009, 07:01:55 PM
If each investment accrues 2% return then the £80million will cost the club £1,600,000.

Is this 2% per year? or a flat return regardless of the lenght of time the investment is held?

If the latter, are people happy with near enough £2,000,000 going out of the club each year?

Before Ashley paid off the debt the club were paying out £8m a year on debts of around £80m.  Even after that was paid off we were still paying more then £1.6m a year just for the overdraft facility (between £2m to £4m depending how much of it we used).  So I don't see £1.6m as anything to be worried about.  Though I did mention having the option to opt out of interest payments in order to keep the money in the club.

If its £1.6million total outflow then fine, my worry is that it is £1.6million to the members, then another trench to service a loan and another trench to service an overdraft etc.

I know I'm a negative bod when it comes to the NUST and this intiative but believe me I'm willing to be converted and if its the best way forward then I'll support them 100%. However, I can't see how we as supporters can generate enough income to get the club back to challenging for Europe without looking for outside assistance, which will come at a cost. We've all seen what happens when you borrow against banking on Europe (Luque/Owen etc) and then you don't get there. I just hope that when the plans are unveiled in their totality that a sustainable path (maybe a 5 year plan or such like) with achievable and sustained improvement are detailed along with how much in full it is likely to cost the club. We should be able to generate more income than Everton purely due to the size of the stadium, the question is though is there a plan on how to use it effectively?

It all comes down to how much money the fans put in really, and also how we're run if/when we get back into the Premiership of course.  For instance if we really could raise £200m (which is a major doubt) we'd then be paying out £4m a year to members but we'd have £120m in the clubs bank account.  Not only would that actually generate millions in interest from the bank but it would also mean we'd have no need for an expensive overdraft and no need for outside loans.  Then again if we raise £100m we'll have £20m in the bank (initially of course as shares will still be available to buy) which is still healthier then having nowt in the bank and using a large overdraft as usual.  Of course we may raise £60m and all this will mean nowt.

Would't have to pay out £4m a year to members either as many members will say the club can have their interest so that number could come down.

Hopefully they'll include that option when they finally announce the start of the scheme.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Friday 27 November 2009, 12:30:56 PM
For anyone with any queries or questions for NUST just seen this on there website, they are holding a supporter surgery(strange name for it!) before the Swansea match upstairs in the irish club.....

In line with NUST's "More than a Trust" document, we will be running our first Supporter Surgery on Saturday before the Swansea Game. Similar to those ran by MP's, the surgery is for supporters to meet with the Trust and air any individual problems that they have or present any ideas that the Trust can then go away and talk to the Club to try and resolve these issues. The surgery will take place on the 2nd Floor of The Irish Centre and there will be someone present from the Trust from 1-2.30pm
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Friday 27 November 2009, 06:27:59 PM
I think its important to note that the idea of the surgeries is not to take questions on the likes of the Yes we can campaign or what the NUST is doing but more a chance for people to raise issues they have with the football club. For instance if you're having problems with stewards, the price of pies, warm beer, problem fans around you etc.

Things that one fan on their own cant really get sorted or get their message across to the right person, we may be able to help out, the contacts and (although its probably not obvious) the fairly good relationship we have with certain relevant people in the club means we have a chance of helping out.

Although, problems such as "how come Harewood gets a game?" arent really what we're looking for. ;)

Saying all that though, if you're in the Irish Club and do have a question on something NUST related then we'll happily attempt to answer it.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mowen on Monday 30 November 2009, 10:08:06 AM
These things do seem like a good idea and it's only right to keep building interest but for those of us who are interesting in participating but not from the area it does feel as though it's gone a bit quiet. Probably that's partly due to the expectation of getting everthing, instantly that the internet gives you. Hats off for all the hard work mind.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 30 November 2009, 10:49:09 AM
These things do seem like a good idea and it's only right to keep building interest but for those of us who are interesting in participating but not from the area it does feel as though it's gone a bit quiet. Probably that's partly due to the expectation of getting everthing, instantly that the internet gives you. Hats off for all the hard work mind.

Yeah, (I think) today marks them being half way through the six week campaign.  It does seem to have disappeared from the news etc.

The whole thing is in need of a significant update to keep people interested.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Monday 30 November 2009, 11:55:52 AM
These things do seem like a good idea and it's only right to keep building interest but for those of us who are interesting in participating but not from the area it does feel as though it's gone a bit quiet. Probably that's partly due to the expectation of getting everthing, instantly that the internet gives you. Hats off for all the hard work mind.

Maybe they're all clearing up the litter they created around SJP on Saturday.
They were dishing out leaflets - even the owners of tacky bars now seem to realise that handing leaflets to people going to the match is not a particularly smart idea as 95% of them just get thrown away immediately. At least the bar owners pay business rates towards the cost of cleaning the place up.
Come on NUST you must have a smarter way of doing it than creating a litter problem around the city.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JJ7 on Monday 30 November 2009, 12:14:11 PM
Bit of a pathetic moan there. If you're going to moan about something, at least make it about something slightly interesting. You just look petty otherwise.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Monday 30 November 2009, 12:26:09 PM
NUST = Litterbugs.

The complete c***s.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Monday 30 November 2009, 12:27:58 PM
Bit of a pathetic moan there. If you're going to moan about something, at least make it about something slightly interesting. You just look petty otherwise.

It's all about opinions, but I think littering the streets is anything but petty and I'd expect an organisation which wants to be taken seriously and take over one of the biggest football club brands in the world to have a bit more off than handing out leaflets which anyone with half a brain knows just get thrown away by most people.
I hate litter !
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Monday 30 November 2009, 12:43:15 PM
Bit of a pathetic moan there. If you're going to moan about something, at least make it about something slightly interesting. You just look petty otherwise.

It's all about opinions, but I think littering the streets is anything but petty and I'd expect an organisation which wants to be taken seriously and take over one of the biggest football club brands in the world to have a bit more off than handing out leaflets which anyone with half a brain knows just get thrown away by most people.
I hate litter !

I thought NUST were trying to take over Newcastle United,  who last time i looked are currently a 2nd division club in England not Barca, Man U, Juventus or one of the other biggest clubs in the world.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Frazzle on Monday 30 November 2009, 12:50:09 PM
Speaking of second division clubs, what happens to NUST's plan if we get promoted?  Isn't Ashley just going to ask for more money?  I understand that these things take time but surely it's in NUST's best interests to buy the club before we return to the PL (although as we are nearly in 2010 this probably isn't feasible). 
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Monday 30 November 2009, 03:29:15 PM
Bit of a pathetic moan there. If you're going to moan about something, at least make it about something slightly interesting. You just look petty otherwise.

It's all about opinions, but I think littering the streets is anything but petty and I'd expect an organisation which wants to be taken seriously and take over one of the biggest football club brands in the world to have a bit more off than handing out leaflets which anyone with half a brain knows just get thrown away by most people.
I hate litter !

That gives me a nice little idea for a sweepstake.

If I ripped your limbs from your torso and scattered them about the town centre what would you die from first? Blood loss or anger at the act of littering which I have just committed?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Monday 30 November 2009, 03:57:36 PM
I thought NUST were trying to take over Newcastle United,  who last time i looked are currently a 2nd division club in England not Barca, Man U, Juventus or one of the other biggest clubs in the world.

Which is exactly why I did NOT say we were one of the biggest clubs in the world, which as a 2nd division club, you correctly state we are NOT.
We are still however one of the biggest football club brands in the world, despite our demise.

Either way I think they are a bit out of their depth, but like many others I patiently await the introduction the "major businesses and institutions" they are about to unveil as backers of their scheme, who will give it credibility and prove me and many other doubters wrong.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JJ7 on Monday 30 November 2009, 04:06:07 PM
Benwell Lad. You might be dead against litter, but its still quite a petty thing to moan about. From your post I would assume your are already against NUST and you're just looking for any little thing to pick holes. You're hardly likely to convince people by moaning about a leaflet hand out. If anything you're only highlighting how petty some of the arguements against are.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: olliemort on Monday 30 November 2009, 04:10:03 PM
Bit of a pathetic moan there. If you're going to moan about something, at least make it about something slightly interesting. You just look petty otherwise.

It's all about opinions, but I think littering the streets is anything but petty and I'd expect an organisation which wants to be taken seriously and take over one of the biggest football club brands in the world to have a bit more off than handing out leaflets which anyone with half a brain knows just get thrown away by most people.
I hate litter !

I thought NUST were trying to take over Newcastle United,  who last time i looked are currently a 2nd division club in England not Barca, Man U, Juventus or one of the other biggest clubs in the world.
That would be mean so when Juventus got relegated in 2006 to Serie B they werent a big club anymore?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Monday 30 November 2009, 04:10:48 PM
Bit of a pathetic moan there. If you're going to moan about something, at least make it about something slightly interesting. You just look petty otherwise.

It's all about opinions, but I think littering the streets is anything but petty and I'd expect an organisation which wants to be taken seriously and take over one of the biggest football club brands in the world to have a bit more off than handing out leaflets which anyone with half a brain knows just get thrown away by most people.
I hate litter !

I thought NUST were trying to take over Newcastle United,  who last time i looked are currently a 2nd division club in England not Barca, Man U, Juventus or one of the other biggest clubs in the world.

And yet in it's ads include, "Barcelona on Tyne". ;)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Colo's Short and Curlies on Monday 30 November 2009, 04:43:09 PM
Bit of a pathetic moan there. If you're going to moan about something, at least make it about something slightly interesting. You just look petty otherwise.

It's all about opinions, but I think littering the streets is anything but petty and I'd expect an organisation which wants to be taken seriously and take over one of the biggest football club brands in the world to have a bit more off than handing out leaflets which anyone with half a brain knows just get thrown away by most people.
I hate litter !

I thought NUST were trying to take over Newcastle United,  who last time i looked are currently a 2nd division club in England not Barca, Man U, Juventus or one of the other biggest clubs in the world.

And yet in it's ads include, "Barcelona on Tyne". ;)

Does that mean we are ditching the Black and White Stripes if NUST buy the club :frantic:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: bealios on Monday 30 November 2009, 05:36:31 PM
Interesting thought, what is the NUST view if Moat gets there before you and buys the club? Will the supporters trust get behind him and issue a statement of support, or will it demand that Moat sells to the trust?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Monday 30 November 2009, 08:20:02 PM
Interesting thought, what is the NUST view if Moat gets there before you and buys the club? Will the supporters trust get behind him and issue a statement of support, or will it demand that Moat sells to the trust?

lol Barry Moat isn't buying NUFC
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: WashyGeordie on Monday 30 November 2009, 08:21:32 PM
Interesting thought, what is the NUST view if Moat gets there before you and buys the club? Will the supporters trust get behind him and issue a statement of support, or will it demand that Moat sells to the trust?

lol Barry Moat isn't buying NUFC

Chris Moat is.  :pow:

 :fishing:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Monday 30 November 2009, 10:23:18 PM
Benwell Lad. You might be dead against litter, but its still quite a petty thing to moan about. From your post I would assume your are already against NUST and you're just looking for any little thing to pick holes. You're hardly likely to convince people by moaning about a leaflet hand out. If anything you're only highlighting how petty some of the arguements against are.

If NUST ever manage to buy Newcastle United I think they might be in for an unpleasant surprise about how many "petty" red tape, rules and regulations they have to comply with.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 03:59:45 AM
Benwell Lad. You might be dead against litter, but its still quite a petty thing to moan about. From your post I would assume your are already against NUST and you're just looking for any little thing to pick holes. You're hardly likely to convince people by moaning about a leaflet hand out. If anything you're only highlighting how petty some of the arguements against are.

If NUST ever manage to buy Newcastle United I think they might be in for an unpleasant surprise about how many "petty" red tape, rules and regulations they have to comply with.

Just to clear something up here, we didnt hand out any leaflets on Saturday, we delivered them to bars around the city and left on tables within the bars.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 10:12:58 AM
Bit of a pathetic moan there. If you're going to moan about something, at least make it about something slightly interesting. You just look petty otherwise.

It's all about opinions, but I think littering the streets is anything but petty and I'd expect an organisation which wants to be taken seriously and take over one of the biggest football club brands in the world to have a bit more off than handing out leaflets which anyone with half a brain knows just get thrown away by most people.
I hate litter !

I thought NUST were trying to take over Newcastle United,  who last time i looked are currently a 2nd division club in England not Barca, Man U, Juventus or one of the other biggest clubs in the world.

And yet in it's ads include, "Barcelona on Tyne". ;)

Which when you think about it is almost as sacreligious (and just as tacky and laughable) as trying to call the stadium [email protected] ot whatever they want to call SJP.
One rule for one............
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 10:16:19 AM
Interesting thought, what is the NUST view if Moat gets there before you and buys the club? Will the supporters trust get behind him and issue a statement of support, or will it demand that Moat sells to the trust?

I see this as a (yet another) problem in Ashley trying to sell the club.
Will any serious buyer think they have to appease this seemingly unappeasable unelected fan group or end up in the same situation as the current regime ?
It may well put people off.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mowen on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 10:21:03 AM
:lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 10:27:37 AM
Benwell Lad. You might be dead against litter, but its still quite a petty thing to moan about. From your post I would assume your are already against NUST and you're just looking for any little thing to pick holes. You're hardly likely to convince people by moaning about a leaflet hand out. If anything you're only highlighting how petty some of the arguements against are.

Well your right on the litter thing JJ.
Thing is I'm not so much against the supporters buy out as I just think it's 20 years too late and may work if we'd been a Conference level club.
I am actually a great proponent of the German football or sports club model which gives all fans real ownership - but they've always done it and didn't go down the PLC and "oligarch ownership" route BEFORE trying to turn it round.
To date this campaign has displayed nothing more than a few of the usual suspects opportunistically using the present unpopular ownership as a means to get their bums warm in the director's box.
I've seen or heard nothing credible or positive yet, but as I said earlier I live in hope that when they wheel out the serious institutions and business investors they claim to be working with, I'll be proved wrong and see this as a way forward.
Right now though I just can't see it.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 03:23:18 PM
Quote from: nufc.com match report
A new NUST flag was raised at half time in the Gallowgate End and reportedly taken down by stewards.

Any news on why/what was on it?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 03:51:47 PM
How's the fraud investigation going.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Gorilla on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 04:12:24 PM
Still can't see this, they'll need about 300M at least realistically.  Plus I can't see many pesion schemes investing in a football club.  You'd have to be mental to put all that money at stake on the onus of making a profit, you'd have more chance going to Vegas and sticking it all on black.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 04:14:09 PM
How's the fraud investigation going.

That was an NUST banner?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 04:15:40 PM
How's the fraud investigation going.

It was a bog standard "Yes We Can" banner. That wasn't related to NUST and that was only raised at kick off.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 04:24:09 PM
Ah right, sorry. Wires crossed.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Wallace on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 04:33:31 PM
The "Yes We Can" banner was passed over the heads of supporters in the Gallowgate at half-time and was taken away by stewards as it approached the corner.

Apparently, the stewards have been told to remove all banners and have been noting seat numbers of those people with them.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 04:42:17 PM
The "Yes We Can" banner was passed over the heads of supporters in the Gallowgate at half-time and was taken away by stewards as it approached the corner.

Apparently, the stewards have been told to remove all banners and have been noting seat numbers of those people with them.



Probably a reaction by the club to the "Cockney Rapist" banner.  Can't say I'm that surprised.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: PJ87 on Tuesday 1 December 2009, 05:00:21 PM
Benwell Lad. You might be dead against litter, but its still quite a petty thing to moan about. From your post I would assume your are already against NUST and you're just looking for any little thing to pick holes. You're hardly likely to convince people by moaning about a leaflet hand out. If anything you're only highlighting how petty some of the arguements against are.

If NUST ever manage to buy Newcastle United I think they might be in for an unpleasant surprise about how many "petty" red tape, rules and regulations they have to comply with.

Just to clear something up here, we didnt hand out any leaflets on Saturday, we delivered them to bars around the city and left on tables within the bars.

There were two lads outside the Gallowgate End cash machine handing them out to people.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Friday 4 December 2009, 10:01:59 PM
Another week with no update?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Friday 4 December 2009, 10:05:31 PM
Another week with no update?

I think they issued a pretty strong condemnation of Llambias' programme notes in the last day or so. Might have been the Journal i read it, but I was surprised how hostile it seemed, given they will be hoping to negotiate a price with Ashley at some point if the money required is raised.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Friday 4 December 2009, 10:08:15 PM
Found it:

http://www.journallive.co.uk/nufc/newcastle-united-news/2009/12/04/llambias-not-learning-from-mistakes-say-nust-61634-25318693/

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: maybe_next_year on Friday 4 December 2009, 10:09:40 PM
really getting quite dissolusioned with the yes we can campaign. at the start i wasnt convinced, then they had just about managed to convince me, was planning on investing in the idea. untill swansea and the bloke with the beard handing our leaflets and a couple of weeks of little  action despite this only being a 6 week campaign
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Wallace on Saturday 5 December 2009, 12:00:01 AM
really getting quite dissolusioned with the yes we can campaign. at the start i wasnt convinced, then they had just about managed to convince me, was planning on investing in the idea. untill swansea and the bloke with the beard handing our leaflets and a couple of weeks of little  action despite this only being a 6 week campaign

These 6 weeks are just to raise awareness and take on board feedback.  If they are to succeed, it will take a while for it to all come together.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Saturday 5 December 2009, 09:18:25 AM
So how long are we talking then? Its highly unlikely this will be ready by May(when any sensible bid should be ready to go before 1 June) and anything after that will mean next season is another relegation after a summer of nothing. That is of course unless somebody else jumps in first............
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Heron on Saturday 5 December 2009, 09:58:34 AM
I don't know how it would logically work but I am glad someone is showing some resilience against this fat c***.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Saturday 5 December 2009, 09:00:57 PM
really getting quite dissolusioned with the yes we can campaign. at the start i wasnt convinced, then they had just about managed to convince me, was planning on investing in the idea. untill swansea and the bloke with the beard handing our leaflets and a couple of weeks of little  action despite this only being a 6 week campaign

These 6 weeks are just to raise awareness and take on board feedback.  If they are to succeed, it will take a while for it to all come together.



That's not true though.  After 6 weeks they wanted an idea of how much they'd have to start putting together an offer as I understand it.

http://www.toontastic.net/board/index.php?s=&showtopic=26197&view=findpost&p=691884
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: polpolpol on Monday 7 December 2009, 03:22:44 PM
really getting quite dissolusioned with the yes we can campaign. at the start i wasnt convinced, then they had just about managed to convince me, was planning on investing in the idea. untill swansea and the bloke with the beard handing our leaflets and a couple of weeks of little  action despite this only being a 6 week campaign

These 6 weeks are just to raise awareness and take on board feedback.  If they are to succeed, it will take a while for it to all come together.



That's not true though.  After 6 weeks they wanted an idea of how much they'd have to start putting together an offer as I understand it.

http://www.toontastic.net/board/index.php?s=&showtopic=26197&view=findpost&p=691884

If it is obvious to the supporter's trust that it has no chance of buying the club at this point, they might as well give it up. 

As some organisation of 'general opposition', all they do is provide the necessary object to keep Mike Ashley's hard-on up.

NB – I'm not saying 's*** or get off the pot', I'm saying 's***, or get out of the voyeur's watercloset'.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Friday 11 December 2009, 04:41:10 PM
Another week with no update?

 :tumbleweed:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: michaelfoster on Friday 11 December 2009, 10:09:29 PM
Another week with no update?

 :tumbleweed:

Out of the Llambias book of PR.









by saying nothing
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Saturday 12 December 2009, 09:34:20 AM
Another week with no update?

 :tumbleweed:

Day 33

(http://www.virtual-meditation.com/files/1923950/uploaded/Candle.jpg)

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Saturday 12 December 2009, 10:03:42 AM
From what I can tell from their initial statement, they didn't have any concrete offers of financial support from any of the institutions that they approached. They were hoping that once they'd shown that they had raised or were able to raise x amount of money from supporters, that these other potential backers would then come on board.

The thing is, it would take far more than expressions of interest from a few thousand fans to encourage these institutions to commit significant funds. I suspect that that is what they're finding and that's why everything is stuck.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mick on Saturday 12 December 2009, 10:06:32 AM
I heard something on Real Radio a week or two ago they they had raised £20 million or something like that.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Saturday 12 December 2009, 11:08:57 AM
From what I can tell from their initial statement, they didn't have any concrete offers of financial support from any of the institutions that they approached. They were hoping that once they'd shown that they had raised or were able to raise x amount of money from supporters, that these other potential backers would then come on board.

The thing is, it would take far more than expressions of interest from a few thousand fans to encourage these institutions to commit significant funds. I suspect that that is what they're finding and that's why everything is stuck.

Problem is the bigger investers know that an expressions of interest is not a guarantee of getting the money. I mean i expressed an interest in going to Barnsley today but here i am watching a very masculine sounding Helen on Soccer Am ;D
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: icemanblue on Tuesday 15 December 2009, 08:45:03 PM
 ???
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Tuesday 15 December 2009, 09:29:57 PM

Liam, I've taken your question away, I can definitely see the logic in what you're saying, if you bought a single £1500 investment then thats got to be easier to sell on than a £15,000 one, personally I dont see any reason (other than potential admin costs) as to why you wouldnt be able to sell it off in blocks ie sell 3 "shares" to reduce your investment to £10,500 and three new investors come into play with 3 lots of £1500 from yours.

I'll get back to you on that.

Bump ???
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: johnnypd on Tuesday 15 December 2009, 09:42:44 PM
they emailed me to remind me to vote for joe on the X Factor....
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Tuesday 15 December 2009, 09:54:27 PM
they emailed me to remind me to vote for joe on the X Factor....

Thank God for that i was worried...... :shifty:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Saturday 19 December 2009, 12:21:24 AM

Liam, I've taken your question away, I can definitely see the logic in what you're saying, if you bought a single £1500 investment then thats got to be easier to sell on than a £15,000 one, personally I dont see any reason (other than potential admin costs) as to why you wouldnt be able to sell it off in blocks ie sell 3 "shares" to reduce your investment to £10,500 and three new investors come into play with 3 lots of £1500 from yours.

I'll get back to you on that.

Bump ???

Bump again.  6 week campaign runs to this Monday I think?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Atticus on Saturday 19 December 2009, 12:23:00 AM
Quote
The first stage of the "Yes We Can" campaign run by the Newcastle United Supporters Trust (NUST) with the aim of taking ownership of the club is now almost completed.

From its launch, the campaign has attracted widespread media attention and gained membership, while efforts have been focused on putting the building blocks in place that will be essential to any credible bid.

Next year will see further announcements regarding the progress of the bid and its associated business plans, together with the publication of a prospectus.

Along with continued support to the team both home and away, the level of interest in the "Yes We Can" campaign has also demonstrated to business and private investors that some credibility remains attached to this club - at least from the fanbase.

If you'd like to be kept informed of developments in 2010, click on the image below and sign up to support YWC.

That was the latest, from NUFC.com. Posted recently.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Saturday 19 December 2009, 12:32:50 AM
Quote
The first stage of the "Yes We Can" campaign run by the Newcastle United Supporters Trust (NUST) with the aim of taking ownership of the club is now almost completed.

From its launch, the campaign has attracted widespread media attention and gained membership, while efforts have been focused on putting the building blocks in place that will be essential to any credible bid.

Next year will see further announcements regarding the progress of the bid and its associated business plans, together with the publication of a prospectus.

Along with continued support to the team both home and away, the level of interest in the "Yes We Can" campaign has also demonstrated to business and private investors that some credibility remains attached to this club - at least from the fanbase.

If you'd like to be kept informed of developments in 2010, click on the image below and sign up to support YWC.

That was the latest, from NUFC.com. Posted recently.

Cheers :thup:

The reason given for the initial 6 week period was that it gave a concrete cut off point at which they'd be able to gauge their ability to make a bid, but ever since then it's gone awfully quiet.

We were promised 5 weeks ago that there would quickly be a load of information put in the public domain, for example this list of something like 20-30 IFAs who had already signed up to deal with queries people may have about investing, as well as details of the big players backing the bid, but unless I've missed them none of this information has been released either here or on the NUSC website.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Atticus on Saturday 19 December 2009, 03:57:40 PM
Quote
The huge Alan Shearer shirt that last made an outing draped over the Angel of the North was unveiled yesterday at Castle Keep in Newcastle - the traditional entrance to the city - to mark the end of the first phase of the NUST Yes We Can campaign.

The campaign started with a bang with 40,000 e-mails sent to toon fans letting them know about how the campaign would work towards bringing interested parties in a fans led consortium to buy the club.

After 6 weeks of hard campaigning with roadshows, regular e-mail newsletters, stories about ‘local achievers’, 30,000 postcards distributed in pubs and clubs across the city and numerous meetings between the Trust and interested parties.

Yes We Can has also launched a number of collaborative events with charities including a single by the Steady Boys available on download by i tunes and in the shops in over Christmas. Its called Yes We Can – the terrace song and half the proceeds of the song go to the Royal British Legion.

Mark Jensen, Spokesperson and link with external partners for the Trust said ‘Its been a hard but rewarding 6 week campaign and we’ve made a fantastic start to what could be a real fans led buy out of the club. We now have in place all of our commercial partners and are all ready planning phase 2 of the campaign commencing 6 Jan 2010. Fans have been frustrated by the lack of visible progress but a lot has happened, relationships have been cemented and there is real and tangible interest from the city in what we’re doing. We’ll get one chance at doing this and we’ve a duty to make sure its correct and remember it took the Magpie group over 2 years to acquire control of the club. I can make this promise, the proposal we’re now working on with partners won’t take that long’.

Latest from NUST, today.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Thespence on Saturday 19 December 2009, 04:02:13 PM
Quote
The huge Alan Shearer shirt that last made an outing draped over the Angel of the North was unveiled yesterday at Castle Keep in Newcastle - the traditional entrance to the city - to mark the end of the first phase of the NUST Yes We Can campaign.

The campaign started with a bang with 40,000 e-mails sent to toon fans letting them know about how the campaign would work towards bringing interested parties in a fans led consortium to buy the club.

After 6 weeks of hard campaigning with roadshows, regular e-mail newsletters, stories about ‘local achievers’, 30,000 postcards distributed in pubs and clubs across the city and numerous meetings between the Trust and interested parties.

Yes We Can has also launched a number of collaborative events with charities including a single by the Steady Boys available on download by i tunes and in the shops in over Christmas. Its called Yes We Can – the terrace song and half the proceeds of the song go to the Royal British Legion.

Mark Jensen, Spokesperson and link with external partners for the Trust said ‘Its been a hard but rewarding 6 week campaign and we’ve made a fantastic start to what could be a real fans led buy out of the club. We now have in place all of our commercial partners and are all ready planning phase 2 of the campaign commencing 6 Jan 2010. Fans have been frustrated by the lack of visible progress but a lot has happened, relationships have been cemented and there is real and tangible interest from the city in what we’re doing. We’ll get one chance at doing this and we’ve a duty to make sure its correct and remember it took the Magpie group over 2 years to acquire control of the club. I can make this promise, the proposal we’re now working on with partners won’t take that long’.

Latest from NUST, today.

Just LLLO really.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Atticus on Saturday 19 December 2009, 04:09:11 PM
He's got a point like, a lot was promised in the initial releases from the NUST, they have let things wane a great deal (at least from an online perspective).

I'm not living in Newcastle at the minute so can't say what the activity has been like around the town.

Suppose it wouldn't take much to get people's enthusiasm again, basically just some solid facts and figures about the progress that has been made and the backing NUST has in place. The more likely this all looks the more likely people are to throw their hats into the ring.

I'm certainly waiting with baited breath for some solid information, and there are a few others in my family who are prepared to invest as well.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mick on Saturday 19 December 2009, 05:38:41 PM
They said they would give names of backers; they haven't so I can only guess that they don't have anything startling to announce.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: OzzieMandias on Saturday 19 December 2009, 05:55:27 PM
Quote
The huge Alan Shearer shirt that last made an outing draped over the Angel of the North was unveiled yesterday at Castle Keep in Newcastle - the traditional entrance to the city - to mark the end of the first phase of the NUST Yes We Can campaign.

The campaign started with a bang with 40,000 e-mails sent to toon fans letting them know about how the campaign would work towards bringing interested parties in a fans led consortium to buy the club.

After 6 weeks of hard campaigning with roadshows, regular e-mail newsletters, stories about ‘local achievers’, 30,000 postcards distributed in pubs and clubs across the city and numerous meetings between the Trust and interested parties.

Yes We Can has also launched a number of collaborative events with charities including a single by the Steady Boys available on download by i tunes and in the shops in over Christmas. Its called Yes We Can – the terrace song and half the proceeds of the song go to the Royal British Legion.

Mark Jensen, Spokesperson and link with external partners for the Trust said ‘Its been a hard but rewarding 6 week campaign and we’ve made a fantastic start to what could be a real fans led buy out of the club. We now have in place all of our commercial partners and are all ready planning phase 2 of the campaign commencing 6 Jan 2010. Fans have been frustrated by the lack of visible progress but a lot has happened, relationships have been cemented and there is real and tangible interest from the city in what we’re doing. We’ll get one chance at doing this and we’ve a duty to make sure its correct and remember it took the Magpie group over 2 years to acquire control of the club. I can make this promise, the proposal we’re now working on with partners won’t take that long’.

Latest from NUST, today.

Started with a bang but ended with a whimper.

Where/who ARE the backers/partners? That really is the most important thing and without any information about that – leaving the suspicion that there aren't actually any backers/partners in place even though we were told they already had these relationships worked out at the start of their "six-week campaign" – the "bid" simply does not look credible. And where is the list of independent financial advisors that was supposedly to be announced in this same time period?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: alpal78 on Saturday 19 December 2009, 06:23:33 PM
Like many I was interested to see how this would pan out and even willing to throw in my support if it was workable but I always believed that this was a delusional effort by fans thinking that buying and running a football club is as easy as installing and playing Championship Manager  :sadnod:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 06:06:58 AM
Quote
The initial phase of the proposed fans / business / city buyout of the club has now come to an end. The past 6 weeks has been all about getting the idea out there and giving fans the chance to register their interest in the idea of buying a stake in the club. NUST have continued the work with our professional partners behind the scenes to build a framework which will hopefully enable everybody to have the chance to buy a small part of Newcastle United.

Like many of you, we are all impatient to see things moving on. We understand that fans have been frustrated by the lack of visible progress, but a lot has happened,  relationships have been cemented ande there is real and tangible interest from the city in what we are doing. However, the full plan will only be unveiled when all the boxes are ticked because we know that everything has to be right as we’ll only get one chance at this. And remember it took the Magpie Group over 2 years to acquire control of the club - we can make one promise and that is that the proposal we are working on with partners won't take that long! In the January the campaign will pick up again and details will be put out into the public domain when it’s possible. The interest and support shown so far by the fans has been overwhelming but we would urge anybody who hasn’t already to visit www.nust.org.uk (http://"http://www.nust.org.uk") and register <http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister (http://"http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister")>  with the ‘Yes We Can’ campaign.

This doesn’t commit you to anything but will ensure you will receive updates as and when we have them, plus it means you will receive the prospectus as soon as it’s ready. Just as importantly the institutions and business people who are backing this scheme need to be shown that the Newcastle public have the appetite to play their part in buying the club. This will only work if fans have the desire to help shape the future of our great club so please register here if you haven’t already.

 <http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister (http://"http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister")>

The Trust handed out 10,000 postcards to fans at the Swansea game and a further 10,000 at the Watford game and the end of phase one was marked by the hanging of the giant Shearer shirt - which once adorned the Angel of the North - being hung from the Castle Keep along with the Yes We Can Flag. Read article here http://www.nust.org.uk/iconic-shirt-draws-curtain-on-1-stage-of-yes-we-can-campaign (http://www.nust.org.uk/iconic-shirt-draws-curtain-on-1-stage-of-yes-we-can-campaign)

Finally I’d like to invite you to join us for the Trust’s very first Christmas party on Thursday 7th January, some light relief after the stresses of the festive period. On the night we will have entertainment provided by two stars of the comedy circuit that also happen to be big Newcastle fans - Gavin Webster and Simon Donald. Earlier this year they went down a storm at a Trust comedy night and tickets are sure to sell fast, so get in quick. The party will be at the Tyneside Irish centre on Gallowgate with doors opening at 7pm and the entertainment kicking off at 8pm. Tickets are only £6 each and can be ordered from our online store here <http://nust.bigcartel.com/>
 or from behind the bar in the Strawberry.

I think its safe to say we've all been frustrated by what appears to be a lack of actual progress (none more so than me). Numerous times I've made promises on here, TT and a dozen other message boards stating that further info would be out soon. Trouble is, its fairly easy to come up with these plans but when the actual in-depth work starts then you start getting into the territory of solicitors, financial rules and such like. This has turned out to be an eye opener for us, being told you cant "release this info" or cant "do anything with that until object A of document X has been agreed" has gone against the ethos of the whole campaign and the Trust itself. That has been hard for us to work with but its what you would call a necessary evil, these are the people with the important experience and knowledge in these areas and what they say goes.

If only we'd known all this at the start then we would have been able to play out the six weeks differently and would have given everyone that view from the start. It is important though that everything is done properly, we will only get one chance at this, do it right and everything will come together, get it wrong and its all over, we cant ever attempt a fans buyout again because people will quite rightly look back at this one and say "it failed last time so its not worth trying".

So from me personally, thats an apology however it goes with what we were doing, we've not asked anyone to actually hand over any money yet, simply register to say you'd be interested to know more. This is what is used by the big backers and financial industries to decide how popular this is going to be and its chances of working. Already we have what we believe to be a high enough level of support but its important that we get as high a number as possible.

As soon as the full info is out (which will be in the next couple of weeks...honest  :-[) then I will get it out on here.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 09:10:33 AM

I think its safe to say we've all been frustrated by what appears to be a lack of actual progress (none more so than me). Numerous times I've made promises on here, TT and a dozen other message boards stating that further info would be out soon. Trouble is, its fairly easy to come up with these plans but when the actual in-depth work starts then you start getting into the territory of solicitors, financial rules and such like. This has turned out to be an eye opener for us, being told you cant "release this info" or cant "do anything with that until object A of document X has been agreed" has gone against the ethos of the whole campaign and the Trust itself. That has been hard for us to work with but its what you would call a necessary evil, these are the people with the important experience and knowledge in these areas and what they say goes.

If only we'd known all this at the start then we would have been able to play out the six weeks differently and would have given everyone that view from the start. It is important though that everything is done properly, we will only get one chance at this, do it right and everything will come together, get it wrong and its all over, we cant ever attempt a fans buyout again because people will quite rightly look back at this one and say "it failed last time so its not worth trying".

So from me personally, thats an apology however it goes with what we were doing, we've not asked anyone to actually hand over any money yet, simply register to say you'd be interested to know more. This is what is used by the big backers and financial industries to decide how popular this is going to be and its chances of working. Already we have what we believe to be a high enough level of support but its important that we get as high a number as possible.

As soon as the full info is out (which will be in the next couple of weeks...honest  :-[) then I will get it out on here.

Running a football club as a business is a lot less starightforward than the average layman thinks. It's one thing to buy pies from Greggs or drinks at the Irish Bar as an organised protest but the real difficulty will be convincing big financial players to come up with this expected backing as opposed to pledges of support in theory.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 09:26:07 AM
Newcastle is a city where rumours about our club circulate on an almost daily basis and there is always a "mole" or an "insider" passing information to the public domain about any impending business.
Strange that there has been nowt circulating about any of the "major institutions" backing this bid.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: peasepud on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 09:51:18 AM
Running a football club as a business is a lot less starightforward than the average layman thinks. It's one thing to buy pies from Greggs or drinks at the Irish Bar as an organised protest but the real difficulty will be convincing big financial players to come up with this expected backing as opposed to pledges of support in theory.

Nobody within the Trust thinks that running the club would be easy, its got to be one of the hardest businesses to get right. What I was getting at in the above is the amount of financial rules and stipulations which mean you cant even release information on these things until a thousand i's have been dotted and t's crossed. The model is still essentially the same model, its been refined and enhanced following feedback and ideas from other sources where we thought we'd be able to pull together some support and then release details of this aspect or mention of that backer turned out to be more difficult. Solicitors were onto it like a ton of bricks stating that nothing could be done until other things were in place.

As for the comment on "moles and insiders", how many of those have turned out to be true? how often have we been fed some info that has actually been legitimate? Simple fact of life in this instance is that only those who need to know, do so and none of those involved have any interest in leaking the info. Theres no Redheughs here, it does nobody involved any good in leaking stuff.

The fact that its running "beneath the radar" and not being played out in daily snippets of random bollocks from some "insider" should provide some comfort to those interested in this and go towards refuting the claims of those who say we're just a bunch of publicity hunters. If that was the case then we'd be putting out insiders with wild claims of "Microsoft and the Queen" backing it.

None of that is happening because people have their heads down getting on with the low level detail and final preparations.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Thespence on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 10:06:28 AM
Newcastle is a city where rumours about our club circulate on an almost daily basis and there is always a "mole" or an "insider" passing information to the public domain about any impending business.
Strange that there has been nowt circulating about any of the "major institutions" backing this bid.

I have herd the "major institutions" in your area are not backing the bid as of yet but hey Ali from the Bengal Express can do what he wants with his money. There is no comment from Benwell Chippy & the owner of a well known Benwell taxi firm did night shift last night so was unavailable for comment.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 11:46:35 AM
Running a football club as a business is a lot less starightforward than the average layman thinks. It's one thing to buy pies from Greggs or drinks at the Irish Bar as an organised protest but the real difficulty will be convincing big financial players to come up with this expected backing as opposed to pledges of support in theory.

Nobody within the Trust thinks that running the club would be easy, its got to be one of the hardest businesses to get right. What I was getting at in the above is the amount of financial rules and stipulations which mean you cant even release information on these things until a thousand i's have been dotted and t's crossed. The model is still essentially the same model, its been refined and enhanced following feedback and ideas from other sources where we thought we'd be able to pull together some support and then release details of this aspect or mention of that backer turned out to be more difficult. Solicitors were onto it like a ton of bricks stating that nothing could be done until other things were in place.

As for the comment on "moles and insiders", how many of those have turned out to be true? how often have we been fed some info that has actually been legitimate? Simple fact of life in this instance is that only those who need to know, do so and none of those involved have any interest in leaking the info. Theres no Redheughs here, it does nobody involved any good in leaking stuff.

The fact that its running "beneath the radar" and not being played out in daily snippets of random bollocks from some "insider" should provide some comfort to those interested in this and go towards refuting the claims of those who say we're just a bunch of publicity hunters. If that was the case then we'd be putting out insiders with wild claims of "Microsoft and the Queen" backing it.

None of that is happening because people have their heads down getting on with the low level detail and final preparations.

Point taken about moles and insiders.
Most of it is normally way off the mark, I don't think anyone wants to hear rumours just for the sake of it but what I said was that in a small city like Newcastle where football is the No.1 topic of conversation it's unusual for nothing to be going around.
Credit to you for keeping the information concerning major backers under wraps until things are formalised.

Ironically when Ashley came to Newcastle the club started being a lot more secretive about transfer dealings etc. rather than playing it out on Sky television like the previous regime had. That policy extended into whatever sale negotiations took place and they were generally criticised for not being open enough with the media and fans.

One thing I'm sure your organisation will be learning is that it's a lot easier to sling mud from the outside than it is to conduct serious and meaningful business transactions.
Time will tell if you're up to the transition and I, like many others, eagerly await developments.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Shayno on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 01:53:23 PM
I think they have missed the boat unfortunately
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 08:37:56 PM
Quote
The initial phase of the proposed fans / business / city buyout of the club has now come to an end. The past 6 weeks has been all about getting the idea out there and giving fans the chance to register their interest in the idea of buying a stake in the club. NUST have continued the work with our professional partners behind the scenes to build a framework which will hopefully enable everybody to have the chance to buy a small part of Newcastle United.

Like many of you, we are all impatient to see things moving on. We understand that fans have been frustrated by the lack of visible progress, but a lot has happened,  relationships have been cemented ande there is real and tangible interest from the city in what we are doing. However, the full plan will only be unveiled when all the boxes are ticked because we know that everything has to be right as we’ll only get one chance at this. And remember it took the Magpie Group over 2 years to acquire control of the club - we can make one promise and that is that the proposal we are working on with partners won't take that long! In the January the campaign will pick up again and details will be put out into the public domain when it’s possible. The interest and support shown so far by the fans has been overwhelming but we would urge anybody who hasn’t already to visit www.nust.org.uk (http://"http://www.nust.org.uk") and register <http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister (http://"http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister")>  with the ‘Yes We Can’ campaign.

This doesn’t commit you to anything but will ensure you will receive updates as and when we have them, plus it means you will receive the prospectus as soon as it’s ready. Just as importantly the institutions and business people who are backing this scheme need to be shown that the Newcastle public have the appetite to play their part in buying the club. This will only work if fans have the desire to help shape the future of our great club so please register here if you haven’t already.

 <http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister (http://"http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister")>

The Trust handed out 10,000 postcards to fans at the Swansea game and a further 10,000 at the Watford game and the end of phase one was marked by the hanging of the giant Shearer shirt - which once adorned the Angel of the North - being hung from the Castle Keep along with the Yes We Can Flag. Read article here http://www.nust.org.uk/iconic-shirt-draws-curtain-on-1-stage-of-yes-we-can-campaign (http://www.nust.org.uk/iconic-shirt-draws-curtain-on-1-stage-of-yes-we-can-campaign)

Finally I’d like to invite you to join us for the Trust’s very first Christmas party on Thursday 7th January, some light relief after the stresses of the festive period. On the night we will have entertainment provided by two stars of the comedy circuit that also happen to be big Newcastle fans - Gavin Webster and Simon Donald. Earlier this year they went down a storm at a Trust comedy night and tickets are sure to sell fast, so get in quick. The party will be at the Tyneside Irish centre on Gallowgate with doors opening at 7pm and the entertainment kicking off at 8pm. Tickets are only £6 each and can be ordered from our online store here <http://nust.bigcartel.com/>
 or from behind the bar in the Strawberry.

I think its safe to say we've all been frustrated by what appears to be a lack of actual progress (none more so than me). Numerous times I've made promises on here, TT and a dozen other message boards stating that further info would be out soon. Trouble is, its fairly easy to come up with these plans but when the actual in-depth work starts then you start getting into the territory of solicitors, financial rules and such like. This has turned out to be an eye opener for us, being told you cant "release this info" or cant "do anything with that until object A of document X has been agreed" has gone against the ethos of the whole campaign and the Trust itself. That has been hard for us to work with but its what you would call a necessary evil, these are the people with the important experience and knowledge in these areas and what they say goes.

If only we'd known all this at the start then we would have been able to play out the six weeks differently and would have given everyone that view from the start. It is important though that everything is done properly, we will only get one chance at this, do it right and everything will come together, get it wrong and its all over, we cant ever attempt a fans buyout again because people will quite rightly look back at this one and say "it failed last time so its not worth trying".

So from me personally, thats an apology however it goes with what we were doing, we've not asked anyone to actually hand over any money yet, simply register to say you'd be interested to know more. This is what is used by the big backers and financial industries to decide how popular this is going to be and its chances of working. Already we have what we believe to be a high enough level of support but its important that we get as high a number as possible.

As soon as the full info is out (which will be in the next couple of weeks...honest  :-[) then I will get it out on here.

Cheers for the update. :thup:

Look forward to reading the information in the new year.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dr.Spaceman on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 09:17:13 PM
Damn, what a shame...
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Frazzle on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 10:00:35 PM
 ???
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: OzzieMandias on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 10:30:23 PM
Bit of an "Oh No We Can't" Campaign, then.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Frazzle on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 11:15:08 PM
Not really...

No-one is saying that are they?  Apart from armchair critics.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: OzzieMandias on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 11:26:00 PM
I don't even own an armchair.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mick on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 11:51:35 PM
I don't even own an armchair.

Then he obviously wasn't referring to you.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: OzzieMandias on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 11:53:21 PM
I'm more of a sofa sceptic, tbh.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Jordan on Wednesday 23 December 2009, 11:59:37 PM
Bit of an "Oh No We Can't" Campaign, then.
:lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Wednesday 6 January 2010, 11:33:24 AM
Update:

Dear Supporter

Happy New Year from NUST!

2010 starts with phase 2 of the ‘Yes We Can’ (YWC) campaign,
setting out our plan that will lead to negotiations with our club on a
‘fan led movement’ that will bring about new ownership with as
little pain as possible for both sides. YWC will continue to support
the team but also pose the difficult questions for the current owners
in a constructive way and most importantly, to continue the momentum
to build a formal business plan, leading to a prospectus which will
detail options of investment for fans, businesses, individuals and
investment companies alike.

Our investment team is now in place but we need the continued support
of you, the fans, to show the businesses and investment companies that
Newcastle United FC is a sound investment that is rooted in the city
and its communities.

Simply signing up on here <http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister>
 to Yes We Can will demonstrate to other potential investors that the
fans should lead ‘change’ at SJP. It doesn’t cost you anything
but it does show that you believe that we can be part of a more
positive future where fans are partners in a ‘new’ Newcastle
United.

On the field we may be top of the league but our hopes and
expectations have been lowered to such a level that simply not selling
our players will be trumpteted by Mr Llambias as a victory. While the
Trust and its partners recognise the harsh realities of the ever
changing world of football we have higher aspirations than that.

January 2010 promises to be an exciting month, there is a lot of
activity and potentially positive announcements. As supporters of the
Trust you will be pleasantly surprised just how far the Trust has come
in the short months since its formation. It is the fastest growing
Trust in the country with the most ambitious agenda.

On that note, you will be receiving an e-mail on 15 Jan announcing our
partners and how the YWC campaign will continue over the coming weeks,
so if you haven't already then please sign up to find out more here
<http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister>
.

Regards

Neil Mitchell

Interim Chair

NUST
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Wednesday 6 January 2010, 12:03:57 PM
15th should be interesting then.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Wednesday 6 January 2010, 12:09:05 PM
If some of the local companies names mentioned are the likes of Northern Rock and Sage then I might start taking this seriously.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: bealios on Wednesday 6 January 2010, 01:03:42 PM
I can't imagine the state funded Northern Rock investing in NUFC
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Skirge on Friday 8 January 2010, 05:29:21 PM
Quote
Newcastle United fans show desire to have their say in club's future

THE Newcastle United Supporters Trust have received a startling response to their attempts to buy a substantive stake in the Coca Cola Championship club, with fans to date pledging well in excess of £50m in support of the bid.

The Times understands that more 6000 fans have responded to the ‘Yes We Can’ campaign with offers of financial backing, with around 4000 prepared to fund a minimum of £1500 and another 2000 signalling their willingness to invest £25,000 from their pension funds.

While no money has yet been collected and the NUST’s financial advisors have cautioned that up to half of the pledges may not be followed through, the figures still represent a strong desire on behalf of fans to have a say in the future running of Newcastle, which is presently owned by Mike Ashley, the sportswear retailer.

The NUST also claim to have significant backing from wealthy individuals and North East-based businesses, details of which they will announce in the coming weeks
With Chris Hughton’s players responding to the off-field difficulties of last summer by opening up a six-point lead at the top of the division, supporters have responded in an equally positive manner. Ashley’s three-year tenure at St James’ Park has brought five managers, relegation, numerous controversies and two failed attempts to sell-up.

“The take-up has been astounding and demonstrates fans have the appetite to back the ‘Yes We Can’ campaign,” a source close to the NUST said last night. “It also shows that fans are still sceptical about the intentions of the present owners and see an alternative as preferable to the uncertainty that surrounds investment plans for the future.”

Newcastle City Council are to consider a cross-party motion offering their support to the NUST. “This is not intended as a pop at the current owners,” John Shipley, the council leader, said. “It’s saying we feel frustration at the events of the last decade and all the shenanigans of managers and owners, which we feel has had an effect on the reputation of the club and a rub-off on the reputation of the city.”
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/football_league/article6981307.ece
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Friday 8 January 2010, 11:35:10 PM
Apart from the fact that these responses from fans are statements of interest, not pledges, I'm puzzled by this issue of the pension funds.

As far as I know, you have to be 50 (and 55 from April) to have cash released from a pension fund, and even then you can only get at 25% of the total. I can't see many people going for that.

Are NUST talking about something else? Anyone know?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Mowen on Saturday 9 January 2010, 02:30:34 AM
Apart from the fact that these responses from fans are statements of interest, not pledges, I'm puzzled by this issue of the pension funds.

As far as I know, you have to be 50 (and 55 from April) to have cash released from a pension fund, and even then you can only get at 25% of the total. I can't see many people going for that.

Are NUST talking about something else? Anyone know?

SIPP (Self invested pension plans) wasn't it? I'm no pension expert but that sounds like something you can do what you want with.

I was very keen on this idea when it came out but feel somewhat distant from it now, it needs something to re-invigorate (fake word?) people now.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: jdckelly on Saturday 9 January 2010, 02:35:08 AM
Apart from the fact that these responses from fans are statements of interest, not pledges, I'm puzzled by this issue of the pension funds.

As far as I know, you have to be 50 (and 55 from April) to have cash released from a pension fund, and even then you can only get at 25% of the total. I can't see many people going for that.

Are NUST talking about something else? Anyone know?

SIPP (Self invested pension plans) wasn't it? I'm no pension expert but that sounds like something you can do what you want with.

I was very keen on this idea when it came out but feel somewhat distant from it now, it needs something to re-invigorate (fake word?) people now.
real word btw.
i cant see any sense myself in investing your pension in any football club let alone newcastle united football club, there simply isnt going to be any return on it. it would be a serious case of heart ruling head when with pensions it should always be head over heart
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Saturday 9 January 2010, 11:34:41 AM
Apart from the fact that these responses from fans are statements of interest, not pledges, I'm puzzled by this issue of the pension funds.

As far as I know, you have to be 50 (and 55 from April) to have cash released from a pension fund, and even then you can only get at 25% of the total. I can't see many people going for that.

Are NUST talking about something else? Anyone know?

SIPP (Self invested pension plans) wasn't it? I'm no pension expert but that sounds like something you can do what you want with.

I was very keen on this idea when it came out but feel somewhat distant from it now, it needs something to re-invigorate (fake word?) people now.
real word btw.
i cant see any sense myself in investing your pension in any football club let alone newcastle united football club, there simply isnt going to be any return on it. it would be a serious case of heart ruling head when with pensions it should always be head over heart

As I understand it, a SIPP means that you can decide where your pension funds are invested, but the issue of releasing the funds still remains. A pension fund isn't like a savings account that you can get at any time you want. Because your pension payments enjoy tax relief, there are regulations about how soon you can get at them, and even then if you cash in before retirement age you lose out financially.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: michaelfoster on Saturday 9 January 2010, 12:20:47 PM
Id completely forgot they were doing this tbf, can see alot of people thinking i cant be bothered with this anymore due to a lack of information from NUST.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Saturday 9 January 2010, 12:32:29 PM
http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Newcastle-fans-pledge-50million-to-buy-out-Mike-Ashley-and-take-control-of-the-club-Exclusive-article281871.html
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Saturday 9 January 2010, 12:39:50 PM
Only another £30-£50m to go then.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Saturday 9 January 2010, 01:16:49 PM
Only another £230-£250m to go then.

FYP
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Saturday 9 January 2010, 10:53:13 PM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Saturday 9 January 2010, 10:55:27 PM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.

That's why it says 'pledged'
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Saturday 9 January 2010, 10:57:42 PM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.

That's why it says 'pledged'

But the money hasn't been pledged. NUST were only asking for expressions of interest, and were encouraging people to come forward by stressing that there was no obligation attached to registering.

If the money really had been pledged, then it would be fair enough to say it had been raised, because a pledge in its true sense is a guarantee.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Saturday 9 January 2010, 10:59:50 PM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.

That's why it says 'pledged'

But the money hasn't been pledged. NUST were only asking for expressions of interest, and were encouraging people to come forward by stressing that there was no obligation attached to registering.

If the money really had been pledged, then it would be fair enough to say it had been raised, because a pledge in its true sense is a guarantee.

Am assuming you mean my figures? I am as sceptical as you in that regard, i just put the absolute minimun for it
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: cubaricho on Saturday 9 January 2010, 11:00:02 PM
There's a fine line between having too much contact and not enough and NUST still haven't gotten it right.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Saturday 9 January 2010, 11:09:33 PM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.

That's why it says 'pledged'

But the money hasn't been pledged. NUST were only asking for expressions of interest, and were encouraging people to come forward by stressing that there was no obligation attached to registering.

If the money really had been pledged, then it would be fair enough to say it had been raised, because a pledge in its true sense is a guarantee.

Am assuming you mean my figures? I am as sceptical as you in that regard, i just put the absolute minimun for it

My point wasn't about the ultimate target figure - your guess is as good as mine on that. I interpreted your and Chris's statements as meaning that there was still a long way to go, even though £50 million could be knocked off it. I was just pointing out that NUST hadn't raised any money at all yet, let alone £50 million.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Saturday 9 January 2010, 11:11:25 PM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.

That's why it says 'pledged'

But the money hasn't been pledged. NUST were only asking for expressions of interest, and were encouraging people to come forward by stressing that there was no obligation attached to registering.

If the money really had been pledged, then it would be fair enough to say it had been raised, because a pledge in its true sense is a guarantee.

Am assuming you mean my figures? I am as sceptical as you in that regard, i just put the absolute minimun for it

My point wasn't about the ultimate target figure - your guess is as good as mine on that. I interpreted your and Chris's statements as meaning that there was still a long way to go, even though £50 million could be knocked off it. I was just pointing out that NUST hadn't raised any money at all yet, let alone £50 million.



Am with you there, my point was that it would have to be £300m before Ashley played ball
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Saturday 9 January 2010, 11:20:47 PM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.

That's why it says 'pledged'

But the money hasn't been pledged. NUST were only asking for expressions of interest, and were encouraging people to come forward by stressing that there was no obligation attached to registering.

If the money really had been pledged, then it would be fair enough to say it had been raised, because a pledge in its true sense is a guarantee.

Am assuming you mean my figures? I am as sceptical as you in that regard, i just put the absolute minimun for it

My point wasn't about the ultimate target figure - your guess is as good as mine on that. I interpreted your and Chris's statements as meaning that there was still a long way to go, even though £50 million could be knocked off it. I was just pointing out that NUST hadn't raised any money at all yet, let alone £50 million.



Am with you there, my point was that it would have to be £300m before Ashley played ball

Ashley is only intersted in making money, why would he hold out for £300m if the club isn't worth it?

 
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Saturday 9 January 2010, 11:39:37 PM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.

That's why it says 'pledged'


But the money hasn't been pledged. NUST were only asking for expressions of interest, and were encouraging people to come forward by stressing that there was no obligation attached to registering.

If the money really had been pledged, then it would be fair enough to say it had been raised, because a pledge in its true sense is a guarantee.

Am assuming you mean my figures? I am as sceptical as you in that regard, i just put the absolute minimun for it

My point wasn't about the ultimate target figure - your guess is as good as mine on that. I interpreted your and Chris's statements as meaning that there was still a long way to go, even though £50 million could be knocked off it. I was just pointing out that NUST hadn't raised any money at all yet, let alone £50 million.



Am with you there, my point was that it would have to be £300m before Ashley played ball

Ashley is only intersted in making money, why would he hold out for £300m if the club isn't worth it?

 


You really think he will throw away the £200m he paid over the £139m? As always Ashley will want his full return
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Sunday 10 January 2010, 12:37:48 AM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.

That's why it says 'pledged'


But the money hasn't been pledged. NUST were only asking for expressions of interest, and were encouraging people to come forward by stressing that there was no obligation attached to registering.

If the money really had been pledged, then it would be fair enough to say it had been raised, because a pledge in its true sense is a guarantee.

Am assuming you mean my figures? I am as sceptical as you in that regard, i just put the absolute minimun for it

My point wasn't about the ultimate target figure - your guess is as good as mine on that. I interpreted your and Chris's statements as meaning that there was still a long way to go, even though £50 million could be knocked off it. I was just pointing out that NUST hadn't raised any money at all yet, let alone £50 million.



Am with you there, my point was that it would have to be £300m before Ashley played ball

Ashley is only intersted in making money, why would he hold out for £300m if the club isn't worth it?

 


You really think he will throw away the £200m he paid over the £139m? As always Ashley will want his full return


I'm sure he'd like £500m if he could get it. as a business man though he'll probably take the best he can get, which isn't £339m. Unless you know better.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Roger Kint on Sunday 10 January 2010, 12:40:42 AM
Both those figures are a bit misguided, because NUST haven't actually raised any money at all yet.

That's why it says 'pledged'


But the money hasn't been pledged. NUST were only asking for expressions of interest, and were encouraging people to come forward by stressing that there was no obligation attached to registering.

If the money really had been pledged, then it would be fair enough to say it had been raised, because a pledge in its true sense is a guarantee.

Am assuming you mean my figures? I am as sceptical as you in that regard, i just put the absolute minimun for it

My point wasn't about the ultimate target figure - your guess is as good as mine on that. I interpreted your and Chris's statements as meaning that there was still a long way to go, even though £50 million could be knocked off it. I was just pointing out that NUST hadn't raised any money at all yet, let alone £50 million.



Am with you there, my point was that it would have to be £300m before Ashley played ball

Ashley is only intersted in making money, why would he hold out for £300m if the club isn't worth it?

 


You really think he will throw away the £200m he paid over the £139m? As always Ashley will want his full return


I'm sure he'd like £500m if he could get it. as a business man though he'll probably take the best he can get, which isn't £339m. Unless you know better.



He put £300m in, he will try to take that much out one way or another
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Teasy on Sunday 10 January 2010, 02:16:17 AM
£268m, not £300m.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dr.Spaceman on Sunday 10 January 2010, 02:46:09 AM
Like it matters.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Heneage on Sunday 10 January 2010, 02:57:11 AM
Like it matters.
I'd quibble over 32m, but your point is fair.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Sunday 10 January 2010, 09:45:48 AM
The Times "understands" that 6,000 people have declared intent to support "and the NUST’s financial advisors have cautioned that up to half of the pledges may not be followed through". So this current guess puts the number of potential backers at around 3,000.
“The take-up has been astounding and demonstrates fans have the appetite to back the ‘Yes We Can’ campaign,” a source close to the NUST said last night.

Based on the above figures I would beg to differ. 3,000 is a tiny number considering the club has a fan base of more than 100,000. It means less than 3% of fans prepared to back the scheme meaning it would almost certainly be doomed to failure.
All the above is of course conjecture and hearsay, but possibly not too far wide of the mark and with no real information coming from the NUST theres little else to go on.

We still look forward to hearing the names of the significant local businesses and institutions are who are backing the scheme - now scheduled to be released mid January - let's hope they can save the scheme, but a guesstimate of 3,000 supporters backing it hardly realises the dream of true fan ownership.

I wonder if this could end up like the 1980's buy a player scheme which was a bold campaign started by fans' representatives with the aim of raising £100,000 to buy a player for the cash strapped club as the directors themselves were unwilling to invest.
It started enthusiastically but was sadly wound up some time later with the organisers admitting that they hadn't raised anywhere near enough to buy a player but might have enough for a new set of strips.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Sunday 10 January 2010, 10:31:57 AM
The Times "understands" that 6,000 people have declared intent to support "and the NUST’s financial advisors have cautioned that up to half of the pledges may not be followed through". So this current guess puts the number of potential backers at around 3,000.
“The take-up has been astounding and demonstrates fans have the appetite to back the ‘Yes We Can’ campaign,” a source close to the NUST said last night.

Based on the above figures I would beg to differ. 3,000 is a tiny number considering the club has a fan base of more than 100,000. It means less than 3% of fans prepared to back the scheme meaning it would almost certainly be doomed to failure.
All the above is of course conjecture and hearsay, but possibly not too far wide of the mark and with no real information coming from the NUST theres little else to go on.

We still look forward to hearing the names of the significant local businesses and institutions are who are backing the scheme - now scheduled to be released mid January - let's hope they can save the scheme, but a guesstimate of 3,000 supporters backing it hardly realises the dream of true fan ownership.

I wonder if this could end up like the 1980's buy a player scheme which was a bold campaign started by fans' representatives with the aim of raising £100,000 to buy a player for the cash strapped club as the directors themselves were unwilling to invest.
It started enthusiastically but was sadly wound up some time later with the organisers admitting that they hadn't raised anywhere near enough to buy a player but might have enough for a new set of strips.

I think it has more to do with the issue of money. Most people aren't prepared or can't afford to part with such a large sum of money for it to be put straight in Mike Ashley's lap when he runs into the sunset laughing and celebrating with Derek.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Sunday 10 January 2010, 11:57:13 AM
The Times "understands" that 6,000 people have declared intent to support "and the NUST’s financial advisors have cautioned that up to half of the pledges may not be followed through". So this current guess puts the number of potential backers at around 3,000.
“The take-up has been astounding and demonstrates fans have the appetite to back the ‘Yes We Can’ campaign,” a source close to the NUST said last night.

Based on the above figures I would beg to differ. 3,000 is a tiny number considering the club has a fan base of more than 100,000. It means less than 3% of fans prepared to back the scheme meaning it would almost certainly be doomed to failure.
All the above is of course conjecture and hearsay, but possibly not too far wide of the mark and with no real information coming from the NUST theres little else to go on.

We still look forward to hearing the names of the significant local businesses and institutions are who are backing the scheme - now scheduled to be released mid January - let's hope they can save the scheme, but a guesstimate of 3,000 supporters backing it hardly realises the dream of true fan ownership.

I wonder if this could end up like the 1980's buy a player scheme which was a bold campaign started by fans' representatives with the aim of raising £100,000 to buy a player for the cash strapped club as the directors themselves were unwilling to invest.
It started enthusiastically but was sadly wound up some time later with the organisers admitting that they hadn't raised anywhere near enough to buy a player but might have enough for a new set of strips.

I think it has more to do with the issue of money. Most people aren't prepared or can't afford to part with such a large sum of money for it to be put straight in Mike Ashley's lap when he runs into the sunset laughing and celebrating with Derek.

Unless I'm completely missing your point that answer seems a bit ludicrous.
You imply that fans are unwilling to put their money into a "fan led" scheme to buy out the present ownership because the money would.... err... go to the present ownership ??
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: JH on Sunday 10 January 2010, 12:26:05 PM
The Times "understands" that 6,000 people have declared intent to support "and the NUST’s financial advisors have cautioned that up to half of the pledges may not be followed through". So this current guess puts the number of potential backers at around 3,000.
“The take-up has been astounding and demonstrates fans have the appetite to back the ‘Yes We Can’ campaign,” a source close to the NUST said last night.

Based on the above figures I would beg to differ. 3,000 is a tiny number considering the club has a fan base of more than 100,000. It means less than 3% of fans prepared to back the scheme meaning it would almost certainly be doomed to failure.
All the above is of course conjecture and hearsay, but possibly not too far wide of the mark and with no real information coming from the NUST theres little else to go on.

We still look forward to hearing the names of the significant local businesses and institutions are who are backing the scheme - now scheduled to be released mid January - let's hope they can save the scheme, but a guesstimate of 3,000 supporters backing it hardly realises the dream of true fan ownership.

I wonder if this could end up like the 1980's buy a player scheme which was a bold campaign started by fans' representatives with the aim of raising £100,000 to buy a player for the cash strapped club as the directors themselves were unwilling to invest.
It started enthusiastically but was sadly wound up some time later with the organisers admitting that they hadn't raised anywhere near enough to buy a player but might have enough for a new set of strips.

I think it has more to do with the issue of money. Most people aren't prepared or can't afford to part with such a large sum of money for it to be put straight in Mike Ashley's lap when he runs into the sunset laughing and celebrating with Derek.

Unless I'm completely missing your point that answer seems a bit ludicrous.
You imply that fans are unwilling to put their money into a "fan led" scheme to buy out the present ownership because the money would.... err... go to the present ownership ??

I imply that fans can't afford to put money in.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Monday 11 January 2010, 04:42:35 PM
More here:

Dear Supporter

You will be aware that the Yes We Can campaign launched by the NUST
started up again on 6 Jan after the festive break, with the clear
message to the current owners that 'supporters mean business'. The
response to the first e-mail has been astounding with 3 people a
minute (for the first couple of hours) signing up to the campaign for
greater fan say in the way our club is run. Over 1000 people have
signed up on the back of that e-mail and on 15 Jan we'll be announcing
our advisers on our next moves.

Yes We Can and the Trust have one aim - to give supporters a say in
the running of our club and with Newcastle City Council backing that
principle on 13 Jan, we are gathering an unstoppable momentum.

We would ask that you take a couple minutes of your time to fill in
our Survey (10 questions).

This survey will be used to show interested potential partners the
strength of feeling in the city and beyond about the current regime -
the answers you give will form the basis of potential negotiations but
are not binding on you. Its a massive marketing exercise to see if the
fans are up for it.

Complete Survey here
<https://spreadsheets.google.com/viewform?formkey=dE9YYXM0dUtnbmFpNFlaWjN3N1RSZ3c6MA>

Mike Ashley and his sources have made it clear in Sunday's papers that
he has no intention of staying at a club where he is not wanted, but
he wants to stay until the summer. We can only assume that he wants to
recoup all of his investment and more on top. It looks like a sparse
January transfer window, but we live in hope, but to indicate now he
would sell in the summer will destabilise the club before a return to
the premiership (fingers crossed!), and will push up potential
transfer fees.

The Trust has never got into a slanging match with Mr Ashley and Mr
Llambias and neither does it intend to, we're interested in our club
and more importantly its future. One final thought for you to consider
before you fill in the survey - sources have told us that Mr Ashley is
making up to £7m profit out of our club every month and whilst that's
not confirmed - do the maths - wages halved, no expenditure on
transfers, crowds up, new advertising revenue before the end of the
season and the assets of SJP Holdings. Make no mistake - Mr Ashley is
not going to lose on his investment in Newcastle but it's now time to
think about the club, city and community not himself.

Please complete the survey - January and February can make our club
the club we want - it's that close.

If you haven't already signed up and would like to back the Yes We Can
campaign please do so here <http://www.nust.org.uk/yeswecanregister>

Regards

Neil Mitchell

Interim Chair
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: ToonTastic on Monday 11 January 2010, 04:43:01 PM
To be honest i don't feel they will or can get much out of the survey especially that very poor example of a survey.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Monday 11 January 2010, 04:47:14 PM
"The Trust has never got into a slanging match with Mr Ashley and Mr
Llambias and neither does it intend to, we're interested in our club
and more importantly its future. One final thought for you to consider
before you fill in the survey - sources have told us that Mr Ashley is
making up to £7m profit out of our club every month and whilst that's
not confirmed - do the maths - wages halved, no expenditure on
transfers, crowds up, new advertising revenue before the end of the
season and the assets of SJP Holdings.
Make no mistake - Mr Ashley is
not going to lose on his investment in Newcastle but it's now time to
think about the club, city and community not himself."


Sweet Jesus what sources were these? That is the biggest pile of  shyte.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Jill on Monday 11 January 2010, 04:48:51 PM
To be honest i don't feel they will or can get much out of the survey especially that very poor example of a survey.

I did that survey and thought it was pretty s***.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: jdckelly on Monday 11 January 2010, 04:52:16 PM
7m profit per month? sweet jesus they're a bunch of morons if they honestly believe that more like 7m loss per month do they honestly think that the club is poised to make an 84m profit (by multiplying that 7m by 12) thats higher than the clubs projected turnover and what sources out of ashley and co would tell the nust anything?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Monday 11 January 2010, 05:29:37 PM
Bear in mind that the phrase 'up to' £7 million includes the figure zero.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Monday 11 January 2010, 05:39:24 PM
Bear in mind that the phrase 'up to' £7 million includes the figure zero.

FWIW I can't see any way that the club is making any sort of profit on a turnover of about £50m or £60m. In 2008 the club lost £20m on a turnover of £100m, how do you get from there to a profit when your income is about £40m less?

Apart from that IMO it's extremely unprofessional to put unsbstantiated gossip in an email to potential investors and, for me, their credibility is shot to pieces - they have shot themselves in the foot.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: polpolpol on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:03:40 PM
If NUST want to be taken seriously as an organisation, such tortured grammar must be eradicated from any subsequent communications.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: OzzieMandias on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:05:48 PM
Bear in mind that the phrase 'up to' £7 million includes the figure zero.

FWIW I can't see any way that the club is making any sort of profit on a turnover of about £50m or £60m. In 2008 the club lost £20m on a turnover of £100m, how do you get from there to a profit when your income is about £40m less?

Apart from that IMO it's extremely unprofessional to put unsbstantiated gossip in an email to potential investors and, for me, their credibility is shot to pieces - they have shot themselves in the foot.

That and an idiotic survey full of ineptly loaded questions.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Stu on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:07:13 PM
What the hell is this questionnaire about? It was possibly one of the poorly designed sets of questions I've ever seen, are they not bothered about coming across in a well-run and professional light? They're talking about using people's hard-earned pensions and make no genuine attempt to hide their disgust of Ashley.
i.e. Since relegation last season, do you think the current ownership have run the club:

- competently
- incompetently
- awfully
- GET OUT OF OUR CLUB YOU FAT COCKNEY b******
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: michaelfoster on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:08:44 PM
NUST shotting themselves in the foot again, theres no chance this will work, they might aswell end the campaign now before they really end up like a laughing stock
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:12:00 PM
Is it really necessary to state that NUST has never got into a slanging match with Ashley and then proceed to do just that? This is all fine if it's a the work of a pressure group, but if it's a serious attempt to buy the club there needs to be a bit more professionalism.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: jdckelly on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:12:43 PM
Is it really necessary to state that NUST has never got into a slanging match with Ashley and then proceed to do just that? This is all fine if it's a the work of a pressure group, but if it's a serious attempt to buy the club there needs to be a bit more professionalism.
didn't they have an article slagging off llambias a few months ago on their website?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:48:45 PM
7m profit per month? sweet jesus they're a bunch of morons if they honestly believe that more like 7m loss per month do they honestly think that the club is poised to make an 84m profit (by multiplying that 7m by 12) thats higher than the clubs projected turnover and what sources out of ashley and co would tell the nust anything?

And a world record.

Quote

Manchester United
Record profit for United
James Robson

June 04, 2009

 

UNITED have made a world record operating profit for a football club, according to the latest figures announced.

The Premier League champions made £71.8m for the season 2007-8 to put them at the top of the money tree globally.

Their revenue of £257.1m also saw them outperform the rest of their Premier League rivals - with figures suggesting they are bucking the global economic crisis.


http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/manchester_united/s/1118833_record_profit_for_united
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:49:48 PM
:undecided:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:55:46 PM
Actually, if it's making up to £7m a month I don't understand why no one offered him the £100m. :dontknow:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 11 January 2010, 06:58:53 PM
And we'll certainly be nowhere near administration.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Monday 11 January 2010, 07:03:05 PM
And we'd be able to afford to buy Harewood with no difficulty....
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Monday 11 January 2010, 07:09:37 PM
"The Trust has never got into a slanging match with Mr Ashley and Mr
Llambias and neither does it intend to, we're interested in our club
and more importantly its future. One final thought for you to consider
before you fill in the survey - sources have told us that Mr Ashley is
making up to £7m profit out of our club every month and whilst that's
not confirmed - do the maths - wages halved, no expenditure on
transfers, crowds up, new advertising revenue before the end of the
season and the assets of SJP Holdings.
Make no mistake - Mr Ashley is
not going to lose on his investment in Newcastle but it's now time to
think about the club, city and community not himself."


Sweet Jesus what sources were these? That is the biggest pile of  shyte.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

That is f***ing gold tbh. If they're making £7m a month, people would be doing anything to get us for £100m nevermind £80m. How the hell people are taking these seriously is beyond me.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Monday 11 January 2010, 07:11:28 PM
Sorry, I forgot at least they're trying to do something...
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Monday 11 January 2010, 07:19:00 PM
 :lol: I'm seriously wondering if Deadly Derek has arranged for a deliberate leak of mis-information to the NUST to make them look like half wits.

If so it worked a treat Del   O0
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Stu on Monday 11 January 2010, 07:21:30 PM
Such a massive shame, this had all the potential to be something useful for the supporters and the club but, as feared originally and highlighted on these boards (those naysayers who were slated for not getting involved in the NUSCT!!), its just continued to become a barely veiled continuation of the initial attacks on Ashley.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Stu on Monday 11 January 2010, 07:22:15 PM
Sorry, I forgot at least they're trying to do something...

:lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Monday 11 January 2010, 07:26:00 PM
It's ridiculous man. If that's the sort of s*** they're going to come up with to get honest people to put their pensions and thousands of pounds into, then they're equally, if not worse than what we have. That's angered me tbh because it's clearly not true.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Monday 11 January 2010, 07:31:41 PM
Such a massive shame, this had all the potential to be something useful for the supporters and the club but, as feared originally and highlighted on these boards (those naysayers who were slated for not getting involved in the NUSCT!!), its just continued to become a barely veiled continuation of the initial attacks on Ashley.

I registered and was prepared to keep an open mind and wait until I saw what they were about. My mind is now closed..... :thdn:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Benwell Lad on Monday 11 January 2010, 07:37:20 PM
They make Ashley & Co look efficient and credible by comparison.
That is quite a feat.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: binnsy on Monday 11 January 2010, 08:00:34 PM
Can't believe that ridiculous £7m profit quote and can't really see the point of that survey but i'm still willing to lend my support to they're campaign.  Think Friday could be a pivotal day though when the new announcements are made and could be make or break for many people.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 11 January 2010, 08:23:11 PM
(http://www.toontastic.net/comical_dekka/userimages/1263241325.jpg)
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Monday 11 January 2010, 09:39:29 PM
I really can't get over this tbh. I'm not quite shaking with rage but that has seriously angered me that paragraph. Will be interesting to see if there's a reply to the e-mail I sent them with regards to it and how they explain it. It's as if they're taking us for idiots man.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: BottledDog on Monday 11 January 2010, 09:43:57 PM
I think I'd actually worry far more for the future if this lot ever got their hands on the club.

Absolute joke that such a potentially powerful organisation continually make you want to grab them by the sholders and tell them to GROW THE f*** UP! :thdn:

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: bowlingcrofty on Monday 11 January 2010, 09:56:25 PM
Hmmm. Such promise seems to have evaporated in one sentence.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: OzzieMandias on Monday 11 January 2010, 09:59:03 PM
Sorry, I forgot at least they're trying to do something...

:lol:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Monday 11 January 2010, 09:59:54 PM
Is it really necessary to state that NUST has never got into a slanging match with Ashley and then proceed to do just that? This is all fine if it's a the work of a pressure group, but if it's a serious attempt to buy the club there needs to be a bit more professionalism.
didn't they have an article slagging off llambias a few months ago on their website?

They did and I posted somewhere on this thread that I was surprised how hostile it was considering that at some point NUST will be looking to negotiate with Ashley if their plan to buy the club from him pans out. I can't imagine when Moat was trying to buy Newcastle he was slagging Ashley off publicly. Not if he wanted to get the best price possible. If I was a serious business investor I'd be concerned to say the least that this sort of stuff is being published.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Matt on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:04:26 PM
What is SJP Holdings? Do they mean SJHL?

Dear God.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: magorific on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:10:13 PM
We're still paying for half our signings over the last 4-5 years and only now have miniscule TV money and a relatively modest parachute payment to fall back on, so the talk of £7m profit a month is straight from La La Land.
But if anything marks NUST as doomed from the off, it is the semi-literacy of their press releases. If they can't be arsed to a) look through their stuff to make sure it reads properly or b) use a spellchecker, what the f**k would they do when it came to running the club?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:19:40 PM
f***ing hell, £7 million :lol:

I really can't get over this tbh. I'm not quite shaking with rage but that has seriously angered me that paragraph. Will be interesting to see if there's a reply to the e-mail I sent them with regards to it and how they explain it. It's as if they're taking us for idiots man.

You need to calm down.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:21:56 PM
I just don't like the fact they're out Ashleying Ashley when it comes to treating supporters like we're thick.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:23:53 PM
f***ing hell, £7 million :lol:

I really can't get over this tbh. I'm not quite shaking with rage but that has seriously angered me that paragraph. Will be interesting to see if there's a reply to the e-mail I sent them with regards to it and how they explain it. It's as if they're taking us for idiots man.

You need to calm down.

That's good advice. I hope NUST are listening.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:36:10 PM
Hmmm. Such promise seems to have evaporated in one sentence.

Well yes. Whatever they did needed to be good and it needed to be professional. They are intending to relieve people of savings and pensions and negotiate a multi million pound deal with the proceeds. And I have a sneaky suspicion that Ashley isn't the easiest person to negotiate anything with so they also needed to demonstrate that they might be good at negotiating  They have blasted Ashley for the way he has run the club, his communication and for his integrity and in one short email have succeeded in blowing themselves out of the water on every front - a spectacular achievement tbh.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: David Icke - Son of God on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:37:06 PM
I just don't like the fact they're out Ashleying Ashley when it comes to treating supporters like we're thick.

I think that's a bit sensationalist. I haven't seen a concerted effort from NUST to lie to the supporters on a consistant basis.

I get the feeling they've got the remedial w*****s manning the emails because over the past few months their image has improved quite a bit, they're using the media better and they all seem to have a vague idea in which direction the trust is moving however they always seem to send out some ridiculous message to their mailing list with some cringeworthy prose or laughable piece of propaganda. Considering this is their main way of communicating with us and other fans it's simply not good enough.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:39:35 PM
What is SJP Holdings? Do they mean SJHL?

Dear God.

Isn't SJP Holdings the company Ashley formed to buy the club? May be well off with that one, but I've definitely heard of it before.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:45:51 PM
What is SJP Holdings? Do they mean SJHL?

Dear God.

Isn't SJP Holdings the company Ashley formed to buy the club? May be well off with that one, but I've definitely heard of it before.

I think Matt's point is that the company in question isn't called SJP Holdings - it's called St James Holdings Limited (SJHL). They've got the name wrong and their reference to it is nonsensical. And if you are going to enter territory such as this you need to have an eye for detail.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:45:54 PM
I just don't understand why they've come out with this now, when they're apparently only a few days away from revealing their plans and engaging in discussion with the club.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Dave on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:48:33 PM
What is SJP Holdings? Do they mean SJHL?

Dear God.

Isn't SJP Holdings the company Ashley formed to buy the club? May be well off with that one, but I've definitely heard of it before.

I think Matt's point is that the company in question isn't called SJP Holdings - it's called St James Holdings Limited (SJHL). They've got the name wrong and their reference to it is nonsensical. And if you are going to enter territory such as this you need to have an eye for detail.

Oops. I knew I'd read that post wrong.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Monday 11 January 2010, 10:54:18 PM
I just don't understand why they've come out with this now, when they're apparently only a few days away from revealing their plans and engaging in discussion with the club.

That should be interesting. I imagine it will go somewhere along the lines of

"Get out of our club
get out of our cluuub!
you fat cockney b******...
get out of our club"

negotiations should go swimmingly.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:03:02 PM
I just don't understand why they've come out with this now, when they're apparently only a few days away from revealing their plans and engaging in discussion with the club.

It seems that they've struggled to get any serious offers of investment from financial institutions and businesses, and their hope always was that by demonstrating a high level of support for a fans' takeover, that in itself would convince the bigger money to come on board.

It's a pipe dream. They could collect 100,000 emails or surveys which say, 'Yes it would be a good thing if the fans owned the club and I'd like to find out more', but that isn't a demonstration that large numbers of people are prepared to part with large amounts of money. And that is what it would take before any institutions of signficance would want to join in.

The peddling of this £7 million rumour and this last minute survey feels like a desperate attempt to drum up more support. But it makes them looks amateurish and silly.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: johnnypd on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:10:03 PM
i reckon the £7m might have some basis in truth, but not in the way they think. bit like martins allegedly withdrawing all that cash every weekend - he probably did it once. likewise, we may well have made a £7m profit for one individual month in the summer with money coming in on season tickets, transfers etc. it's incredibly unlikely that we're making anything close to that every month.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:12:49 PM
i reckon the £7m might have some basis in truth, but not in the way they think. bit like martins allegedly withdrawing all that cash every weekend - he probably did it once. likewise, we may well have made a £7m profit for one individual month in the summer with money coming in on season tickets, transfers etc. it's incredibly unlikely that we're making anything close to that every month.

It goes further than that though because they've suggested he's making the profit personally "out of the club".

And the season ticket revenue won't all be recognised when it's collected either, it'll be spread over the season.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: quayside on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:23:29 PM
i reckon the £7m might have some basis in truth, but not in the way they think. bit like martins allegedly withdrawing all that cash every weekend - he probably did it once. likewise, we may well have made a £7m profit for one individual month in the summer with money coming in on season tickets, transfers etc. it's incredibly unlikely that we're making anything close to that every month.

Maybe but we'll have made losses in plenty of the other months. If annual turnover is £60m - wages alone are probably still between £40m and £50m, never mind the other running costs, which were £50m in the latest accounts (2008) btw = losses.

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:26:03 PM
Fair play to them on the swift response. Will read it in the morning when I'm less tired to make sense of it.

Quote
The £7m figure comes from a respected company's Investment document
that was used to try to raise investment to buy the Club.

The headline figures in summary are for an investment of £95m and the
document states that they would expect "turn the investment of
£95million into a value of between £150million to £205million on
return to the Premiership.The £205m was top end but a 5% return on
investment would equate to over £84m on the predicted turnover.

Without going into lots of detail it is based on a £42m reduction in
wages (6months), £14m transfer fees received set against a projected
reduction of ticket revenue based on 34,000 crowds.  We are getting
crowds of 43,000 with the subsequent increase in half year season
tickets. Other reductions include  - outsourcing catering, outsourcing
match programmes, reduction of backroom staff by over 200 and still
continuing, the scaling down of the academy, a parachute payment of
£11.25m, decent television income, perimeter advertising of £50,000
per month, recent sponsorship deals etc etc

The perimeter advertising and large Sports Direct sign on the stand
are likely to be free advertising for his business.

One newspaper also came out with this same figure last week.

In the Sunday papers Mr Ashley said that he would not stay where he
was not wanted and would sell in the summer. We think this is why he
is waiting until then.

Since relegation Mr Ashley has invested an alleged £20m and that
figure has never been confirmed and the club has reduced its overdraft
without any significant investment in the playing staff.

Obviously, these figures are on return to the Premiership with the
extra revenue that will entail and we will have to wait to see the
actual published accounts but we think that these figures will stand
up to scrutiny.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:33:44 PM
Fair play to them on the swift response. Will read it in the morning when I'm less tired to make sense of it.

Quote
The £7m figure comes from a respected company's Investment document
that was used to try to raise investment to buy the Club.

The headline figures in summary are for an investment of £95m and the
document states that they would expect "turn the investment of
£95million into a value of between £150million to £205million on
return to the Premiership.The £205m was top end but a 5% return on
investment would equate to over £84m on the predicted turnover.

Without going into lots of detail it is based on a £42m reduction in
wages (6months), £14m transfer fees received set against a projected
reduction of ticket revenue based on 34,000 crowds.  We are getting
crowds of 43,000 with the subsequent increase in half year season
tickets. Other reductions include  - outsourcing catering, outsourcing
match programmes, reduction of backroom staff by over 200 and still
continuing, the scaling down of the academy, a parachute payment of
£11.25m, decent television income, perimeter advertising of £50,000
per month, recent sponsorship deals etc etc

The perimeter advertising and large Sports Direct sign on the stand
are likely to be free advertising for his business.

One newspaper also came out with this same figure last week.

In the Sunday papers Mr Ashley said that he would not stay where he
was not wanted and would sell in the summer. We think this is why he
is waiting until then.

Since relegation Mr Ashley has invested an alleged £20m and that
figure has never been confirmed and the club has reduced its overdraft
without any significant investment in the playing staff.

Obviously, these figures are on return to the Premiership with the
extra revenue that will entail and we will have to wait to see the
actual published accounts but we think that these figures will stand
up to scrutiny.

What swift response? You are posting it second hand from some other source presumably. I still don't understand how all this anti-Ashley stuff from the NUST is going to end in them buying him out which presumably is the point. It is the point isn't it?

Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Optimistic Nut on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:35:15 PM
I'm talking about the quick reply to my e-mail...unless they're getting a few queries about it so now have that as a copy & paste job.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Liam Liam Liam O on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:37:48 PM
Fair play to them on the swift response. Will read it in the morning when I'm less tired to make sense of it.

Quote
The £7m figure comes from a respected company's Investment document
that was used to try to raise investment to buy the Club.

The headline figures in summary are for an investment of £95m and the
document states that they would expect "turn the investment of
£95million into a value of between £150million to £205million on
return to the Premiership.The £205m was top end but a 5% return on
investment would equate to over £84m on the predicted turnover.

Without going into lots of detail it is based on a £42m reduction in
wages (6months), £14m transfer fees received set against a projected
reduction of ticket revenue based on 34,000 crowds.  We are getting
crowds of 43,000 with the subsequent increase in half year season
tickets. Other reductions include  - outsourcing catering, outsourcing
match programmes, reduction of backroom staff by over 200 and still
continuing, the scaling down of the academy, a parachute payment of
£11.25m, decent television income, perimeter advertising of £50,000
per month, recent sponsorship deals etc etc

The perimeter advertising and large Sports Direct sign on the stand
are likely to be free advertising for his business.

One newspaper also came out with this same figure last week.

In the Sunday papers Mr Ashley said that he would not stay where he
was not wanted and would sell in the summer. We think this is why he
is waiting until then.

Since relegation Mr Ashley has invested an alleged £20m and that
figure has never been confirmed and the club has reduced its overdraft
without any significant investment in the playing staff.

Obviously, these figures are on return to the Premiership with the
extra revenue that will entail and we will have to wait to see the
actual published accounts but we think that these figures will stand
up to scrutiny.

Am I reading it wrong or does that last paragraph not just say the rest of that stuff isn't true?
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: jdckelly on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:38:48 PM
Fair play to them on the swift response. Will read it in the morning when I'm less tired to make sense of it.

Quote
The £7m figure comes from a respected company's Investment document
that was used to try to raise investment to buy the Club.

The headline figures in summary are for an investment of £95m and the
document states that they would expect "turn the investment of
£95million into a value of between £150million to £205million on
return to the Premiership.The £205m was top end but a 5% return on
investment would equate to over £84m on the predicted turnover.

Without going into lots of detail it is based on a £42m reduction in
wages (6months), £14m transfer fees received set against a projected
reduction of ticket revenue based on 34,000 crowds.  We are getting
crowds of 43,000 with the subsequent increase in half year season
tickets. Other reductions include  - outsourcing catering, outsourcing
match programmes, reduction of backroom staff by over 200 and still
continuing, the scaling down of the academy, a parachute payment of
£11.25m, decent television income, perimeter advertising of £50,000
per month, recent sponsorship deals etc etc

The perimeter advertising and large Sports Direct sign on the stand
are likely to be free advertising for his business.

One newspaper also came out with this same figure last week.

In the Sunday papers Mr Ashley said that he would not stay where he
was not wanted and would sell in the summer. We think this is why he
is waiting until then.

Since relegation Mr Ashley has invested an alleged £20m and that
figure has never been confirmed and the club has reduced its overdraft
without any significant investment in the playing staff.

Obviously, these figures are on return to the Premiership with the
extra revenue that will entail and we will have to wait to see the
actual published accounts but we think that these figures will stand
up to scrutiny.

Am I reading it wrong or does that last paragraph not just say the rest of that stuff isn't true?
thats what it seems to read to me in which case :facepalm:
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: Cronky on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:43:19 PM
Fair play to them on the swift response. Will read it in the morning when I'm less tired to make sense of it.

Quote
The £7m figure comes from a respected company's Investment document
that was used to try to raise investment to buy the Club.

The headline figures in summary are for an investment of £95m and the
document states that they would expect "turn the investment of
£95million into a value of between £150million to £205million on
return to the Premiership.The £205m was top end but a 5% return on
investment would equate to over £84m on the predicted turnover.

Without going into lots of detail it is based on a £42m reduction in
wages (6months), £14m transfer fees received set against a projected
reduction of ticket revenue based on 34,000 crowds.  We are getting
crowds of 43,000 with the subsequent increase in half year season
tickets. Other reductions include  - outsourcing catering, outsourcing
match programmes, reduction of backroom staff by over 200 and still
continuing, the scaling down of the academy, a parachute payment of
£11.25m, decent television income, perimeter advertising of £50,000
per month, recent sponsorship deals etc etc

The perimeter advertising and large Sports Direct sign on the stand
are likely to be free advertising for his business.

One newspaper also came out with this same figure last week.

In the Sunday papers Mr Ashley said that he would not stay where he
was not wanted and would sell in the summer. We think this is why he
is waiting until then.

Since relegation Mr Ashley has invested an alleged £20m and that
figure has never been confirmed and the club has reduced its overdraft
without any significant investment in the playing staff.

Obviously, these figures are on return to the Premiership with the
extra revenue that will entail and we will have to wait to see the
actual published accounts but we think that these figures will stand
up to scrutiny.

I'll have a go.

This looks like it's based on a document from a few months ago when Ashley was trying to sell the club for £95 million. He is pointing out to potential buyers that if they take the club at that price and then get the club promoted, the club would be worth between £150m and £200m - which is probably correct.

They then point out the cost-cutting measures that are there to ensure the club is financially stable during the 'promotion season', and conclude that if someone makes the purchase, the return in terms of the increased value of the club is likely to be £84 million IF we are promoted. If we don't get promoted, things are still stable.

NUST have taken that figure of £84 million, divided it by 12, and concluded that Ashley is making a profit of £7 million per month. Complete rubbish.

What they are not taking into account is that we have not been promoted, and Ashley has already lost £230 million on his own purchase of the club and by clearing the initial £90 million debt.
Title: Re: NUST launch "Yes We Can" Campaign to buy club
Post by: TRon on Monday 11 January 2010, 11:47:45 PM